The best players of the 1986 World Cup

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by comme, Jan 24, 2013.

  1. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
    I have reviewed Ayache's scores in the France Football, Mundo Deportivo and Marca newspapers, as I did a few months. The average of this player performing the same calculation is 6.61. Marca and France Football rated it slightly better than Mundo Deportivo.
     
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  2. wm442433

    wm442433 Member+

    Sep 19, 2014
    Club:
    FC Nantes
    Thanks. Then, is 6.61 good or not (I have no idea)?
     
  3. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
  4. wm442433

    wm442433 Member+

    Sep 19, 2014
    Club:
    FC Nantes
    #129 wm442433, Jan 6, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2020
    Ok.
    Ayache FF ratings only :
    Canada (did not play, Tusseau did, 3) - Soviet Union (4) - Hungary (4) - Italy (4) - Brazil (did not play as suspended/ 2 yellows, Tusseau did, 4, playing DM at the start then LB*) - West Germany (3)
    Belgium (Bronze medal match, did not play).

    Tusseau also entered at the 75' against Italy (not rated) instead of Fernandez (5). The score was 2-0 since the 57'.
    Tusseau's 4 against Brazil is an "inflated 3" in my view, once the team was reorganized (and this since Platini-Giresse both have a 3 in this one, wich perhaps are like "inflated 2 or 2,5 even if it doesn't exist" due to victory... Platini scored the equalizer still... on his birthday btw... while missing that pk had no incidence in the end, thanks to Bats).
    Tusseau adapted and shown good will wich was saluted by this 4, I guess. While Platini and Giresse were below their standard of the past years, below the standard of what is expected from offensive midfielders of this level (when a 3 means average) and if they were actually trying things of course, they were not incisive at all. An average/ ordinary Platini is a 4 (good) I mean, so it's really a little 3, but anyway. Having 3 with one goal scored means it too.
    34 years old Giresse, tho. Platini like Rummenigge, 30-31, playing in Italy.

    http://www.everyfourthyear.se/1986/ There's no ratings for the 3rd place match wich is possible choice from FF. Dunno. Perhaps already discussed in the thread, I'll see.

    In the post #20 (average ratings taken from footballratings blogspot I guess), Ayache occupies a honourable place too, although behind quite numerous defenders (although quite surprinsingly ahead of others too, like Bossis or Brown!) but again that is most of all to say that he was the "very good surprise" of this team as a new addition to it (and being not transparent in these rankings is quite reassuring, he also must not come far behind Vercauteren who closes the list you Titanlux have posted on the previous page).
    Then the semi-finals have been more difficult for him with probably a lack of rythm for this match and as Platini-Giresse were definitively out of form and unefficient at this stage of the competition (Rocheteau was missing too, so there was no pivot upfront). As for what Ayache would have done against Brazil we can't know obviously. If Brazil doesn't score as soon in the match, perhaps it's not the same outcome too.

    * just to precise this, by passing : Fernandez started at RB, as a plan to block Branco and Tusseau at DM (while Amoros was at the LB position) but it did not work at all, on the contrary. Then Fernandez was repositionned at midfield, Amoros took the right side and Tusseau the left side of the defense for better balance and efficiency, defensively to start with then offensively with more possession (against like 0% in the beginning of the match) and better transition to the attack. Well, for a better balance in sum. But we can see that the absence Ayache meant problems to the NT coach with that "false good idea" of the start of the match. Not sure that he would have planned it if Ayache was not suspended. More probably it would have been the same back-4 as against Italy (Ayache RB).
     
  5. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
    A statistic from Kepes magazine.
    Kepes sport 1987 #05-013-013.jpg
     
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  6. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
  7. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
    I guess yes...
     
  8. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
    I have added the ratings of the Argentine magazine "Solo Fútbol" to the above. These would be the most significant averages with some changes that would also affect a hypothetical ideal team based on these averages.

    Maradona 9,15
    Brown 8,01
    Amorós 7,91
    Goicoechea 7,76
    Burruchaga 7,73
    Bossis 7,70
    Ruggeri 7,64
    Elkjaer Larsen 7,63
    Careca 7,54
    Laudrup 7,47
    Fernández 7,46
    Cucciuffo 7,44
    Olsen, Morten 7,44
    Josimar 7,43
    Butragueño 7,31
    Tigana 7,31
    Valdano 7,29
    Pumpido 7,23
    Lerby 7,19
    Briegel 7,18
    Víctor 7,15
    Pfaff 7,14
    Camacho 7,10
    Battiston 7,07
    Hoddle 7,05
    Stopyra 7,04
    Ceulemans 7,03
    Yaremchuk 7,03
    Julio César 6,97
    Belanov 6,96
    Negrete 6,94
    Carlos 6,92
    Zaki 6,90
    Míchel 6,90
    Bats 6,90
    Berthold 6,89
    Lineker 6,85
    Cabañas 6,84
    Kuznetsov 6,84
    Aleinikov 6,83
    Sansom 6,82
    Rats 7,81
    Brehme 6,80
    Forster 6,78
    Shilton 6,77
    Alemao 6,77
    Elzo 6,75
    Butcher 6,73
    Batista 6,73
    Quirarte 6,72

    Pumpido; Cucciuffo o Josimar, Brown, Goicoechea o Bossis, Amorós; Luis Fernández, Tigana, Burruchaga, Laudrup; Maradona, Elkjaer Larsen
     
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  9. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    La Stampa's XI of the World Cup:
    [​IMG]
    Pfaff (Belgium); Josimar (Brazil), K-H Forster (W.Germany), Brown (Argentina), Amoros (France); Burruchaga (Argentina), Yakovenko (USSR), Ceulemans (Belgium), Matthaus (W.Germany); Belanov (USSR), Maradona (Argentina)
    Mentions/subs: Zaki (Morocco), Julio Cesar (Brazil), Alemao (Brazil), Lineker (England), Laudrup (Denmark)
     
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  10. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Clarification: it's the XI of the Italian media as a whole, not only La Stampa's XI.
     
  11. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Further clarification: the press (newspapers) of Italy I mean, but I think it's those (or a selection of those) who handed out ratings, which in this year wouldn't include La Stampa itself (I just noticed they had published the team and at first had thought it was their own).

    There are some differences (so presumably different/additional sources included) as compared to what's on Football-Ratings Blogspot though
    Football Ratings: Average ratings World Cup 1986. (football-ratings.blogspot.com)
    An XI on average ratings shown there would be like this instead I suppose:
    Pfaff; Josimar or perhaps Bessonov, Kuznetsov, Julio Cesar, Briegel; Arnesen, Yarumchuk, Lerby, Bouderbala; Elkjaer, Maradona
    Subs: Zaki, Ruggeri, Yakovenko, Careca, Laudrup or Belanov (or maybe both with no Yakovenko).
     
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  12. TomNeil

    TomNeil Member

    São Paulo FC
    Brazil
    May 7, 2021
    I apologize in advance because the first image is not legible and I couldn't get a better one. El Grafico Magazine : - )
     

    Attached Files:

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  13. TomNeil

    TomNeil Member

    São Paulo FC
    Brazil
    May 7, 2021
  14. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
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  15. Krokko

    Krokko Member

    Nov 16, 2011
    Club:
    AIK Solna
    Nat'l Team:
    Sweden
    I'm posting the average ratings team by team on my blog these days. Sources are Guerin Sportivo, La Stampa and El Mundo Deportivo.

    Some averages (min. 3 rated games, exc. teams eliminated in first round where 2 is enough):

    Belgium
    6,68 Jean-Marie Pfaff
    6,58 Jan Ceulemans
    6,37 Eric Gerets
    6,35 Patrick Vervoort
    6,25 Franky Vercauteren
    6,12 Enzo Scifo, Georges Grün
    6,09 Nico Claesen
    6,05 Michel Renquin
    5,98 Stéphane Demol
    5,83 Daniel Veyt
    5,69 Franky Van Der Elst

    Brazil
    7,00 Careca
    6,78 Josimar
    6,66 Júlio César
    6,54 Carlos
    6,46 Elzo
    6,44 Alemão
    6,38 Júnior
    6,30 Zico (only 2 rated app.)
    6,27 Sócrates
    6,22 Müller
    6,19 Edinho
    5,96 Branco
    5,21 Casagrande

    Italy
    6,62 Fernando De Napoli, Alessandro Altobelli
    6,44 Salvatore Bagni
    6,12 Bruno Conti
    6,06 Gaetano Scirea
    5,94 Pietro Vierchowod
    5,88 Antonio Cabrini, Giuseppe Galderisi
    5,83 Giuseppe Bergomi, Gianluca Vialli
    5,81 Antonio Di Gennaro
    5,56 Giovanni Galli

    Morocco
    6,98 Badou Zaki
    6,91 Aziz Bouderbala
    6,65 Abderrazak Khairi
    6,60 Mohamed Timoumi
    6,29 Labid Khalifa, Abdelmajid Lamriss
    6,16 Abdelmajid Dolmy
    6,13 Mustafa El Biyaz
    6,07 Mustafa El Haddaoui
    6,05 Mustafa Merry
    5,98 Noureddine Bouyahyaoui
    5,91 Abdelkrim Merry "Krimau"

    Poland
    6,23 Zbigniew Boniek
    6,17 Włodzimierz Smolarek
    5,98 Józef Młynarczyk
    5,94 Marek Ostrowski, Jan Urban
    5,92 Andrzej Buncol
    5,81 Roman Wójcicki
    5,80 Jan Karaś
    5,73 Stefan Majewski
    5,71 Dariusz Dziekanowski
    5,56 Kazimierz Przybyś
    5,37 Waldemar Matysik
    5,32 Krzysztof Pawlak
    5,20 Ryszard Komornicki

    Scotland
    6,50 Gordon Strachan
    6,38 Jim Leighton
    6,12 Willie Miller
    6,03 Richard Gough
    5,99 Roy Aitken
    5,96 Maurice Malpas
    5,92 Graeme Souness
    5,62 Paul Sturrock
    5,61 David Narey
    5,57 Steve Nicol

    Portugal
    6,42 António Sousa
    6,33 Carlos Manuel
    6,25 Jaime Pacheco
    6,08 Diamantino
    6,00 Futre
    5,92 Frederico
    5,88 Vítor Damas
    5,83 Augusto Inácio
    5,67 Álvaro, Oliveira
    5,62 André
    5,42 Fernando Gomes
     
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  16. Krokko

    Krokko Member

    Nov 16, 2011
    Club:
    AIK Solna
    Nat'l Team:
    Sweden
    Englands average ratings (Guerin Sportivo, La Stampa, El Mundo Deportivo and El Gráfico):

    6,70 Peter Beardsley
    6,58 Gary Lineker
    6,49 Glenn Hoddle
    6,44 Peter Shilton
    6,39 Terry Butcher
    6,28 Steve Hodge
    6,24 Kenny Sansom
    6,09 Peter Reid
    6,06 Trevor Steven
    5,95 Gary M. Stevens
    5,81 Terry Fenwick
    5,79 Chris Waddle

    2 ratedd matches: 5,98 Bryan Robson, 5,40 Mark Hateley, 5,25 Ray Wilkins(sent off after throwing the ball on the ref vs Morocco).
     
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  17. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
    I have been able to note the ratings from 10 sources from which I have calculated a weighted average, taking into account that some rated their country's players too high and that others have an overall average that is above average. This is explained in the header of the image. I shortlisted a total of 139 players. I put the image of those who playing a minimum of 270 minutes obtained an average equal or higher than 6.50.

    He podido anotar las calificaciones de 10 fuentes con las cuales he calculado una media ponderada, teniendo en cuenta que algunas puntuaron demasiado alto a los jugadores de su país y que otras tienen un promedio general que supera a la media. En el encabezamiento de la imagen se explica esto. Preseleccioné a un total de 139 jugadores. Pongo la imagen de aquellos que jugando un mínimo de 270 minutos obtuvieron un promedio igual o mayor de 6,50.

    promedio ratings mundial.jpg

    The averages of other players of interest were: Briegel (6.49); Gerets (6.48); Forster (6.45); Matthaus (6.34); Socrates (6.29); Romerito (6.24); Boniek (6.22); Platini (6.22); Francescolli (6.11); Scifo (6.06); Cabrini (5.97); Hugo Sanchez (5.90); Rummenigge (5.51).

    It is also worth noting the averages of 4 other players who did not reach 270 minutes but came close: Arnesen (7.09); Strachan (6.92); Yakovenko (6.83) and Zavarov (6.64).


    Los promedios de otros jugadores de interés fueron: Briegel (6,49); Gerets (6,48); Forster (6,45); Matthaus (6,34); Sócrates (6,29); Romerito (6,24); Boniek (6,22); Platini (6,22); Francescolli (6,11); Scifo (6,06); Cabrini (5,97); Hugo Sánchez (5,90); Rummenigge (5,51).

    También conviene destacar los promedios de otros 4 jugadores que no llegaron a los 270 minutos, pero que estuvieron cerca: Arnesen (7,09); Strachan (6,92); Yakovenko (6,83) y Zavarov (6,64).
     
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  18. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
    In this other table you can see the conformation of the 20 XI of the World Cup that I have been able to locate. Scoring with 5 to those who are in the first ideal team, with 4 to those in the 2nd and so on, I have ordered them from highest to lowest score and I have proposed the two best teams as a result of these scores.

    En esta otra tabla puede verse la conformación de los 20 XI del Campeonato del Mundo que he podido localizar. Puntuando con 5 a los que están en el primer equipo ideal, con 4 a los del 2º y así sucesivamente, los he ordenado de mayor a menor puntuación y he propuesto los dos mejores equipos como consecuencia de dichas puntuaciones.


    XI IDEALES MUNDIAL.jpg
     
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  19. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
    Adding the stars of the two criteria analyzed, I obtain 23 players with stars in both sections, who could probably be considered the best players of the tournament.

    Agregando las estrellas de los dos criterios analizados, obtengo 23 jugadores con estrellas en ambos apartados, los cuales, probablemente podrían ser considerados los mejores jugadores del torneo.

    total estrellas Mundial.jpg
     
  20. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Is the XI you've cited as from The People actually the one chosen by Bob Paisley Titanlux? If not, it would be one I'm unaware of I think, but I think that's what it is probably, rather than The People's editorial selection or one based on average ratings (I've seen ratings from 1966 and the 1970s World Cups from The People but not the 1980s ones I don't think).
    https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/all-star-teams-of-1986-world-cup.1979342/page-4#post-41206021
    Those are the same players aren't they (including subs getting 4 points) - I guess it could be a good alternative way to label column 14 as Bob Paisley rather than The People even?
     
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  21. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    I did recently decide to subscribe for one more month to Britishnewspaperarchive.co.uk again actually, and so have been able to start browsing through pages again a bit, and this is an XI/squad a journalist made for the Derby Daily Telegraph based on World Cup games before the Final, lined up against an XI/squad he picked from the previous 30 years (apparently also line-ups for a Subbuteo game to be played before the World Cup Final!)
    derbytelegraph1986xis.png
     
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  22. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
    Exactly, it was Paisley's proposal. Do you know if there were other proposals in that publication?
     
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  23. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    I haven't seen anything else yet mate, but have about a month to browse, so if I do find anything I can let you know of course....
     
  24. wm442433

    wm442433 Member+

    Sep 19, 2014
    Club:
    FC Nantes
    I can spot one error : Elkjaer doesn't have a 6 against Scotland, it's a 5 (and yes, he also has a 5 in the next match against Uruguay).
    On the other hand, Maradona is listed with two times 5 stars ratings by FF in their issue of the 1st July, so I checked it too, and it is well three times.
     
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  25. ffff15

    ffff15 Member

    Argentina
    Sep 29, 2021
    The most underrated performer of 1986 World Cup was Careca, he was phenomenal against France
    Imo 2nd best player after Maradona
     

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