The Brilliance of bringing in the Chivas

Discussion in 'MLS: News & Analysis' started by jmeissen0, Oct 22, 2003.

  1. jmeissen0

    jmeissen0 New Member

    Mar 31, 2001
    page 1078
    Peter Wilt nailed it on the head for the U.S. Open Cup Final. However, the U.S. Soccer Federation is run by nitwits living off of Star Trek re-runs and conventions.

    But the good news is that MLS gets it.

    We are talking about expanding MLS into the one key graphic that we haven't been able to get any sort of a grasp of:

    Mexicans of any kind in this country... descendants, illegals, green card holders, whatever.

    We can talk all the racist thoughts of how this is wrong... just check the threads around here on the topic of a Chivas USA.

    But it's so perfect, it's insane to think they are actually going to do it.

    This country is a gigantic market place that everyone wants to get their foot in. So let them. We are still talking about soccer in this country. Our league and it's sustainability.


    Think of it this way, LA is about to go from the most hated team to the second most hated team. Every game, every U.S. player on the field is going to go out and try to destroy Chivas.

    We're talking about bringing passion into this league. For the fans, for the players, for the investors and for the advertisers.

    Sounds absolutely ideal to me. Why anyone would attempt to destroy something that will cause some major movement in this league is beyond me.

    Please keep living in your white suburban community, spending your weekends going to star trek conventions. Spock is still alive, he is just on Romulus and is starting a revolution there. You can join him!!
  2. red&black1

    red&black1 New Member

    Mar 8, 2003
    Kearny NJ
    I see absolutley nothin wrong with Chivas coming into the MLS... whatever helps this league grow is a good thing. Now what i dont like is MLS bending the rules for Chivas to be able to field more SIs and what not. That just shows a weak league going against its word to make money.
  3. TheSlipperyOne

    TheSlipperyOne Member+

    Feb 29, 2000
    Arsenal FC
    Down with Chivas!
  4. kpaulson

    kpaulson New Member

    Jun 16, 2000
    Washington DC
    Damn mr. j-- I took you to be mellower than that, but I agree.

    I will hate Chivas USA with a passion. I will support LA, the Metros and (ulp) even Dallas against CHivas USA. Any favors the league does for them couldn't be any worse than what some people think is done for the Metros (though I don't want the league to get into legal trouble). The bottom line is sustainability and I think people are forgetting how precarious our situation still is. MLS will remain an American league regardless of one team, just like MLB remains an American sport.
  5. Anthony

    Anthony Member+

    United States
    Aug 20, 1999
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Die goat shaggers die!!!

    (There, is that enough passion for you)
  6. FlashMan

    FlashMan Member

    Jan 6, 2000
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't get your sudden obsession/analogies with Star Trek. This is the second time you've used it and neither time did it make any sense for me.
  7. ProfZodiac

    ProfZodiac Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jan 17, 2003
    Boston, MA
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As long as San Diego Armada (I just can't bring myself to call them Chivas USA) is under the same exact rules the rest of the teams are, I will support them against LA and SJ. Against anyone else, however, down with 'em.
  8. Etienne_72772

    Etienne_72772 Member+

    Oct 14, 1999
    I suppose I don't rank as uber-geeky, since I don't understand that Klingonese. But, sadly, I do understand what "Shaka, when the walls fell" means--so that places me firmly in the "geeky" camp.
  9. jmeissen0

    jmeissen0 New Member

    Mar 31, 2001
    page 1078
    star trek = a niche community that does not seek out growth

    they are happy with where it's at and so no real reason to do anything about expanding

    to expand in our country, we have to grab from everywhere... families, diehards, ethnic communities... you name it

    this would be a fantastic way to reach out to an entirely new community... much unlike the community that bigsoccer caters
  10. greatscott

    greatscott Member+

    Dec 21, 2002
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think that if chivas comes and wants more SI's let them ONLY have mexican's as their foreign players.
    Therefore when they come play DC, some El Salvadoreans etc.. will come to rfk to defend their countrymen against the 30k mexican fans there rooting for chivas.

    wishful thinking
  11. FlashMan

    FlashMan Member

    Jan 6, 2000
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    thanx for the explanation. i always thought star trek went way beyond it's original niche and expanded far beyond its original audience. i could be wrong. i do know the "conventions" were for the most devoted and geek-like.

    i don't know how i feel about chivas usa. i go to a lot of galaxy games and i'm used to a huge - a large majority - of hispanics being at games, so i don't always see that "hispanic outreach" is a #1 priority, though i'm sure it is.

    if they do it right, i'm all for it, and hope it's in san diego (where it should be called san diego chivas, not chivas usa), where i can attend even more MLS action. but i don't want them breaking every player personnel rule in the book just to squeeze them into single entity. that would be way too big of a break from the norm for my tastes.
  12. ne plus ultra

    ne plus ultra Member

    Jul 9, 2000
    The working title for the team is 'La Reconquista,' meaning the Reconquest.

    Guevara, or whatever his name is, has much bigger plans than just soccer. Some of you may not know that he intends to buy the Padres and shut them down, the way General Motors did with the LA mass transit system, to get rid of a competitor.

    He's also been purchasing water rights so that people in Los Angeles and San Diego will no longer be able to water their lawns. Faced with a choice of brown, parched grass or those quirky rock gardens with Saguaros, the few remaining Anglos in the area will depart in aesthetic anguish.

    Then, he's going to purchase three Congressmen and a US Senator from California (you can pick such things up on e-bay if you have the premier membership), and use his ownership of political assets to further his nefarious ends.

    Ultimately, he aims at nothing short of Mexican domination of all the territory the US stole from Mexico in the 1840's. He believes the Mexicans had stolen it fair and square from the Indians, and that wealthy Mexicans were deprived of their natural right to exploit poorer Mexicans in the region, a right he intends to reclaim from the wealthy American usurpers.
  13. galperin

    galperin Member

    Feb 1, 2001
    Maineville, OH
  14. kpaulson

    kpaulson New Member

    Jun 16, 2000
    Washington DC
    Thank god for American patriots like yourself for drawing our attention to all this. Do you have a link?
  15. bostonsoccermdl

    bostonsoccermdl Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 3, 2002
    Denver, CO
    I dont think you can argue that most poster on BS, (minus some foreigners) dont want what is best for the MLS league and Chivas will help when you look at the bottom line as far as $$$ and increased viewership..

    The arguement stems on how far MLS should bend over for The new owner and his ever-increasing list of demands and whims....

    I think a line has to be drawn somewhere short of acceptaing absurd terms. He is borderline now...
  16. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
  17. Autogolazo

    Autogolazo BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 19, 2000
    Bombay Beach, CA
    Jorge Vergara is whimsical--his lack of commitment to a long-term investment is the problem, not Chivas' make-up on the field.

    He's already proven he can't be taken at his word--are you really willing to bet the league's stability on a pill-pushing sleaze? How many more contractions can the league take?

    Oh, he'll bed Garber alright, but he won't be calling back the next day.
  18. JCUnited

    JCUnited Member

    Oct 7, 2002
    South Bend, IN
    Manchester United FC
    So far, nothing OFFICIAL has been announced by MLS concerning Chivas being treated special and allowed to bend the rules. Until something OFFICIAL is said, let's just give the rumors as much thought as a rumor deserves and look at what we do know.

    There is a man, with some wealth, who is already in charge of a hugely popular club in Mexico, that has passionate football (using the accepted term for the game in Mexico) fans within this country, who wants to invest in our league. Let him bring his money over the border. As long as the rumors are not true, they can be a big boon to MLS (reasons have already been given in first post).

    Until something actually happens or is officially declared by Garber and Co. as happening, I won't get my panties wrinkled.

    *note--I do not wear panties
    **second note--Enjoy my Star Trek (own all original episodes, all cartoon episodes, and all Next Generation episodes), but have never nor will ever go to a convention, nor dress up in my home unless it gets Mrs. United hot.
  19. kpaulson

    kpaulson New Member

    Jun 16, 2000
    Washington DC
  20. kpaulson

    kpaulson New Member

    Jun 16, 2000
    Washington DC
    Well, it would be like he bedded Garber but Garber got a ring and a pre-nup before.

    He hasn't proven to be a liar at all-- just very scattershot with his negotiating strategy.
  21. Arisrules

    Arisrules Member

    Feb 19, 2000
    Washington, DC
    I agree it's a super idea, as long as Vergara plays by MLS rules. I also wouldn't mind seeing them in LA. As I said before, you would get the more english speaking crowd for the Galaxy, while Chivas de Los Angeles would be strictly spanish speaking crowd. That would be intense for that rivalry, and the rest of the league. Look people, the reality is that our league at times is just too timid. I think it could help out.

    Maybe Vergara will build his own stadium...
  22. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Actually, I think that this has been one of the greatest sales job in recent history.

    Let's look at facts of the story:
    1. Jorge Vergara, owner of Chivas, wants to invest in Major League Soccer and place a team in San Diego.
    2. Vergara's underling Sisniega starts running his yap to every single Spanish-language media outlet in this country about how the San Diego Goats are going to be a Spanish-speaking team and are going to be exclusively Hispanic.
    3. Vergara himself denies those stories in the English media and says that the Goats will be a conventional MLS team.
    4. Trey Fitz-Gerald, MLS' spokesman, denies those stories, also in the English media and says that the Goats will be a conventional MLS team.
    5. Countless BigSoccer posters freak out about #2, ignoring #3 and #4. BigSoccer's advertisers appreciate all the traffic that the discussion of this topic is generating.
    Now, let's suppose that #2 never happened. It would be an interesting story and most people would be looking forward to having a new investor and a new team. But the buzz about it would be considerably less.

    But by having Sisniega saying the things that he is, he accomplishes two things: First, because all of these proclamations are in the Spanish media, he's pumping up the San Diego Goats with their target demographic. It's not just another gringo team, it's your team. Second, on the off-chance that the English media takes note, it gets his new team even more buzz, or should I say "notoriety." Hey, the WWE's bad guys sell t-shirts, too.

    But in the realm of reality, the question is if you believe what the underling is saying or if you believe, well, just about everyone else.

    Personally, I'm believing just about everyone else. For one thing, if the Goats were to try what Sisniega says they're going to do, then MLS would be in federal court -- again -- faster than you could say, "racial discrimination." I'm just guessing that the league and its investors are pretty happy to not be spending money defending themselves in court against disgruntled players. Moreover, between legal costs and an almost-certain judgement against them, any money that Vergara would be investing would quickly be up in smoke.

    For another thing, it would be stupid thing for them to do from a soccer perspective. Because of the salary cap and the draft and the distribution of allocations, the difference in talent between MLS teams is razor-thin. Look how far the team with the third-best record in the league in 2002 has fallen in 2003. Most MLS coaches would cheat their mothers to get that ever-so-slight edge over their competitors. So does it make sense to limit your talent search to only one racial demographic, while every other team is signing players from several different racial groups? Of course not.

    The fact that he's not making the proclamations himself and the fact that his people are making them in only the Spanish-language media is very telling. It could mean that his people are revealing what he really wants to do, but are trying to keep it "under the radar" by keeping it in the Spanish media, but I don't think so. If Vergara were really interested in doing the things that his people are saying, then he would just say those things himself, which he's not doing.

    Don't forget, this is a guy that knows how to sell tickets. Remember the All-Star Game? On the surface, it had the makings of a pretty dull exhibition. The MLS All-Stars against a mediocre Mexican club team. Yawn. But then, he started talking to the media. He hit all the buttons -- US vs. Mexico, revenge for the World Cup quarterfinal, we're coming here to win, etc. etc.

    The next thing you know, everyone is getting wound up about the All-Star Game. Remember all the fretting about whether the Chivas players were going to go out of their way to injure MLS players? And remember all the people saying, "This is probably the first All-Star Game I'll watch"? There was real juice to it. But when the game came and went, it was more competitive than your usual All-Star Game, but not any more than your usual league match.

    My prediction: When it's all said and done, the San Diego Goats will look no different than any other MLS team. Will they have a Mexican player or two? Sure. Will they have a couple more Latino players than, say, the Columbus Crew? Sure. But in the end, they won't be any different from the Los Angeles Galaxy.

    In the meantime, though, Sr. Vergara is gonna get plenty of free pub for his new team from the outrage or shock or whatever in the English media. His people are gonna keep stroking his target demographic in the Spanish media and keep getting them hyped about his new team. But I think that what his people are saying and what he'll actually end up doing are two different things.

    A new MLS team with lots of advance hype -- what will they think of next?
  23. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
  24. italchacao

    italchacao New Member

    Mar 18, 2002
    Austin TX
    as long as #2 does not happen I will not be outraged, I will just hate them.
  25. Bob Morocco

    Bob Morocco Member+

    Aug 11, 2003
    Billings, MT
    El Jefe's post is so well thought out that I must have already said that in one of the countless other Chivas threads, it's so clever that I can't believe we're the only two to have considered it. I also can't believe all the posters with sand in their vaginas because some mid-management douche said the Mexicans are coming, the Mexicans are coming in Spanish. When someone important says, "MLS will be Chivas's bitch", in English, in America, then let the bitching commence. How does MLS make their decisions, aren't they socialists(not under a dictator but under each other)? Why the fvck would AEG let Chivas operate under special rules if they're paying customers are uniformly against it. Vergara will be at the mercy of St. Phil's will, and Phil will make sure as *#*#*#*# he gets what he wants.

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