Check out the story at the following link (last paragraph): http://www.northjersey.com/page.php?level_3_id=137&page=5234643 Or, for those of you too lazy to do so, here is the text: "Next on the Metros' list of things to get done this off-season is the re-signing of free agent defender Steve Jolley. A six-year veteran and former All-Star, Jolley will meet with Metros and MLS officials this week and is also fielding interest from clubs in Germany, France and Belgium." Does anyone have any idea which teams, if any, are interested in him?
Profiled: As much as I'd like to see more Yanks Abroad, I agree with you in that I don't see Jolley as that quality a player that he'd be getting offers from Euro teams, unless maybe lower divisions. You may be right about the agent "creating" these offers as a bargaining ploy. I hope for STeve's sake the agent knows what he is doing.
Yes, because what giant of Belgian football would possibly stoop to seek a transfer of a solid MLS player. Just dumb.
I see that you're a Metros fan so I can understand why you might defend Steve J. But, I don't see him as the type of player that would attract interest from abroad. Yes, he is a solid MLS defender. BUt I think it's safe to say that teams in Europe, including Belgian teams, can find a defender of his quality almost anywhere. If it turns out that a top division team from Europe signs him, I will apologize personally to you (and to him, for that matter).
I agree, he really doesn't offer anything you can't get from a low rent guy from any number of domestic european leagues, and moving someone half way across the planet, into a truly foreign culture is a much bigger gamble. Although, crazier things have happened. He mine as well go to a regionalia team in germany.
So, if they can find a defender of his caliber anywhere, why is MLS not anywhere? Why would a midtable team in Belgium look first to a similar player playing for, I don't know, Racing Gdansk or whatever, and not the Metros? You are just displaying insipid Europhilism. Get over your inferiority complex about your country as a footballing nation and understand that, while MLS may not be even in the top 10, some of MLS's ten teams might be jsut as good as mid table Belgian teams, and could compete in Eastern European leagues, much less in African leagues where I would bet the Belgians look for some of their talent. I have no idea where Jolley will end up, and I for one have never seen an exodus of MLS players overseas on the horizon as many on these boards have predicted for years now. But to suggest that good MLS players are not good enough for mid level Belgian teams is just ridiculous.
For the obvious culture issues involved in moving to europe from the states is one issue, the language gap, and cost. He's a mediocre MLS player, not a good mls player.
Mediocre player? Good player? Whatever. He's played in the league for six years and is fairly durable, I think. He is also available on a free transfer. If somebody in the Belgian league needs a defender and doesn't have transfer money to spend, he might be their man. They could do worse. Jolley could do worse.
I think you've missed the point. No one is saying that Steve Jolley is not good enough to play in Europe. Moreover, no one is saying that the quality of the players in MLS is not sufficient that many MLS players don't belong in Europe. I actually agree with you: many MLS teams could compete against European teams, except for the top echelon of European teams (Real Madrid, B. Munich, etc.), and many MLS players could succeed in Europe. The point I am making, and I think Profiled is also making this point, is that the REALITY is that the vast majority of European teams, be they Bundesliga teams or Belgian or Dutch or Spanish or French or English or whatever, do not view MLS players or MLS itself in the same light as we do. I do not have insipid Europhilism, but I think it's safe to say that many Europeans do. That's the reality.
Out of Contract? Regarding the attractiveness of MLS players, remember that for players out of contract the limited transfer window does not apply. Therefore a team seeking immediate help might find SJ as an appealling option if that they can't wait for the post Xmas transfer window. This side effect of the MLS season running opposite of the European calendar could give some of the MLS guys a real advantage when seeking work in Europe.
That's why we see so many Africans and south Americans in Euro leagues, I suppose. I do agree however that Europe does not see MLS as a high quality development league. But in individual cases, I simply don't see why Jolley wouldn't be considered by an average Belgian team, adn why a player from Metalurg Donetsk would be given greater consideration than Steve Jolley in this individual case. And profiled, only an American would cite "cultural" barriers to Americans playing in Europe. The insularity that some of us show makes me ashamed. I mean, if I guy can come out of the slums of Sao Paulo or Dakar and succeed in Europe, as many do, a guy playing on a team from Jersey can't? Silly. Just because you feel frightened of what you don't know or understand doesn't mean that the average American footballer feels that way.
Again it's all a matter of perception, no need to attack me. I'm not saying he can't do it, but the perception IS there, whether you want to admit it or not. Moving from ANY slum is easier then moving from a nice life with family and friends in Jersey. Don't be so damn defensive.
If Mike Duheany (sp?) can get a cup of coffee in the lower ranks of Germany, surely Steve Jolley is deserving of one.
Troya Cowell (A-League vet) and Evan Whitfield also spent time in the first division of Belgium. Seeing Jolley there would not be unexpected. He is an average player, but if he impresses the right person at the right time, he will find himself playing in Europe with many other average players. Great players don't spend time on average teams for long, they move to the big boys (Man. U., REal, Barca, Juve, Munich, etc.) very quickly. There is very little that separates your MLS team and its players from most mid level and lower level European teams.
Thanks for the examples. Well done. And profiled, I repeat, just because you would feel that way, doesn't mean that most first division american soccer players would feel that way. I think you're projecting your own fears on Steve Jolley.
Metrogo: I'm not trying to incite you or to get into a war with you. I assume Profiled is not either. That being said, the fact that Cowell or Whitfield spent some time in Belgium does not prove your point. First of all, neither is still there, so I assume that their time in Belgium was not overly impressive. Second, as I posted previously, there are plenty of example of MLS players moving to European teams and doing well (Friedel, JMM, at least the 1st season, etc.). That means nothing with respect to Steve J. And, if you read further down Dignan's post, which you cited approvingly, you'll note that his assessment of Steve J. was basically the same as mine: he's an average MLS player. I don't see European teams at any level knocking down doors to sign average MLS players. Not that I don't think an average MLS player could make the roster at an average European team (however you define that). I do. It's just that European teams don't look at MLS as a breeding ground for future stars, however right or wrong that view may be. That's the reality. I hope it changes, as I believe you do too. As an aside, I would hope you could refrain from calling peoples' opinions "dumb" or "ridiculous". As you can see from other posters here, not everyone agrees with you, nor does everyone agree with me. No one is disrespecting your opinions whether you agree with them or not. Please reciprocate.
This will be my last post on the topic. First, I think Steve Jolley is a slightly above average MLS player, so we only disagree on that slightly. Two, Euro teams aren't knocking down the door for MLS players, we have already established that we agree on that post. Three, you keep changing your point. First you say that Jolley isn't of a good enough "quality" to get an offer from Europe. Then when I call you on it, you say not that they're not good enough to play in Europe, but that Europeans are biased against MLS and Americans so they don't get offers. Then when someone calls you on that point, by pointing out that two players who are not as good as Jolley did in fact get offers, you go back to saying they're not good enough to play. It seems you don't even know what you're trying to say. I have been saying the same thing throughout, that Steve Jolley is a "solid MLS player" ie not a superstar, and that he should be good enough to play in Belgium, and that it is certainly plausible that he would get an offer. You disagree, though why is still mystifying me. As for profiled, well, I'm sorry, but it just amazes me that someone would suggest that it might not be good for a 25 year old american soccer player to go and play in Europe for "cultural" reasons. It is ignorant and closed minded beyond belief, and an embarassing point of view. It's the world's game for chrissake. I have learned to expect such narrow insularity from our president, but not from soccer fans who I would expect to be a bit more sophisticated than him. I guess I'm wrong. OK, I'm done. And Jolley probably won't end up overseas, but MLS has got to be willing to pony up a bit more than 50 grand for him.
On the "cultural" issue, I also don't see how cultural reasons make it unlikely an American will end up in Belgium but other Europeans will end up there. Each European country is a vastly different culture. So, just like Steve Jolley, a non-Belgian European player going to a Belgian club is going to have deal with a different culture and language(s) (unless they're French or Dutch).
In fact,there may be cultural and lifestyle differences within countries (Belgium being a good example,ironically enough) that may influence a player's comfort level in a city. Bottom line,it's Steve's decision.I have read some articles he wrote while on the U-20 or 23 side.They seemed to be written by an intelligent and relatively open-minded person.Maybe he simply wants to play in Europe.
Metro, before you run your big mouth acting "superior", you need to learn how to read. I've never questioned Jolley's will or ability to adapt, culturally or otherwise (except he isn't a very good player). However I said it is a commonly held belief by EUROPEANS that AMERICAN's in general have a hard time adapting cultural. Also remember what happened to Landon, he didn't exactly have the easiest time adapting did he? I'm not embarsed, and no it's not a projection of my own fear. In fact I just recieved my work permit to work in London, and will be moving their mid november. You ever heard of a game called Championship Manager?
Exactly what I was going to say. Duhaney was signed by a (2nd Bundesliga?) team. So why not? Duhaney wasn't anymore impressive for Metro or MLS than Jolley was.