SQR: Beckham for LA Player manager?

Discussion in 'San Jose Earthquakes' started by bsman, Sep 2, 2007.

  1. bsman

    bsman Member+

    May 30, 2001
    Santa Clara
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/14385/Suits-you-sir/

    Interestingly, the desperation for LA to "get back" their investment on Beckham may be the nail in the coffin for Frank Yallop. Now, whether the likely departure of FY has any implications for the Quakes is obviously open for discussion. Interestingly, in my family, we are strongly divided: I would be happy to see him here, whereas my wife wants no part of Frank, Joe Cannon, or any other player who have been 'tainted by LA'... 'Course, I haven't reminded her yet that Mullan and Ching came from LA... :rolleyes:
     
  2. darkstar10990

    darkstar10990 Member

    Jun 26, 2007
    Bay Area
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    interesting article, but i doubt he'd be player-manager. thats too much, just too much. I think he has bigger things to worry about, for instance getting injured every time he falls down. You laugh, but its true.



    and the end of the article was interesting as well, the whole loan thing. To save his career in England? Is that because the people dont like him there anymore? McBride played for the Crew, then went to wherever the hell he went, but still stayed on the National Team and no one thought differently of him.
     
  3. sj_oldtimer

    sj_oldtimer Member

    Nov 18, 2005
    Clovis CA
    I have always believed that it would be a mistake for the league to bring Beckham in during the middle of the season, especially with the mega-hype that we have seen. There are so many risks to the strategy. Now the league, AEG, and the team are now caught with their pants down. Just about everything that could go wrong has gone wrong.

    How hard would it have been to bring Beckham in for the full season next year? It would have cost some money, but probably less than it is going to cost now, given the circumstances. This entire Beckham thing is just stumbling to a rather uneventful climax. No matter what happens, it will not live up to the marketing hype.
     
  4. We Were Cut

    We Were Cut Member

    Sep 9, 2000
    Woodland, CA
    People in England don't respect MLS. It's regarded as a low level league, and that Beckham is playing in the wilderness. Since Beckham is playing without good competition and with bad teammates, so the thinking goes, his form will suffer and he won't have anything to offer to the English national team.

    It's a different situation for McBride as the EPL is definitely a better league than MLS.
     
  5. sj_oldtimer

    sj_oldtimer Member

    Nov 18, 2005
    Clovis CA
    I think Beckham realizes that and knows that a loan agreement would help his chances for the national side.

    I wonder if there is ever to be an opportunity for MLS teams to have some sort of competition with EPL teams during the winter months? I don't think it would even be necessary to have the top EPL teams involved. EPL teams are busy during their season, but some sort of working arrangement between the two leagues would be interesting. It would really be a bigger risk for the EPL than for MLS.
     
  6. Jay Hipps

    Jay Hipps Member

    Mar 18, 2000
    Northern California
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'd say that outside the top five or so clubs in the EPL (Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool, ManU), there's not that much difference between MLS sides and EPL sides. They've got bigger rosters and bigger payrolls, but the quality of play isn't all that different. Clint Dempsey has started two games for Fulham this year and he's got two goals and an assist. We'd see a lot more Americans in the EPL if work permits weren't an issue

    As for the article, it's in the Sun, which is a tabloid and hardly a reliable source for news. I'd take anything they say with a one-pound block of salt.
     
  7. FAS

    FAS Member

    Jun 5, 1999
    Los Gatos
    I tend to agree that the better teams in MLS (Houston, DC, Revs, Dallas) would survive in the premier league and might even challenge for a UEFA Cup slot. Probably the Scum would be relegated to League One and then onto League 2 on their current form :D
     
  8. Albany58

    Albany58 Member+

    Sep 14, 1999
    Concord, CA USA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There's no League 3?
     
  9. FAS

    FAS Member

    Jun 5, 1999
    Los Gatos
    Lol, no there is not, although there used to be even a Division 4 There's PL, Championship, Leage 1 and League 2 now, League 2's = old Division 4. And then there's the dreaded Conference, non league football. It's all so damn confusing the way they keep renaming em. Not sure if the Scum would beat a conference side these days :D
     
  10. Tifoso

    Tifoso Moderator
    Staff Member

    Juventus
    Italy
    Feb 24, 2007
    northern California
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    They are sadly correct (for now--there is no one here that wants MLS to succeed more than me, OK?). To use the Italian model, MLS is upper Serie B. (again: for now)


    By quite a bit, sadly. :(


    Not to derail the thread, but where do you guys think the MLS' greatest weakness is? I would say the midfield, and passing in general (especially trapping the ball).
     
  11. We Were Cut

    We Were Cut Member

    Sep 9, 2000
    Woodland, CA
    I think the better teams in MLS could compete with the bottom half of the EPL but would have big problems due to lack of depth. This is what I think is the biggest problem in MLS, and has been so since day one, depth. Some of the top MLS players could be decent division one (EPL, Serie A) players, such as McBride, Dempsey, Beasley, etc. have shown. Most MLS players I think would be decent division 2 (Championship, Serie B, etc.), players. The last two or so starters and the benches for MLS would have a hard time getting contracts overseas.

    The second biggest problem with MLS is the structure of the playoffs, with little meaning to the week-in, week-out play, as the goal is to get into the playoffs. 4 out of 6 teams in each division makes the playoffs, then anything goes. There needs to be more meaning in every game for the league to be more interesting.

    I don't think relegation is realistic here, but some mechanism, maybe win bonuses for every game, to liven up that midweek August match. Or $1 million to the winner of the regular season.

    For on the field play, I'd like to see better passing. I cringe at how many bad passes there are in every game.
     
  12. billward

    billward Member

    Oct 22, 2002
    El Cerrito, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Depth is a function of the size of the pyramid you sit atop of. The career of a talented American soccer player has too many chances to get derailed away from the prospect of playing in MLS. They start off in AYSO, then if they're good they may (if their parents can afford it) join an elite youth team. If they stick with it, they might get a college scholarship, or join a program like Bradenton, but there are not very many spots open for that. If they go to college (if they have the brains to get good grades), they're stuck in the shackles of NCAA (don't get me started about NCAA "soccer"), and only the top few get into the MLS SuperDraft. The parents of these kids (such as my chiropractor) see the long odds against them ever making it big as a soccer player, and tend to steer them off this path at every opportunity.

    And then there's all the talented kids who just can't get onto that track in the first place. Inner city kids have no fields to play soccer on - they go for basketball instead. Poor and many middle-class families can't afford the elite coaches and travel schedules. And the hispanic segment of the population has their own, very disorganized, system of teams and leagues that are totally not plugged into the US Soccer universe.

    Contrast that to overseas, where the clubs all have extensive youth programs, which aren't a function of how much the parents can afford to pay for, but rather of the kids' skill. Since they're already affiliated with a club before they even get close to college age, it is a lot more clear whether or not they have a "shot" and there's less of a cultural imperative that the kids go to college anyway.

    MLS is addressing this by starting up club-based academies, but we'll see how that turns out in the coming years.

    How is that any different from the top X teams going to UEFA Champions League or UEFA Cup slots? Aside from the relegation battles, that's the primary incentive.

    How about cash prizes for each slot in the table at the end of the regular season? $1M for the Supporters Shield winning team, and successively smaller prizes for 2nd, 3rd, etc. place.

    Relegation can only happen when we have more teams than we have room in the league for. When soccer is as popular here as it is in Europe and every rich guy wants to own a team, but we can only have 20 or so teams in the league, they can start a 2nd division and have pro/rel. But that's not likely to happen for decades at least.

    Hopefully the addition of players like Beckham will make that a higher priority league-wide. Because whatever you might say about Beckham, he can swat a fly with a soccer ball from 50 yards.
     
  13. Tifoso

    Tifoso Moderator
    Staff Member

    Juventus
    Italy
    Feb 24, 2007
    northern California
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    UEFA Cup is seen very much as the best of the rest consolation prize, though. At least in Italia, the competition to finish 4th, vs 5th, 6th or 7th is HUGE (in terms of prestige, coverage, and most importantly money). UEFA Cup has almost zero following among "contender" fans (say Juve, Milan, Inter, Roma)--a team would rather finish in CL once in 5 years, than UEFA 2 (or arguably even 3 or 4) times.

    What we (I am speaking for We Were Cut a bit here, and if I am misrepresenting you amico mio, please call me on it) are arguing is that winning your league in Europe is a HUGE deal. Juve fans (with 27 Scudetti) would love to win a CL, sure (partly because we haven't been very successful there, TBH). But when teams that haven't won their domestic competition--a competition covering 30+ matches--are winning CL "regularly", it cheapens the competition. For one thing, our "CL" should only include the top teams for each division (or maybe the top 2). The old CL used to be this way (hence the name Champions League)--it, too, has been bastardized by including it seems every club in the top flight of each country (OK, slight exaggeration there :D) Here "winning the division" is a big deal, but not a huge deal. The have "baseball-ized" the playoff system too much. For one thing, the winners of the league should be given a buy alla Europe in our "CL".



    A decent temporary idea. Eventually, winning "Serie A" will be worth many times that, as it is in Italia/Europe.




    He can not do it alone, which is why MLS has got to "go for it" regarding Beckham Rule players. They need to draw X "Beckham" players (X=total # of MLS sides), and assign them by lottery to each MLS team. The league should pay their salaries. They need to "draft" players by "type" of football (let's say Serie A, Spain/Mexico and Premiership to start with) and assign them where they "naturally" fit: Serie A guys to New York, San Jose, Colorado, Chicago, Columbus and Toronto; Spain/Mexico to Chivas, LA, Dallas, Houston; Premiership everywhere else.

    IMHO :D
     
  14. We Were Cut

    We Were Cut Member

    Sep 9, 2000
    Woodland, CA
    Bill, I agree with all of your points. I don't see relegation or promotion ever happening in the States though-too much money to develop a team and fanbase to ever allow relegation. No owner in his right mind would ever allow the possibility of relegation. And I'm really happy to see Beckham in the league. He's a great supplier of the ball. Too bad he doesn't have anyone to pass it to on the Galaxy.
     
  15. billward

    billward Member

    Oct 22, 2002
    El Cerrito, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Regarding relegation, we can't easily imagine an economic reality and level of popularity that would enable pro/rel happening in the US, but I think it's a far preferable solution to the "too many teams" situation than to do what the NFL (and NASL in its peak) did, dividing teams up into lots of conferences/divisions/etc. And it's preferable to the MLB/NHL approach of having way too many games. It's just that we don't have the "too many teams" problem right now, so pro/rel is a solution without a problem to solve, thus it seems silly.

    As for the Galaxy, I think Pavon has some promise as a recipient of Beckham passes, and I'm sure others will find ways to do something with them as well. That team is such a mess right now but I think they'll get it figured out by next year.
     
  16. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    So if he becomes player/manager and he does poorly will he get fired or will he last out his playing (5 year) contract?
     
  17. We Were Cut

    We Were Cut Member

    Sep 9, 2000
    Woodland, CA
    That's really funny!
     
  18. We Were Cut

    We Were Cut Member

    Sep 9, 2000
    Woodland, CA
  19. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    "Before that there was Pele, Cruyff, Beckenbauer. It is difficult with David going there - I don't know what kind of impact he can make. David Beckham himself can't change the whole country."

    I'm the first to admit that the NASL was great league with great players and a great level of play and all but the problem with the league was , it folded! When you have a 12 year hiatus between pro leagues, you get a lot of turned off sports not to mention soccer fans. The NASL created a steppingstone to what we have today but this was also 30 years ago!

    Things are different now as we have committed owners building their own parks and (with the exception of Beckham) controlling costs.30 years ago you had Televisa, Lipton Tea and Gulf & Western literally buying and folding franchises. It was a revolving door effect. This is no longer the case in today's American soccer landscape. We have a 12 year old healthy league (whether we agree with what they do or not), a national team who is still not strong but hardly a joke of the Team America years and yanks playing in Europe. I don't think anyone could name even 1 player playing in Europe during those days, now we have 4 on one team!
     
  20. markmcf8

    markmcf8 Member+

    Oct 18, 1999
    Vancouver, WA, USA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yeah, with strange rules, odd scoring, no decent TV contract, and a lot of over the hill players. NASL was not a good league. Sorry. Add to that the folding and moving of teams, lack of US players on teams, and absurd pretensions of greatness. Nah, it wasn't a good league.

    MLS still has a lot of flaws. There are definitely problems with our league. But, they play futbol with the same rules as the rest of the world. That's a big step in the right direction. We don't have very many teams yet, but the ones we have aren't about to fold or move, well except for the moving of the DynamoHums. :mad: <deep breath> The league is solid financially, or at least, not in danger.

    We need not to go signing a bunch of expensive players that we cannot afford. We need to keep a lid on costs, raise the pay levels of the lowest paid players, such that we attract more US college players (and more US high school players).

    We need to grow the league slowly. I think that Garber is right to announce that the league will build to 16 teams and then stop for a bit. We need for the talent pool to increase in size. Oh, didn't I just say we need to pay the least well paid players better? Yeah, that would improve our depth, quality of players, and image all at once. Of course, it will also take a while for this change to have an impact.

    Promotion and relegation? That has to wait until we have a lot more teams as Bill said in his excellent post above. I also think that they only way to promotion and relegation is through single-entity. If the owners own a slice of the league, they will have more confidence that once sent down, their team will have a chance to move back up. Relegation is also a safety net for those teams that are not flush with cash.

    But we're way ahead of NASL already.

    GOOOOO QUAKES!!!!!! :D :D

    - Mark
     
  21. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Yes I agree however, as I stated, that was a different era. There was no TV contract in those days because there were no real channels as we have today. There was no Internet, no nada.

    There really can't be a comparison between the leagues. I do believe that the NASL still gets the short end of the stick in most peoples minds, however. If it wasn't for the NASL, there wouldn't have been a World Cup played in this country, a successful national team , a soccer discussion or for that matter an MLS start up. Therefore, we shouldn't keep knocking it but rather learn from their mistakes and try and emulate the positives instead of dwelling on the negatives of that league.
     
  22. DotMPP

    DotMPP 'Quakes fan in Stumptown

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jun 29, 2004
    Portland, OR
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    According to Becks, during a tirade in the locker room Sir Alex kicked a shoe that was in his way and it connected with Becks' noggin. It was an accident. (I read "Both Feet on the Ground" on a vacation a couple years back ;) )
     
  23. Earthshaker

    Earthshaker BigSoccer Supporter

    Sep 12, 2005
    The hills above town
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    But, the league had some great teams with great players. And MLS has yet to produce a rivalry comparable to what was seen between the three northwest clubs. Red Bull had to pay the way for 500-800 of their fans to go to DC. The Whitecaps could draw 5,000-8,000 of their fans to Seattle for a big game against the Sounders.
     
  24. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Exactly. The San Jose-LA rivalry was the leagues best and it was disbanded by the league. Thank God its been revived.

    As far as Portland, Vancouver and Seattle, they had a pretty long standing rivalry which has transcended to the USL. Teams in those cities wouldn't have been around today hadn't those earlier teams ever existed. I think the league is working in the right direction in bringing in young foreigners as opposed to the NASL's overage foreign stars. However, those stars were all pretty much world class, which I'm sure the MLS would die for.
     

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