B16 game. As players are lining up after the game to shake hands with the other team, you observe a player deliberately spit on his hand, leaving it there as he is walking towards the other team. As ref, what do you do?
Intervene before the handshakes and have kid step out of line so he doesn't shake any hands. Issue a red card for spitting at an opponent.
If I can guess why @socal lurker asked this question, I would imagine because he thinks you're on tenuous ground issuing the red card if you intervene before he actually shakes hands or approaches anyone to shake hands. And, if so, I tend to agree with him. If you intervene to stop the act, he's never spit on any one. He could argue that he was spitting on dirt that was covering hand because he was going to wipe it off before he shook hands or something similar. My gut here is that you engage in the preventative refereeing, stop him, inform the coach in a youth situation, and move on. I think the red card is going to create more headaches--on a variety of fronts--than its worth. But based on the initial reaction here, I suspect I'll be in the minority.
This came to me from an actual event. The R saw it (and confirmed it by asking the teammate next to him if he’d shake hands). The R gave a caution for USB. If the player went through the line that way, it’s an easy send off (I think OFFINABUS fits better than spitting at, as the player actually spat at his hand and this would be red even before they added spitting as a separate offense, but only a stupid protest board would get hung up on that distinction). But with the R stopping before any interaction with an opponent, I think both of those are harder conclusions. I lean to thinking a caution with a clear report to the competition authority is appropriate, and I think a competition authority could very reasonably decide a suspension was appropriate. But I was curious what others might think.
Previously the laws said "spits or attempts to spit"--rereading the current laws I no longer see that second part. Therefore I think your response is reasonable, but I would also feel a sending off is equally justifiable. Based on the current wording of the laws, I would write it as an offensive action.
if I'm reading this correctly this happened *after* the game. If you give a red, how long is the suspension and can anything be tacked on retroactively at this level?
This actually happened in a game that I centered. Right before he got to me in the handshake line, I saw a player cough (spit ) into his hand. When he reached out to shake , I grabbed him by the wrist and quickly wiped his hand on his jersey. Then I took his hand and shook it, all the while looking placidly at him.. WINNER!
Suspensions for red games are actually not listed in the LOTG. Most commonly the rules of competition state that a red card equals a one game suspension. Competition can always review red card suspension and lengthen them.
I'm assuming this is if the player is doing it before they shake your (the officials) hand ... it would be negligence if you saw it before they shook the hands of another player or team.
No, I'm saying I'm not going to see the spit in the first place, because I'm walking off the field. Obviously if you see it, you can't ignore it. I think policing the handshake line is not a useful endeavor, and I've been instructed by some great mentors not to do so.
I didn't realize officials could pick and choose when they were no longer responsible for policing interactions after a game. Is their a standard point after the final whistle where officials have to stay and monitor behavior? Perhaps that's different at certain levels?
Well, it entirely depends how quickly you can run off the field But really, there isn't a global standard, though different leagues/assignors may have their own expectations. For the vast majority of youth/amateur games, the referees will linger for a moment after the final whistle to intervene on any immediate blowups, and then start walking off the field. Some referees like to stand guard and watch while the players gather at their benches and then line up and shake hands. But absent specific instruction to do so -- you're probably not doing yourself any favors by doing this.
Per Law 5, referee’s authority to take disciplinary action ends when he leaves the field of play at the end of the match. This is what the other commentator is suggesting; he is suggesting deliberately leaving the field as quickly as possible to absolve himself if the authority (and responsibility) to take disciplinary action on the field. I really disagree with this approach. Unless there is a safety concern to the referee, why would you not stay? If you don’t like policing disciplinary situations between players, I think you’re in the wrong profession. And if something does happen in the handshake line, it’s better for there to be a neutral set of eyes to report what happened than to literally turn a blind eye to the situation.
I agree, but to play devils advocate here ... Officials don't want to baby sit after a game is over, and I don't blame them. There has to be a point where that responsibility is transferred to the folks who usually have it: coaches and parents. That being said, as a coach or a parent I would like to have a clearer idea of when I need to start being more aware of things happening on the field because the official is no longer keeping the peace. Players will notice if an official rushes off the field, and if there are any lingering resentments while the blood is still going some might be emboldened without the threat of suspension from an official. Also, @mudhen ... if I was a coach or parent and saw you do that to one of my kids, you and I are having words. Heated. To be followed up with your superiors and taking it as high as a I can go. It is insane to me that this behavior hasn't be called out yet by your peers, but instead has actually been upvoted. I don't care how much they deserve it. Don't touch players like that, especially kids.
My high school referee association has advised us to leave the field as soon as possible after the game ends.
After a high school game, there is a different authority that can take care of discipline problems, the schools themselves and they would prefer to handle anything internally. That is why we are told to leave quickly. After a FIFA match, the only authorities (competition) rely on the referee as their authority.
In Iowa, our state associations advise the same thing. For college, one of our conferences explicitly says to leave immediately. Honestly that does make sense. For other sports like football and basketball, the officials do not stick around long after the game is done. They meet and leave as quickly as possible. Now if I see something like this, I’ll address it. At the very least, I’m getting the coach, going with the coach to deal with the player before any handshakes occur, and reporting this. However, if the player has started to engage in handshakes, I’m sending off (likely under OFFINABUS, but I’ll clearly document the facts so I can still make the sendoff stick).
Same thing in AZ - about 2-3 years ago the directive came down to not stick around for handshakes and just get out of there. Fine with me ... for club games I'll linger a bit if a team wants to dap up the refs or if there's a coach I know we'll chat for a few minutes. Otherwise, head to the sideline, pack up, and go home.
I was never part of AYSO and it's been ages (like, close to two decades) since I've been at a youth USSF match where some sort of formalized handshake line post-match was expected. Like with professionals, there reaches a level in youth soccer where the formalized pre-match handshake is the expectation (if there is a walkout, of course) and anything post-match is ad hoc, informal, and between players who actually want to interact. That's what I'm used to dealing with. And you can either pretty much tell when it's good/smart to linger versus when it isn't OR you have some sort of delineated procedure regarding expecations and even post-match security. So my argument would be that below that level, where some sort of quasi-formal post-match handshake is taking place, it would all come down to your point here. If AYSO is saying the handshake is supposed to happen and you are to monitor it, then you have your marching orders. If, on the other hand, it's a tradition that is just expected between the two teams but the competition authority says nothing about it (which I suspect is true in the majority of USSF situations)... well, seems like a problem for the coaches and players to sort out. I wouldn't do anything silly like sprint off the field to show you're trying to absolve yourself of responsibility (particularly if any individuals are coming to you because they want to shake your hand). But I also wouldn't linger unnecessarily either (also, conversely, because it can invite dissent from anyone who wants to do something different than shake your hand).