The All-Encompassing Pro/Rel Thread on Soccer in the USA

Discussion in 'Soccer in the USA' started by bigredfutbol, Mar 12, 2016.

  1. Placid Casual

    Placid Casual Member+

    Apr 2, 2004
    Bentley's Roof
    Oh. Good. Glad you think they accidentally didn't tank.

    Did you send them a certificate ?
     
  2. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The winter transfer window is an opportunity to upgrade your squad. If an obvious relegation candidate fails to take advantage, then they are either extremely optimistic or they have accepted fate.

    Huddersfield have a manageable net debt of £43.7m, down 13% from the previous season, with some nice parachute money in the pipeline.
     
  3. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It was enough of a windfall for the owner to pay off a big chunk of his own loan money and the directors to pocket almost 600k each.
     
  4. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Doesn't happen in pro/rel leagues. I read that here.
     
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  5. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    #21855 M, Jul 7, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2019
    Written by whom?

    Also of note is that the bankruptcy hearing is for past taxes that weren't paid, so relegation from the Football League can't be blamed. Crap management can.
     
  6. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    So signing Michael Keane - subsequently an England international - wasn't an upgrade? Yes, he was already on loan, but it was a half-season loan, like Chalobah's.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014–15_Burnley_F.C._season#Transfers

    Enjoy the trip to Eastleigh for your first National League. Oh, are you going bust first??
     
  7. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    I see they signed six players during the mid-season transfer window. So you got that one completely wrong as well:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009–10_Burnley_F.C._season#Transfers
     
  8. From those who are in the countries with P/R?
     
  9. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What they're doing is disappointing, but I don't think you can really call it "tanking" which implies deliberately losing. What Cincy is doing is just throwing in the towel. They can't compete as currently constructed, so they're gonna wait it out until they can begin rebuilding.
     
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  10. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Personally, I don't think the business plans of poorly-performing clubs tells us much of anything about league structure. YMMV.
     
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  11. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    Does tanking imply "deliberately losing"? In the NBA, they don't throw games, do they?

    It's more like they don't bother to win. Which feels pretty similar. Given that the intentions are different (playing for draft picks, vs. keeping costs down until contracts expire), I wouldn't necessarily say that because they have no incentive to actively lose doesn't mean they aren't still tanking.
     
    M repped this.
  12. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Tanking implies teams playing for better draft picks, usually by using less talented players, unless you're M in which case you use it interchangeably with "cartel" for anything American.

    But isn't a team that receives $130 million, then possibly another $60 million and uses it to pay down debt, give the directors a big payout, or invest in infrastructure, as opposed to acquiring obtain better players, doing something similar in principle?
     
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  13. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    They're kicked out of the league for it, though.
     
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  14. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    The issue with tanking isn't that teams do it, it's that there is no penalty for it (and in most cases there is reward through draft position - and regardless of general opinion about the SuperDraft, FCC got one of their most productive players through it). They get to keep their market monopoly status in the top league and the fans are just stuck with it because they have no alternative.
     
  15. An Unpaved Road

    An Unpaved Road Member+

    Mar 22, 2006
    Club:
    --other--
    Honestly asking, what is Cincinnati doing to bring up the tanking charge? I don't quite get it from that Tweet.
     
  16. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    They have no intention of spending money to improve the team until the 2021 season. They're hitting autopilot until their bad contracts run out.
     
  17. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Fair enough, my wording was poor. You're right, it's more about not trying to win not deliberately throwing games.

    But I still say that doing so in order to get better draft picks is different than just saying "the next season is a wash."
     
  18. They're now complying to the home grown rule with that.
     
  19. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    They end up exactly where they started potentially $200 million richer.
     
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  20. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    They did earn their place in the Premier League based on performances on the field of play rather than through acceptance of a cartel membership fee. I will merely lol that a team can buy their way into a league and then do nothing to be even remotely competitive in it in the knowledge there's no price of failure.
     
  21. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's not what they've said. Their GM said that their next coach will be a caretaker on an 18 month contract. That way they can bring someone else in when their shiny new stadium opens up.

    FCC's biggest misstep was not hiring a GM/Sporting Director prior to moving to MLS. Jeff Berding is the President of FCC, and he was pulling double duty as the GM while they were in USL. That's great when you are in USL and can outspend all of your competition and win games simply on talent alone. They've found out very quickly that they can't do that in MLS. All of the other teams have either had more time to build all of their infrastructure and front offices out, or that have more resources at the their disposal that has allowed them to quickly close that gap (i.e. they have $$$$$ that allows them to make great hires and build infrastructure).

    FCC did everything right to get accepted into MLS. They royally f'd up everything ever since that party like MLS expansion announcement day though. The other Sporting Director's and GM's in the league played Berding and Koch like a fiddle in the MLS transfer market, fleecing them for nearly all of the league provided year one expansion resources (allocation $$$). They seriously overpaid for Waston, Adi, Alashe,Garza, Haggland, & Manneh among others.

    FCC makes Orlando City look competent.........
     
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  22. HailtotheKing

    HailtotheKing Member+

    San Antonio FC
    United States
    Dec 1, 2008
    TEXAS
    Club:
    San Antonio Scorpions FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Written by whom? :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:

    Where are the panic buys?

    But rewarded financially, especially in regards to their "new" competition at a "lower" level ...
     
  23. Crawleybus

    Crawleybus Member+

    Oct 18, 2013
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    I wouldn't call either of them 'traditionally top flight clubs', Rovers have been outside the top flight 48 of their 120 years and Forest 60 out of their 116 years. People seem to 'think' Forest were a big club because they had a few 'golden years' under Cloughie, the reality is before him they were not particularly successful and since him they have fallen back to mediocrity. Of course thanks to Pro/Rel they can come back to being European Champions if they 'play their cards right'.
     
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  24. Aston Villa seems to have jumped the 90 million fence of new transfers after promoting to the epl.
    Let's watch what that pays off.
     
  25. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The one good thing you can say about Randy Lerner is that he cleared their debts before he sold the club (although he did receive £30M following their promotion).
     

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