The 2023 U-17 Player Pool Thread

Discussion in 'Youth National Teams' started by David Kerr, Dec 24, 2020.

  1. Husky13

    Husky13 Member

    Chelsea
    United States
    Sep 11, 2019
    I know nothing about Corcoran individually. However, I do know parents at FC Dallas, and I hear regularly about the environment there with agents getting on kids at the age of 14 (and parents welcoming this), etc. Feels like things have gotten a bit out of control with people thinking their futures are made because they made a YNT at a young age. A lot of kids who were higher performers at U15 are no longer the higher performers. Unfortunately, many MLS academies are responsible for this - their internal scouts lock into players at age 13/14, and then become personally invested from a pride and credibility standpoint in making those choices into reality, rather than allowing competition to continue and the cream to rise. I definitely see that at the local academy where I live. It does not help these kids in the least - it is important to stay hungry, humble, and keep working hard and improving.
     
  2. TheFalseNine

    TheFalseNine Moderator
    Staff Member

    Arsenal
    United States
    Jul 15, 2014
    Norman, Okla.
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Good find from Marcus Chai re: Bryan Destin.

     
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  3. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Could a player play for one country at U-20 level and then another country at U-17 level? Or can you only switch to play at a higher level? This would apply to Destin and Jarvis.

    @BostonRed @Dave Marino-Nachison
     
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  4. BostonRed

    BostonRed Member+

    Oct 9, 2011
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If all the matches are non-competitive (friendlies), then yes, assuming he is a citizen of both.

    If the U17 matches are competitive (U17 WC qualifying or WC or a confed championship), then the player would have to file a switch to later join Country 2. FIFA doesn't set any age limit, so you can switch from U17 to U20 for a different country. It's not always wise, but it can be done.
     
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  5. TheFalseNine

    TheFalseNine Moderator
    Staff Member

    Arsenal
    United States
    Jul 15, 2014
    Norman, Okla.
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    How big a loss would this be if Destin were provisionally cap-tied to Haiti?
     
  6. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    He’s not great, but could play a part. The 06’s have very few CF’s. I don’t think it’d be a big loss long-term, but he’s someone who could have played for this team.
     
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  7. STR1

    STR1 Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    May 29, 2010
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    When is the CONCACAF U17 WCQ?

    Who are the best players, if we have everyone available, that can possibly be called up for qualifiers?
     
  8. TheFalseNine

    TheFalseNine Moderator
    Staff Member

    Arsenal
    United States
    Jul 15, 2014
    Norman, Okla.
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
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  9. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    Someone want to take a crack at our squad?
     
  10. EXALIFTIN

    EXALIFTIN Member+

    Nov 23, 2010
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States




    The squad that beat Belgium and Portugal during the May U17 camp were a joy to watch, I wouldn’t mind seeing them again, cant imagine they would have to many problems against Concacaf competition
     
  11. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    I've heard of like four of those guys in each of the lineups so I guess I've got some reading to do.
     
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  12. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    These two posts are wonderfully placed.

    I think who are the best players that can be called up and what this squad looks like will be different. For that matter, who are the best players is the wrong question to ask. It should be who are the best prospects because I think that creates some of the problems.

    There will be some of the best prospects called up, but some also won't be. U-17 is an age group where the squad selection is a lot more subjective compared to the U-20's, and there's more room for favors for certain people and letting the clubs and/or certain area scouts pick representatives. I hope it starts to go more and more in the right direction as we get closer to the competition, but I think we have to say that who will be the players picked and who are the best American U-17 prospects will be different. They tend to select a lot of safe players who are presently good, but lack in big time tools that project to higher levels. They do this for results purposes. They don't like selecting very many raw players with big tools. They'd rather select a maxed-out player who won't make mistakes.

    It's fun to follow either way, but I would not expect the same from the U-17's as the U-20's. It's even more of a true sampling of the best available talent compared to the actual best prospects, in my opinion.
     
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  13. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    On the flipside, there probably isn't the same release issues with the U17s, right? There's no Pepi or Paredes here -- although if they put it in a non-FIFA window I could see a European-based talent being kept home (like Gill -- is he eligible)?

    It'd be great to see the squads people want -- there's not a lot of benefit in trying to project the politics.
     
  14. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    It can happen actually. Atlanta notoriously doesn't like releasing players for almost any youth tournament. The good thing there is that no Atlanta players are likely because their 06's aren't too good, but there's a chance that a few might not be released by their clubs (domestically or abroad).

    I want to finish watching the MLS NEXT Playoffs, and then I'll release an updated best squad.
     
  15. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I keep waiting for that to bite them like a player not signing with specifying that is the reason.
     
  16. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Is it possible thats the reason Bryce Jamison ('06) left to Barca AZ? I wouldn't doubt it.

    They didn't really have much in the few years after their great '00 year. Bello was the significant exception, but he signed so early that he was already signed by the time any of this stuff started. They signed Campbell, Wolff and Conway, but none of those guys were particularly high-end prospects when they signed. Probably glad to get a HG offer.

    Their 04's are good. Two of them are signed (Wiley and Morales). Two of them aren't (Prince and Salley). Potentially three aren't, if you also want to include Sullins. The conventional thinking would be that they weren't signed because the club didn't think they were ready, but it's possible the players didn't want to sign. In '05, they've only signed Cobb, who isn't really a high-end prospect. Their best 05's (Villal and Carleton) haven't signed yet. Could again be a case that they don't think they are ready, but I do remember Andrew saying somewhere a few years back that Alan would not sign with Atlanta, so it's possible thats part of it. Their 06's aren't that good. The only real good one was Jamison, who left. Too early to know about anyone younger than that.
     
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  17. grandinquisitor28

    Feb 11, 2002
    Nevada
    Needless to say, I find this infuriating. The owners that built this league,and saved this league from collapse twenty years ago depended upon the USMNT, and growing the game through people's connection to the crest to make it survive. W/o the USMNT there would be no MLS, and without those founders and their commitment, the renaissance wouldn't have happened either.

    Teams like Atlanta strike me as nouveau riche scumbags that figured out how to avoid all the risk of the early years, and steal all the benefits they played zero role in yielding and the fact that they pulled that stunt AND then refuse to release players to the organization that made their own riches possible? It just makes me sick. ----- them.

    That being said, you can't root against teams because every team getting their head out of their rear is a net positive for the national team, the best I can do is basically just root for them to get a clue in terms of playing development.
     
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  18. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    I wouldn't go that far. Toronto, Seattle, Atlanta (among others) have all helped the cause by spending cash and making their teams a huge priority. None have figured out yet how to meld academies, HG's, MLS vets, DP's etc. Seattle may be the closest. Atlanta will and maybe already has lost players that see what they are about. LAG have lost multiple players to other leagues because of this. Maybe it's the way the academy teams have a chance to compete. If Philly doesn't wholesale sell their top HG's this off season they may be good enough added to their vets to win a title. Until someone does though the $$ method is king. I don't see LAFC adding their HG's to the money pool players.
     
  19. TheFalseNine

    TheFalseNine Moderator
    Staff Member

    Arsenal
    United States
    Jul 15, 2014
    Norman, Okla.
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
     
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  20. SUDano

    SUDano Member+

    Jan 18, 2003
    Rochester, NY
    Complacency sets in trying to move up the ranks to earn hard earned first team minutes against full grown men who would break your ankles rather than relinquish his starting minutes and possibly his spot and his paycheck feeding his family. Because we all know that value only comes while playing for any European youth team for no transfer fee. Not earning your way to Europe but just as any other youth player. The never ending euro pixy dust forces many to illogical mental gymnastics to come up with convoluted explanations on having to go to Europe under any and all circumstances.
     
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  21. Ray Shoesmith

    Ray Shoesmith Member+

    Valencia
    United States
    Nov 14, 2021
    Paredes, Reynolds and Che are really benefitting. No way a another solid year playing here could ever help them.

    With the younger guys the lack of time is clearly even a greater asset in their development. I mean, they are in Europe!
     
  22. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    Twitter is such a Eurotrash domain.

    We just had a dominant U20 performance. People should look at just where those players were from. Most of the hyped Euro talent from even a year ago wasn't good enough to make it - like say, Sanogo.

    I'd also be pretty shocked to have the U17 team be as Euro dominant as twitter wants. They like to hype players they've never actually seen play a full game. Although in part, they are getting around it by using the idea of a trial or training. Most of those guys doing those don't even have a way to go to Europe before 18, and it's common even amongst players that play in MLS.
     
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  23. SUDano

    SUDano Member+

    Jan 18, 2003
    Rochester, NY
    #473 SUDano, Jul 25, 2022
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2022
    I don't think I'm trying to be conclude definitively anything for any individual player. Sometimes Europe at the right club at the right level is good, sometime MLS Academy or USL, or first team in MLS is good. It's really the argument of appropriate level for each player. I flip out when MLS is not even in the spectrum of good possibilities and always disparaged as lesser than any and all levels of in Europe. And many still think it's harming to any and all youth players. It's a false trope.
     
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  24. Ray Shoesmith

    Ray Shoesmith Member+

    Valencia
    United States
    Nov 14, 2021
    I don’t think you can even call it a false trope anymore considering what we are seeing.

    It’s pure ignorance.

    I do 100% believe Paredes, Che and Reynolds would have been much better served playing another year here.
    I also will say, if you have a passport, and can go over if you are young then by all means go for it if that’s the desire.
    Players will find out real quick just where they stand.
     
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  25. no exit

    no exit Member+

    DC United
    United States
    Nov 20, 2019
    Paredes is a funny one because at the time I thought he would've been better served by staying, but in practice it's hard to think he would've developed so much in the toxic waste dump that is the 2022 DC United season.
     
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