Sub taking PK

Discussion in 'Referee' started by fairplayforlife, May 30, 2012.

  1. fairplayforlife

    fairplayforlife Member+

    Mar 23, 2011
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think I am going mad. I can't remember where I heard this but if someone calls a PK and then a substitute (who was not on the field at the time of the foul) comes on the field can the substitute then take the PK. For some reason I was thinking no but now I don't know why I thought this. Probably just overthinking or remembering something incorrectly, please help.
     
  2. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    A substitute goalkeeper is allowed to defend a PK if necessary (due to DOGSO or injury... or really any reason, but those are the two most common). Same has to go for a kicker, though I don't think I've ever seen it in a match with limited substitutions. Only caveat, of course, is that the substitution needs to be up at midfield prior to the penalty (unless it's an injury)--just as he needs to be at any stoppage.
     
  3. fairplayforlife

    fairplayforlife Member+

    Mar 23, 2011
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thanks, I am really confused as to where I got that idea. This actually did happen this weekend in our state cup (with limited subs).
     
  4. socal lurker

    socal lurker Member+

    May 30, 2009

    Some leagues may have rules prohibiting it. (I don't do HS, but I have a vague recollection that Fed may prohibit (or at some time have prohibited) a sub from taking a PK.)
     
  5. Bubba Atlanta

    Bubba Atlanta Member+

    Mar 2, 2012
    Yep, Atlanta
    Club:
    Atlanta United FC
    Sub cannot take the PK under NFHS rules.
     
  6. wguynes

    wguynes Member

    Dec 10, 2010
    Altoona, IA
    The caveat is not even in the laws, either. The "being at midfield prior to the stoppage" is a way to keep substitutions down when the league or competition allows unlimited substitutions. To my knowledge, I don't think FIFA matches care all that much. Since there are only 3 per team per match anyway.
     
  7. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes and no.

    Yes, that it's not in the Laws. But, no, I think they would care that much.

    It takes a little bit for a fourth to process a substitution with the paper work and getting the board ready. I don't think we'd ever see--or more precisely, a fourth official and referee allow--a substitution process starting after a penalty kick is called and completing prior to the penalty kick being taken, save for the obvious exceptions of injuries or a red card on the goalkeeper. You're right it's not outlawed, but it would be quite out of sync with what else is allowed and traditional on substitutions.
     
  8. socal lurker

    socal lurker Member+

    May 30, 2009
    We're also not going to see it because it doesn't make any sense in high level soccer -- a sub cold off the bench is really going to take a better PK on his first touch than a high-level player already in the game? (OK, maybe we can manufacture a scenario with the injured about to retire former captain on the bench that they want to bring in for a final hurrah or some such, but nothing realistic.)

    It only becomes a real-world issue in in-and-out games, where the best PK taker may have just come out and be ready to go. (And where the difference between #1 and #2 PK taker may be more dramatic.)
     
  9. fairplayforlife

    fairplayforlife Member+

    Mar 23, 2011
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I am going to disagree with this. I think if it came down to a PK in the last few minutes of a WC match and the team had a player that specialized in PKs they might take the risk. This is pure speculation and probably the reasoning behind the NFHS rule.
     
  10. Law5

    Law5 Member+

    Mar 24, 2005
    Beaverton OR
    A "PK specialist?" You mean a forward? Nobody gets put on a national team (or even a pro team) because of their ability to take penalty kicks. Nobody. Coaches and owners certainly don't think in those terms. And, in the scenario you describe, this would have to be someone who is clearly better than the 11 players already on the field at taking penalties but someone who isn't good enough a player to already be on the field? Too much baseball thinking.
     
    SimpleGame6 repped this.
  11. Errol V

    Errol V Member+

    Mar 30, 2011
    Brilliant.
     
  12. fairplayforlife

    fairplayforlife Member+

    Mar 23, 2011
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I didn't say it was a likely scenario, just a possible one. There are many teams that always look to a certain player to take their PKs. No they aren't "specialists" so I used a poor word but they are better than others. I am simply saying that if the team thinks they can assure an extra goal and avoid extra time in a big match they might be willing to do this. Nothing is outside the realm of possibilities when it comes to soccer no matter how absurd or unlikely. Any referee should know that.
     
  13. NHRef

    NHRef Member+

    Apr 7, 2004
    Southern NH
    Think like a 4O for a moment, the CR just called a PK, so what do you do? The last thing you do is probably stand at mid-field looking for subs, you are probably drifting towards the defending teams bench because I bet someone over there is going to need some attention! So if the sub isn't already up and ready and processed, then he isn't going to be up and ready and processed before the taking of the PK cause well, you, as 4O, have more demanding things on your hands.
     

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