Everyone has their favorite formations; with the 4-3-3 perhaps the most fashionable of all of them. But what is the best formation for OUR pool, RIGHT NOW? The main concern is bringing the most out of your core players, and then getting the most out of your main squad players... In this case, we have at our core: Fabian Johnson, Michael Bradley, Jozy Altidore, and Geoff Cameron. Our next main group is Alejandro Bedoya, Matt Besler, DeAndre Yedlin, Clint Dempsey, and perhaps even Gyasi Zardes, John Brooks, Bobby Wood, and Darlington Nagbe. After then, it is maximizing our talent with the rest of the squad guys in our pool (Gonzalez, Williams, Morales, etc.)... So, what are these players best positions and how do we maximize their talents? *Bradley is best used as the center piece of a team's midfield, asked to be a two-way midfielder, and not tasked as sole creator or sole defender. *Johnson is a Swiss Army knife, he can play anywhere. But he does seem to fit best as a deep attacking wide player. Of note, most of our wingbacks seem to also be of this mold.... See: Yedlin, Shea, Chandler, Lichaj, etc. Only Ream is more of a defensive type, and Finlay is about our only pure winger. *Like Johnson, Cameron is also a very versatile player. He can play CB, CDM, or defensive RB. *Next is Jozy, who seems to do best when he plays off another forward. Particularly, a fast, hardworking forward, or very technical, poacher type that still tends to drift wide. So, looking at this, what formation would maximize our talent? I am going to say a 2-3-3-2.... A fluid formation that can easily change from a 3-5-2/5-3-2 to a 4-4-2, depending on game tactics. -------Altidore-----FW-------- -----LM-----Bradley---RM---- Johnson-----Cameron-----Yedlin ----------Besler-----Brooks------ This formation also brings out the most of our depth.... Where, at CB we have Miazga and Gonzalez as the primary back-ups, and even Alvarado, Hedges, Orozco, and Birnbaum. At FB, I see where this benefits our player pool the most.... Villafana, Johnson, Chandler, Shea, Garza, Payne, Yedlin, Vincent, Acosta, Castillo, and Lichaj are all best suited this formation. Only Ream would be better suited for a more fixed defensive position, and yet his distribution can make up for his lack of athleticism. Bradley is the center of everything... We could have back-ups in Jones, Williams, Morales, Nagbe, Bedoya, mcCarty, Diskerud, Hyndman, Zelalem, Gil, Nguyen, Zusi, Pulisic, Lletget, Kljestan, or Feilhaber at this position if need be, but this is Bradley's spot and only an injury would require us to find a replacement here. These other guys, who are best placed centrally, are allowed to player closer to the center in this formation also. Either way, our midfielders in our pool seems to be best suited for hardworking two-way types, who don't have the skill or pace normally to be outright wingers. Cameron is in his best position, where he can play in a somewhat more advanced position; which is also well suited for Trapp, Tchani, Kitchen, and a host of other players, such as Okugo, Edu, Acosta, and Polster. At forward, we need to go ahead and start preparing that Dempsey may need to be used more sparingly due to him getting longer in the tooth.... Which, makes way for the replacement forward to fit Altidore.... An outlet forward who can be either a speedy, hardworking or technical forward that can stretch defenses... We have Morris, Wood, Johannsson, Zardes, Finlay, and Kiesewetter... Backing up Altidore would need to be a more physical/hold-up style or strong, poacher type forward such as Wooten, Bruin, Dempsey, Rubin, Johnsen, Sapong, McInerney, Siebatcheu, Shelton, or Agudelo. Ultimately, regarding tactics this formation suits us best as we are at our best when we are out-working teams in the midfield and counterattacking.... Not trying to out skill teams in a fancy tiki-taka style of play.
In theory, absolutely. It fits the most players--and in particular the most important players--that we currently have at our disposal into roles that best suit them of any formation that I can think of. That said, there is just so little 3 back soccer played by Americans that I am doubtful that it will ever be a comfortable fit in the foreseeable future for our national team. One of the truest generalizations one could make about tactics in American soccer is that we're a 4-in-the-back nation.
Indeed, and though it used to be a very "German" thing, these days those that do are mostly south of the border. Which brings us back to our debate: What is the best formation for us at this point? Right now, I don't think there is one that is ideal; every formation would be a bit of a compromise. We would like 4 in the back, because that's the way almost all our players regularly play and would almost certainly be most comfortable, however, that means that sacrifices have to be made elsewhere. We would like to play with 3 central midfielders: one "behind" Bradley, and one "ahead," but in order to field 3, we'd either need to go 3 in the back or one up top. We would like to play with 2 forwards: someone to partner Jozy. Doing so means that either we'd need to get by with a 442 or else 3 in the back. Any which way we look, we're going to have to compromise. Looked at through that particular lens, the 352 really does look the best, doesn't it? But that lack of comfort with the system for almost all of the player pool is a big factor that just can't be quantified so easily. I do not blame Klinsmann for toying with the idea last year (or even again this January). I simply blame him for doing it in a half-assed way, and building it around Jones in the back, which was essentially setting up the entire experiment to fail, and wasting valuable time that could've been used to either audition more players, or familiarize players with each other in something more resembling the system we would be playing in for most of the year.
I'd say it remained in vogue in Italy as well as south of the boarder. Yes ideally we'd use a January camp to get the players acclimated. Don't mind him trying out Jones there. Just wish he had stuck with it longer than a half. It's something he'd need to let it play out for a camp and few games. I actually think with our full squad we'd be able to get it up and running quickly. Besler/Ream would do fine in a 3 backline as the LCB. They're broth smart positionally and have adequate speed. Cameron would also do well as a RCB or CB in a 3 backline. Assuming he's still getting reps at CB. Brooks to me would be the ideal candidate for CB tho positionally he has lapses. We have a plethora of wingbacks that would work in the system; Fabian, Shea, Chandler, Yedlin, Lichaj and Bedoya could easily occupy the wide areas. Could also see Finlay working there as he has a hi workrate tho he'd be more of an attacking option from that position than defensive cover. We have plenty of CM that we can use; Bradley, Nagbe, Williams, Lee, Morales, Jones and many more. Plus we get to utilize 2 strikers. I wouldnt start Jozy but him, Wood, AJ, Morris and Dempsey would be able to partner up in some combination.
What I'm arguing is not a true 3-5-2, in the traditional sense.... It's a hybrid 3-5-2/4-1-3-2 formation.... Now, let me confuse everyone and argue that we actually are use to this formation with our team... The holding midfielder just plays a little deeper, allowing the fullbacks to get further up the field.
433: we currently lack the quality wing forwards. 3 in the back: we have the players, but the lack of strong team organization makes this formation defensively risky. diamond/y: worth a shout with bradley, nagbe, bedoya, cameron, morales, and williams available to man midfield. flat 442: is the best fit given the number of tw0-way wide mids and two-way center mids.
I'm a big advocate of a 4-2-3-1 or any general formation that allows us to put more midfielders out there and fewer forwards (since forwards are our weakest piece). One thing to mention about 3-5-2 style formations is that many teams these days utilize hybrid formations that morph from a 3 man back-line when attacking into a 4 man back line when defending. In the MLS, the Crew are the best example of this, where Afful and Francis frequently bomb forward and Trapp drops back.
JK isn't the coach to competently implement any kind of hybrid or 3 in the back system. We do however have a good number of players who imo would do well in a wing-back roles. -----------altidore/wood----- -------------------------bedoya--- ----nagbe---bradley-------------yedlin--- ----------------------cameron---- ----fab----besler---gonzalez---orozco-- -------------------howard---- 442/4411 offers simplicity plus flexibility. we also have a good mix of established talent and emerging talent to fill the various positions. once the young fullbacks matriculate into the team, Johnson can be moved into midfield.
The real formation fun could come a few years down the line. What do we do if Brooks is excelling at Hertha or even Bayern, Miazga is starting at Chelsea, and CCV is starting at Tottenham? And what if, on top of that, Pulisic, Zelalem, Hyndman, and Akale (or some other similar combo including Perez, Green, Parker, Gyau, etc.) are all starting in Big 4 leagues? Would we actually stick a DM in there and play a 3-5-2?
Think the new talent would fit into a 442/4411 World Cup 2018 -------------------wood---- --------------bedoya------------- -----pulisic----------nagbe---yedlin -------------bradley--- ----fab----brooks-----miazga---acosta-- -----------------guzan--- this is just an example. perhaps a morris, an agudelo, a slimmed altidore, or a sibatcheau is the starting forward come the Cup. there is a good depth of possibilities at the other positions as well.
I'd still argue, This is still the best formation: -----Altidore-----FW-------- --Bedoya--Bradley--Nagbe-- Johnson---Cameron---Yedlin --------Besler-----Brooks---- ----------------- Besler and Brooks Back-up (center backs): Miazga, Gonzalez; ... maybe, Orozco, Alvarado, Birnbaum, Hedges, CCV, Parker *Role: stay back and defend. Johnson's Back-up (left wingback): Shea, Acosta, Garza, Villafana, Lichaj, Ream; ...maybe, Castillo, Vincent *Role: a true wingback; asked to get in attack to provide width but still with defensive responsibility as a fullback. Yedlin's Back-up (right wingback): Chandler, Lichaj, Payne, Acosta, ...maybe Farrell, Evans, Spector, Birnbaum, Orozco *Role: Same as Johnson...a true wingback. Asked to get up in attack to provide width but also to serve as a fullback. Cameron's Back-up (destroyer, defensive/holding midfielder, third center back): Trapp, Kitchen, Tchani, Acosta, Morales, ...maybe, Williams, Beckerman, Okugo, Edu, Polster, Alashe, Stanko. *Role: a stay at home, holding midfielder, that plays so deep that he acts almost as a third defender, shielding the back-line; however, with some freedom to roam into the attack at select, opportune moments. His main responsibility is to cover for other players, i.e. The wingbacks, and to shield the defense. Bradley's Back-up (center midfielder, playmaker): Jones, Williams, Diskerud, Nguyen, Feilhaber, ...maybe McCarty, Hyndman, Zelalem, Powers, Gil, Kljestan ...or, Nagbe or Bedoya. *Role: to serve as the engine of the team, helping, dropping deep and bursting into the attack, as needed. Bedoya and Nagbe's Back-up (Left/Right two way midfielders): Morales, Pulisic, Williams, Jones, Nguyen, Zusi ...maybe, Lletget, Torres, Corona, Gil, Ibarra *Role: provide support in the center of the midfield; tasked as 8s, not as wingers, to play both side of the ball. Outlet Forward: Johannsson, Wood, Zardes, Morris, Finlay.... Maybe, Kiesewetter, Green, Wooten, Arriola, Saeif*, Manneh* *Role: provide width, speed, and/or technical ability to stretch defenses, and help spring counter attacks. Altidore's Back up (center forward): Dempsey, Wood .... Maybe, Wooten, Rubin, Johnsen, Sapong, McInerney, Davies, Bruin, Siebatcheu, Agudelo, Shelton *Role: play "big" and get in scoring positions.
Dempsey might still be the best player in the pool. He can be the other forward. Have Johnson replace Nagbe. Nagbe is not a wide player or much of a creator. Johnson should be closer to goal. Johnson and Bedoya can switch sides to optimize width. Villafana can replace Johnson. I think he's earned trust between the way he's gotten off the ground in LigaMX and his MLS Cup performance. I wish we'd have integrated sooner, but I'm trying to make the best of a bad situation. Maybe use Lichaj instead of Yedlin because he's a more reliable defender, on the cut in, and tidier. Although that's debatable. Then I think that formation suits us best for the time being. 4-1-3-2/4-4-2. But there should be a big sea change after Copa Centenario when you figure Dempsey is about kaput, relegated to a super sub, if not a retiree, preparing for the World Cup when he'll be 35. Then it's really time to incorporate talented attacking mids, some central, like Lletget and Pulisic. Plus we'd be younger in general. So the 4-2-3-1 or 4-3-3 makes sense with younger players pressuring opponents and trying to take them off the dribble.
You hv no width. The opposition pins Johnson and Yedlin back with wingers and watch as Nagbe, Bedoya, Jozy, FW and Bradley pile up in a big wreck in the middle. When we have wide forwards we can do this ---pulisic----jozy-----morris ---Fabian---Bradley---Bedoya -ream---brooks--miazga---Yedlin 2nd team -----zardes---wood----finlay -----mix-----Cameron---Trapp --vincent--Besler--gonzo---Birnbaum And that's without Dempsey who has a game or two left in him.
Not necessarily true. The outlet forward gets wide to start counters, using wide diagonal runs to get into space. Plus, one of the two two-way mids can stretch wider to create space... Yet still allows for them to come inside. In your formation, Yedlin has no space to get my into the attack, and no one to cover his runs. Both Johnson and Yedlin do best when they attack from deep.
Altidore get wide on diagonal runs on the outlet? Help me up off the floor please. The b2b's are Bedoya who couldn't get wide in the Gold Cup against Jamaica when he was moved to outside mid for that purpose. Nagbe gets lost in wide space which is why they gave up and moved him centrally at Portland, something I said they should have done from the beginning. Finally, having people attack from deep is just asking for more Chandler fiascos. Fabian is attacking from deep at club but from central mid position. Really, your formation is an engraved invitation to the Gold Cup 2015 and I don't want to re-live that nightmare.
Jeez, why don't you read what I actually wrote... Never in that did I say Altidore was the outlet forward. Never...
Klinsmann did a Q and A and stated that he won't deploy a 3-5-2 because he feels players are comfortable with 4 at the back.
4-2-3-1, the primary point ill make is that it allows for two deeper lying mids without the need for a dedicated d-mid (which we dont have), and gives us options for our myriad of attacking mids/few true wingers today, everyone available/fit, not relying on guys on their mid 30s id go altidore johnson diskerud bedoya bradley williams garza brooks cameron yedlin guzan
The diamond/'y' would be fine in a one-off game. ----------Altidore-----Wood---- -----------------Bradley------ --------Nagbe------------Bedoya---- -----------------Cameron----- ---Fab---------------------------Yedlin ------------Besler-----Gonzalez-- -------------------guzan-- the midfield players are in natural positions. the problem lies in the lack of quality depth in those positions. In a flattened midfield, Cameron, Bradley, Nagbe, Mix, and Williams can be rotated through a 2-man central midfield.
This is the same formation I proposed... The one difference is the Cameron would play a little deeper to allow Fabian and Yedlin more room in the attack.
I don't want the CBs splitting wide and the fullbacks pushing high; so there would be no need for the d-mid to drop so deep. In addition to the depth at central midfield in a flat 442, we'd also have good depth at wide field. Fab, Yedlin, Bedoya, Finlay, and Nagbe can all excel there for the US.