I'll be blunter: if Cavan is going to have his head turned by the little bit of hype he's gotten, he was never going to be the player you thought he was anyway. The mental part of the game is huge. If he's got it, this won't matter. If he doesn't, it would have been something else.
There's also another viewpoint - pressure can be a privilege. While it didn't turn out well for Freddy, putting the kid in the limelight for a minute let's him know what the expectations are. Cavan won't be allowed to fade into obscurity. I agree with @ussoccer97531. Clearly it was marketing. But it hasn't been overly excessive, and will probably die down in the next few months as Philly's roster clogs back up with players returning from international duty. We'll probably hear about Cavan with the first team next in preseason of next year.
Getting hype at 18/19/20 years old is likely different mentally than at 14. Although I still generally agree with your thinking.
That’s how I view it. I don’t even have a problem with a little hype. It’s way past a little hype with Cavan. It’s a lot. Despite all that, everything I hear is that his mentality is different from 14 year olds and it won’t deter his success.
I'm sure there was someone on the edge of the mentality at this point where this really hurt them, and no hype would have helped. Maybe Cavan's there and this is a disaster, though the hype train is going to be a little short lived out of USMNT twitter unless he produces. I just think we ignore the person more than we should. I don't think people like Adu and Andrew Carleton were ruined so much as that's likely just who they are, and conversely, someone like LeBron was anointed at like 12 and still is one of the hardest working players in the NBA.
Yeah judging by his age, he should be about to start high school in the next week or so. Being given a 500k salary and being cast into the spotlight at that age is pretty different from experiencing those things post-high school.
He's definitely not having a typical kid experience, but there seem to be some real positives to his situation: - he is with his family in his hometown, getting a incredible dream come true opportunity of playing for the Union with his big brother - his dad is in the organization and can be privy to many of the details of the plan for Cavan - Manchester City is a huge apparatus with really smart football people, and they will have many ways for him to continue his development and several club options for his progression
I agree with a lot of the points and think if he's the superstar he "could" be that like LeBron this won't affect him at all. I also think Philly and MLS know he won't be here long and they don't have that much time to hype but also to make sure the public recognizes in the future that he did start at Philly in MLS. The latter is to help with future players at or near his level.
Cavan Sullivan is from a family that has been in soccer for generations. He already has a brother who is a pro. Even if he fails to live up to the hype he will not be a cautionary tale.
Its a lot................but nowhere near Freddy Adu levels. And also, similar to the hype that these highly regarded prospects in Europe and South America receive. There are whole industries in Europe that revolve around the identification and hyping of these "wonder kids." Just do a search for Lamine Yamal and see what folks were saying about him as a 14 year old. All of the usual suspects were tweeting about him as the "jewel of La Masia" and all that. The Brilliance of Lamine Yamal 2022 || 14 Year-Old - YouTube [I'm not suggesting Cavan is Lamine Yamal.] Hype is just part of the deal now for the American soccer industry. And those of us that are part of the industry, for instance people who tweet about youth prospects and produce content related to these players ( ) are part of the machine. Its an industry. People want to know about it in the same way they want to know who the best high school basketball or American football players are. There's a whole industry that rates them 5 stars or 4 stars recruits and whatnot. Whole industries. . Its OK. Really..............its OK. Hype is OK. Its just weird that on these youth boards we were talking about what a great prospect Cavan Sullivan was for years. Then when he debuted for the Philly first team, and everybody else started talking about him and made a big deal of him....................we were like "whoa, whoa, whoa this is too much." Really? We weret he ones making a big deal about him before this!!! I can look at tweets from accounts I know belong to posters on this forum. I can see what THEY'VE been tweeting about him for years. And now all of a sudden it's a problem that MLS promotes and markets his debut? Of course they're going to do that!!!
If this were a relatively new poster, I would think it is AI programmed to defend anything and everything that USSF and MLS does. It would include such argument approaches like above. Adu was more of a publicity stunt than Cavan, so Cavan can't be a publicity stunt. Playing Cavan a few minutes to get a record is absolutely about publicity. The easiest way for me to understand that is that Adu was more ready for MLS back then than Cavan is now. I have no clue what a gagillion is, but there have been a lot more highly rated kids whose careers didn't work out than those that did.
The only problem with this thinking is the mental side is hardest to assess and if things don't go well it can derail a whole career. It seems like an unnecessary challenge that doesn't really do anything for his game. Just because you view the hype as just a little bit doesn't mean it won't ramp up to ridiculous levels in 6 months. Hopefully, the parents have enough control because anyone who is being honest knows that MLS will do anything they can to market their league.
What makes you think they know what they are doing? What experience do they have with successfully putting a 14/15 year old in a situation like this? The psychology of a 15 year old is some pretty complex shit. Adu and every other young kid who was marketed as great and then tossed is relevant. What is being discussed doesn't have anything to do with development and pathways. The only thing different from those other children is Cavan has a better support network. I vaguely recall you jumping on the hype train of a kid that hasn't amounted to anything.
This is absolutely true but more of a measure of where MLS is than a judgement that Adu was better at 14/15. Adu "might" have been more technical and even perhaps quicker although I'm not sure of either of those. He wasn't close in effort, defense, passing and soccer IQ. Cavan would have also been able to play back then but neither should play as playing either for big minutes is all hype. Adu was forced on DC by MLS because his mother lived there and they wanted the hype and publicity. I think people forget Dallas Burn had the first pick and were going to take but draft Chad Marshall but the league forced them to trade the pick to Dc and forced DC to use it on Adu.
I mostly agree. My point was simply to disagree the federation/MLS employee/cheerleader claim this wasn't a publicity stunt. I probably didn't remember all of the exact details, but it is hard to forget all the typical MLS shenanigans. Just a reminder that they are all pawns.
Every league does this. You make a good point about the cheerleader stuff but with so many players missing he might have gotten a cup of coffee even if no hype was involved. It just made it easier as they needed w few bodies and could get some cheap publicity.
Who are these kids who were "marketed as great and then tossed?" You keep referencing this bullshit. There is very little in common between Adu's situation and Cavan's. Cavan has been on a pathway and progressed along that pathway with many more stops in front of him. Adu went from nothing to DC United with nothing else in front of him -- no pathway, no plan. It's ridiculous to compare the two. As for the people handling Cavan, they consist of his family who have another child successfully navigating a professional career, a father who has a lifetime of experience in the game including the professional game, Ernst Tanner, who has experience in the Bundesliga and at one of the top talent developing clubs in the world, and Manchester City, which has plenty of resources, personnel, and institutional knowledge about the matter. I think they have a decent handle on this. It's weird that you think you know better than them.
My whole thing on this topic is that I fully want all these kids to be talked about. I think the more talk about the youth game the better (generally speaking). I don’t for a second believe Cavan Sullivan shouldn’t be a player that American fans know, but I feel like in general there’s a lot of interest because now the wider sports (and soccer) media is viewing him as the next American soccer star. This started when the Man City stuff came together. Thats when the interest in him ramped up from like 6 to 60. I don’t know if it’s actually good that a 14 year old is a true celebrity now. I think that can actually be a negative. So my issue isn’t that people know Sullivan as the next great American prospect. He is and I think it’s good that more and more people know him as that (because that’s what he is), but I personally did not expect it to ramp up to this level where he’s essentially like the second most famous American soccer player right now after Pulisic. Pat McAfee was interviewing Tanner Tessmann a few weeks ago before the Olympic QF (and let’s be real he had no clue who Tessmann was), and McAfee was trying to argue to Tessmann that American soccer is getting better and I believe referenced Pulisic and Sullivan as why. I think Cavan is bigger in this country right now than McKennie, Reyna, Adams, etc to the casual sports fan. They might not know much about him or even his name, but they’ve probably heard about him and it registers. To me that is just a little much, but obviously none of us are gatekeepers of the degree of hype players get. This stuff takes on a life of its own. As good as I think he is, it’s not like he’s yet Lamine Yamal. He’s still only 14. Has a long way to go to reach his potential. It’s possible Carrizo or Spivey or whoever ends up better than him. Those guys might be names that big American soccer fans know. They probably are somewhat slightly famous, but it’s on steroids with the fame for Cavan. I just think at 14 it doesn’t do anyone any good to be that famous, even if I fully believe he’ll be fine.
Again, there is no need to completely discount Adu. It isnt like DC didnt already have Convey and Quaranta and Gaven at NYRB. The discussion now is about the mental side related hype/marketing/pressure/etc. The league market anything they think people would care about. They have always made a big deal about kids. If you are going to try to limit the time frame at least explain what that time is. Is it when they started academies? After then? It isnt like American soccer players weren't being hyped before MLS started and the result was, many of those chosen players were easy to spot just on how they carried themselves. Everybody knows who is involved. We also know that Philadelphia has never played a kid at this age with this talent. We also know Philadelphia has never produced a player close to level of the potential people claim Cavan has. We also know when Man City signs as many kids as they can and their hit rate is very low. I mean, most people around here are usually pissed when players sign with these big clubs, but for some reason you are trying make them paying pennies for prospect some kid of validation. It is weird you buy in mindlessly. I dont think I know better and the only reason we are having a discussion is the previous statement. I think the path they are taking is about as aggressive as they could and includes many risks to his career (injury, all kinds of mental issues, not building the foundational skills that Americans usually dont). I am just raising those concerns and question if this is the ideal path because I dont see the benefit for taking these risks. The response has been a pack of people that over hype all MLS players telling me an organization that has never done this, knows what they doing.
We're becoming a soccer nation. Its what happens. The "perceived" most talented 14 year olds are known players in Spain or Germany or Argentina. There are whole industries around it. Its just true. I'm sure MLS has metrics that show what types of articles or social media content get the most views and the most engagement. Its not stories about Julian Gressel and Sebastian Lletget. Its probably stories about Messi and then all of these young players. USMNT and American fans are always obsessed about searching for the next generation of stars. I'm sure if you've looked at what kinds of tweets you put out that get the most engagement, those about Cavan Sullivan are up there. Yes, there were "hyped kids" that failed. Also "hyped kids" that ended up being Landon Donovan and Christian Pulisic. I certainly started seeing content about Pulisic's talent when he was a U15. What's bringing attention to Cavan Sullivan is primarily HIS TALENT. We don't need to feel bad about the attention that talent is getting. That's sort of the whole point of MLS Next, MLSNP, etc. Sullivan is advancing up the chain based on his talent, and its garnering attention and "hype." And tha'ts OK. That's the way its supposed to work.
Strange to include LD. There aren't many better examples of American soccer players falling short of their potential as him and didn't he have some significant mental issues. If Cavan doesn't reach LD's level, it would be even a bigger example of failure.
I think there is a bunch of selective posturing going on in this discussion. If anyone thinks there are 14 year olds anywhere in the world getting the level of hype and off field responsibilities as Cavan is right now, they are flat out wrong. Clubs around the world go out of their way to protect young prodigies (at 16,17,18, much less 14) and do not parade them about at this age. If I am wrong, someone please name one. The difference is, we don’t have clubs here to provide the protection. The teams have no ability to tell the league to ******** off. We have a league that is so desperate for attention, they unfairly burden a 14 year old to help. If he were under the wing of Curtain and Tanner, I wouldn’t worry at all, they could shield him. But he’s not, he has a MLS contract and they will squeeze all the juice out of the lemon.