Two players playing for Man Uniteds reserves, one named the best youth player and another scoring a lot of goals. So have we seen these guys in National camp? Any national camp? People are discussing, buddle versus casey, or how long before adu gets into camp and here we have two guys who are developing quite a reputation playing for one of the best teams in the world, albeit its reserve side. Nonetheless, it would be nice to hear that arena or rongon or whoever wants to "Take a look". What do you guys think? Bobles
Spector was in the last camp and of course was a U17 residency player. Cooper is not eligible for the next U20 championship, and the U23 team is in hiatus now.
So then my next question is, playing with the man u reserves, is that enough to garner a senior team look? Not just playing but excelling, or will it make us look desperate? Bobles
And why not, I do not think the Bruce has been faithful to his claim that your performance for your club team will get you a call up. I think a lot of people are equating premier league reserve games with REC games. What does it take to make it to the senior team, and is this always the case. I think not, in fact IMO I think these guys at least deserve to be called into camp, to practice with the veterens. Bobles
Reserves are not the same thing as first team. Period. There's a Cooper thread around here that has beaten this into the ground. First Division football is infinitely more valuable than reserve squads.
Bobles, I don't think "he's on ManU's reserves" necessarily qualifies one for national team duty. It is however, a very impressive thing on these guys' respective resumes. The national team staff is fully aware of both players. At the moment, we're putting together a squad for qualifying a month from now. We have four or five 18-21 year-old defenders who keep doing things to put themselves on the radar screen for the Nats, but I don't think any of them yet belong all that high on the central back depth chart among Pope, Bocanegra, Mastroeni, Gibbs, Berhalter, and Califf. As these guys improve, maybe there will never be a "Califf era." Maybe Borchers and Eddie Robinson will get surpassed by the young guns as well. Most of people's desire to get Spector and Cooper on the field is based on the ManU name, and not really on thinking through a 30-40 player depth chart and where they truly belong on it.
I think we're past giving benchwarmers call ups. Granted there have been exceptions: Lewis, Hejduk, KIROVSKI. Playing for a European reserve team doesn't cut it anymore. If they're as good as you say and their development continues they'll be in the first team at Man U or some other team. Just give them time...
Agreed. I hope I'm wrong, but it's probably gonna be years before Cooper gets capped for the USMNT. He's not gonna play first-team football unless SAF sells him -- when was the last time one of Manchester United's starting strikers was a product of their youth system?
if cooper and spector were in Southampton's setup, would we be seeing these threads every other week?
Hey I agree that we have grown as a national team, and that being on the reserves is not what it used to be, but it wasn't that long ago that both Donovan and Beas were 18 year olds that were helping us in qualifications. I know, they both had stellar youth careers, but that fact that these guys chose a Euro route and the whole Myernick debacle, I would take those things into account before I just said these were a couple of wet behind the ears youth players. Bobles
And how exactly is Bruce supposed to evaluate these players pre-camp?? Can he see them on TV....does he get film from the games? No, all he sees are match reports and an occasional coversation with their coach. On the basis of that you are suggesting he ask USSF to pay for two round trip transcontinental airfares and room and boarding? Just to get a look-see? I hope I never have to work for a company that has you calling the shots.
We have a winner! I'm a big Arsenal fan, but I don't go around starting threads saying Karbassiyoon and Simek should be getting called into the USMNT camps because they play for Arsenal's reserves and Simek is the captain of the reserves. OT: Tree, that is a great avatar.
Oh my God, what an ass you are, Like we have never done this before, like the premier league season is over, like our national team is the best in the world and we never have to evaluate new talent. I will tell you what, if I ever own a company then I will give you a call, you can clean the toilets and then I can fire your sorry ass for making dumbass comments, if you don't want to post then pull your finger out of your ass and click the forward button. Bobles
Cooper, Spector, Simek, Karbassiyoon, ect. should be brought into camp for evaluations and evlauations only. They are too young and inexperienced to be included in the senior set-up. Once they crack the first team and are playing decent minutes then they deserve a shot. They are just too far down in the depth chart now but will continue to be on the radar screen. We put too much emphasis on capping a player before its "too late." These kids are young and raw and is some respects they need to focus on club before country. They all know they are way down in the pecking order and thinking about the senior team now only pollutes them with false hope.
nice rebuttal. Name one player who Bruce has used that isn't getting regulaar 1st Team action. I can actually think of two off hand. But both were Vets and Bruce knew what they could provide. Can you name any players? You said Landon Donovan and DaMarcus Bealsey. Why not do a little research and take a look at how much playing time they were getting with their 1st Teams when they got their first CAPS under Arena. Also do the same for Bobby Convey, Clint Mathis, Josh Wolff, and Carlos Bocanegra. We are not the best team in the World. we DO NOT cap reservists. Go back and look at why Arena started Brad Freidel rather than Kasy Keller. Neither Spector nor Cooper should be called into camp until they are getting consistent minutes with a first team club. Period.
Well then maybe this is why we need to start the argument for a second team, maybe a Bradley coached team. Their are som many guys out there that need a closer look, that Bruce can't possibly evaluate them all and that is all I am asking for. I do not remember a time when we have had so many young players being or have been recruited by big name English clubs. They obviously see something in our guys but to see the same old national team get picked over and over and then tie Haiti 1-1, I start to think, well hell if these guys aren't going to put in an effort then lets see if we can get some fresh faces in there who will. Bobles
I don't think anyone that is saying Spector and Cooper should get a look in camp should be mocked on this board. And don't be obtuse either, punks. Anyone can understand how we want to see Spector and Cooper get experience early in their careers, rather than see Sanneh, Heydude, Armas, Allbright, Klein, Kirovski, et al get their umpteenth cap. Philosophically, I would have to include Reyna, Pope, Mathis, Wolff, McBride in this category as well. All I'm saying is that if friendlies don't count, then why not something like this (If it's gonna be a B team, then why not a B team that really stands to gain more from the experience?) Isn't that what Brazil does, send their U23 teams for major competitions and friendllies? And before you punks say it, I'm not saying we're Brazil- But with all their success, maybe their philosophy has some bearing on their success. For example, for a friendly, why not: ------------------Walker--------------------- Borchers----Marshall---Cochrane---Burciaga --------------Simek-----Spector----------- --------------Mapp------Gaven------------ -------------------Adu-------------------- ------------------Cooper------------------ God forbid, this team may surprise, and push our senior team. It seems as though this approach is more consistent with Bruce's philosophy, "it's becoming a young man's game." OK, now you guys can trash me for going against the unwritten laws of international soccer. Meanwhile, we can all look forward to either hot or cold, our A team, or a bunch of guys we're tired of seeing. I say we let them get their asses kicked, and learn in the process. Being in camp alone doesn't do it, IMHO. Let the trashing begin. E Diddy
------------------Walker--------------------- Borchers----Marshall---Cochrane---Burciaga --------------Simek-----Spector----------- --------------Mapp------Gaven------------ -------------------Adu-------------------- ------------------Cooper------------------ I'll tell you what this might b they line-up in 5 years time. Obviously you could alternate Walker with Howard. If these guysall pan this could be the line-up that puts us in the semis of WC '10.
Playing great in youth tournaments or reserve set ups is very deceptive. Probably 10% will make it. Figo was not a good youth player..in his pro-career he was a great player. The highly regarded Kanu was great at the U17 WorldCup..In his pro-career he is an averige player. Benny McCarthy was a very promising youth Ajax prospect...Celta Vigo( a reject) and F.C Porto..he is or was unable to exploit his skills. It's very hard judging youth players......"potential" , it is only that. Let them play some pro games first , and if they can hang with the big boys..then summon them
Agreed and the camp should be an U23 camp. I cnat believe some people think thats these kids should be a part of the nat camp just because of some reserve soccer in England. Kirovski played for Man U reserves now look where he is, Thorrington played for Man U reserves too and look where he is too, what about James Bishop and the numerous others who have gone over seas thinking they were gonna make it big. Just because american kids go over seas that doesnt mean anything. Our worst MLS kid deserves a shot over these guys......for example youre gonna call in 4 young guys over Mapp, Gaven, B. Davis, K. Gray, Capano, Beckerman, Salyer, Marshall, Magee, Clark, Cochrane, and even Jeff Parke.......... Get Serious people England reseves dont mean Sh^t
You guys are ****************s..... he is talking about a Pre-National team camp for our young European Based Players, Just to let them know that they are in the US National Team Picture... Call Spector and Cooper from Man Utd, Whitbread (Liverpool), Johson and Yelldell (Blackburn), Karbasiyoon and Simek of Arsenal, Wheah Jr. (AC Milan), Szetela (soon to sign with Everton) and just add Adu for the Hell of it.... just to let this kids know that they are in the set up, Let them play games against a brazil U20 sqaud or any European Reserve Team.... we are not saying to go play them next to Claudio and Clint just yet.