Bryce Harper and Manager Matt Williams Ejected After Harper Steps Out of Box "I don't think 40,000 people came to watch him ump today, plain and simple."
I do always say that the ones who did the best jobs are the ones whose names I don't recognize or haven't heard before. Since then, I've tried (but failed) to remember the names of the good ones. Maybe the pool is just so small that we've been over-exposed to the weaknesses in the capabilities of the most prevalent refs.
I fail to see how this is an issue. Was it a bad call? Sure, that happens. Did Harper try to show up a ump in front of 40,000 fans with his little baby step into the box? Yes Did Harper deserve to get tossed? Most definitely
"You are entirely correct coach. I'm pretty sure they came to watch the players play a fair game. Please let me get back to making sure that happens"
I went to see Southampton - QPR this season, and had to listen to the guy sitting behind me repeat over and over again that "Nobody's come to see you referee today, Clattenburg!" Little did he know how wrong he was
I've heard the term "baby steps" repeated several times today. Where did that come from? I'm not sure I agree with the order of events that some are using in defense of what happened. The pitch was low and called a strike by the umpire, Marvin Hudson. Bryce Harper kept a foot back while questioning the call. There's nothing wrong with that. That's common and I would encourage any player to do that not to show up the umpire, but to communicate with the umpire while showing the pitcher you are not ready. That is not considered leaving the box and is specifically allowed. It also makes it easier to ask other umps for the call. At this point, the manager is also arguing the call from the dugout. Harper then steps back out of the box and is violation of the batters box rule* (which is being sporadically emphasized more now with MLB's pace of play emphasis since they somehow believe it's the gameplay that slows down games and not the commercial creep). The violation is normally nothing more than a warning. A second warning could result in greater punishment from the league. In the past, if egregious, the ump would allow the pitcher to continue with the batter out of the box. However Harper comes back to the plate as the ump requests. (I'm not sure if this is what people are calling "baby steps.") Even with arguing that is done under his breath and not making a scene, Harper is ready at bat within about 10 seconds from the time of the called strike. Meanwhile the umpire is not paying attention to the at bat and is in a shouting match with the manager, Matt Williams. I'm not sure if this is where some people confuse the order of events as it appeared the umpire may have. Harper left the box after the umpire left to argue with the manager. There's no reason to be in the box at this point. While Hudson is shouting at Williams, Hudson turns his attention to Harper again. In the heat of the moment, I hope and believe Hudson forgot Harper was ready to bat before Hudson walked from behind the plate. At this point it's clear the argument is about being in the batter's box. After the game, Hudson also said the ejection had nothing to do with the batter's box. As I noted above, the violation is not an offense for ejection. The video does not back his post-game remarks though. Obviously Harper began to lose it as he was being ejected. I never condone that. The chain of events leading to the ejections were very strange. I have no problem with Williams being ejected. That could and should have been the first ejection. It may not be a popular sentiment here, but the Harper ejection may have been a punishment for the actions of Williams. * It did not appear Hudson had a great problem with the steps backward and resetting by Harper after contesting the call. While technically a violation, it is often still very common and allowed as long as there aren't several adjustments to gloves, helmets, bats, etc that may slow down play. Hudson allowed this several times even last night.
He told Harber twice to enter the box after arguing with the manager. Harper walked to the edge of the box and poked a toe slightly into the box as to say, "Ha, I'm in the box" It was a childish, classless move. Not to mention All of this is subsequent to dropping the F bomb on the ump.
You're free to have your own interpretation of the events. I thought it was fairly obvious Harper was saying and showing he had been in the box not that he was at the moment.
Ummm, since they hinge on every ball/strike call, I could make an argument that they came to at least hear what he thinks today.
But why would that matter? At that moment, he wasn't in the box. The ump told him twice to get in the box. The fact that he had been in the box earlier is completely irrelevant.
Because the umpire was not behind the plate. The chain of events was bizarre. Umpires don't walk away from behind the plate during at bats.
Again, even if the ump isn't behind the plate (he was two steps away), it is completely irrelevant that Harper was in the box before his manager made an ass of himself. Harper should have been tossed the moment he dropped the f bomb while arguing balls and strikes.
Again? I questioned what you interpreted as a "baby step" and gave an account of what took place noting that Harper argued with the ref under his breath so it wouldn't be a scene. What I believe you attempt to explain as the "baby step" "to show up a ump in front of 40,000 fans" became I shared what I believe happened and that it was not a taunt, but an explanation of events. Instead of saying "Ha, I'm in the box," he was pointing out the indentations from where he had been in his stance. The batter is not normally in the box before the pitcher is on the mound or the umpire is behind the plate. There is no reason to be in the box at that point. If not about Harper previously being in the box while Hudson allowed himself to become distracted by Williams, that makes the case for Hudson worse.
I agree with you, there is no reason for a batter to need to stay in the box when the HP walks away from the circle to engage with a coach, scorer, etc. Not sure Sport Billy has seen much baseball in this regard
@Sport Billy IMO this is not relevant here and should be moved to the Baseball NSR forum. I understand the similarity between an umpire and a soccer referee, but I don't think this topic relates to soccer.
They use sticks and a hard ball, so it's kind of like lacrosse, except all the players just sit or stand in one position for most of the game.
I only saw the highlights on SportsCenter, but he was way out of the box in the clips I saw. The clip showed him take a few steps towards the box, then stick his toe in the box. Maybe the umpire could have been slightly more lenient with him, but he and his manager had already upped the temperature of the situation to the point where an ejection was always going to be imminent. Baseball doesn't have yellow and red cards, but if it did, surely Harper would have got his first for arguing the call, and his second for baseball's equivalent of "showing a lack of respect for the game."
I believe what he was trying to get to was that after the initial call of a strike. Harper just backed one foot out of the box while he barked at the ump. Then when the Manager started barking from the dugout and the ump left HIS stance to bark back at the dugout, Harper then fully left the box. He was outside when the ump told him to get back in. Then Harper copped an attitude and stuck his foot in. Kick them all out. You wonder where some American fans get how you could berate an official on the field?? Watch baseball, thankfully I have yet to be chest bumped by a manager after he turns his hat around. Utter nonsense, they should all get jacked!! I like how the video above they start blurring the lips from the manager and the Ump, not before I can see the manager say thet was "F'in horse Sh$#%"
Anyway, the idea that the best sports official is the one you don't talk about has always been little more than rhetorical diarrhoea. If there were no decisions to talk about it almost always means there were no challenging decisions to be made in the first place.
The full video is on the MLB website. That video is embedded on the page that is linked to in the first post. Harper was only way out when the manager and umpire were shouting at each other. Likewise, the pitcher was off of the mound. There was no reason to be in the batter's box or on the mound at that point. It became a dead ball situation when the umpire left his stance, removed his mask and took steps from behind plate toward the dugout to shout at the manager. The best case scenario for the umpire is that in the heat of the moment he forgot that the batter and pitcher were ready for the at bat. Any other explanations (or what can be seen in the video) are less forgiving for the umpire. There is no reason to rush the batter in a dead ball situation when the pitcher isn't even on the mound. If the umpire did not acknowledge that it was a dead ball situation when he left the area to have a shouting match with the manager, he is wrong for that. While in a shouting match with the manager, the umpire turned his attention back to Harper being out of the batter's box after he warned him earlier. This was a dead ball situation. There was no reason to be in the batter's box. Harper pointed at where he had dug into his stance before the dead ball. He then put his foot in the dirt where he was in his stance. He wasn't sticking his foot in the box to be cute and/or step up for the at bat. The best case scenario for the umpire is that he forgot the batter and pitcher being ready before he chose to argue with the manager and was explaining that Harper was still in violation before the dead ball. There are many reasons why the entire situation was bizarre. It was in no way a normal situation from the umpire or the manager.
Look at his body language. I disagree. Who the hell watches baseball anyway? And why is this relevant to soccer at all?
How the heck do you get thrown out of a game BEFORE it starts?....only in baseball: http://www.latimes.com/sports/sport...-reds-bryan-price-ejected-20150523-story.html I love threads showing the difference in officiating between sports. Can you imagine turning on your TV and learning from the announcers that Ben Olsen was tossed before a game for arguing with one of the AR's about an offside call in a previous match?