You're right, that was uncalled for. Its not about right or wrong. Its about opinions. And quite frankly, not too many people will take on this supposed "anti-supports groups" argument because its very easily to be labeled as someone who sits on their hands.....
Agreed. And honestly, this counter-argument is not against your or the Ratz, it is me feeling there is a predominant attitude among supporters that they are not getting enough, but I feel that their demands are too high...
GPK, I don't think the supporters demands (for the most part) are too high. I think I can sum up what every supporters group wants in just a few points: 1. A dedicated section where supporters can stand, sing, wave flags, play drums, etc. WITHOUT getting hassled by either security or the "soccer-mom" set. As an aside, this isn't that hard to do, given the massive availability of seats in just about every MLS stadium. 2. A little respect from the teams front office. The supporters DO buy season tickets and probably spend more on merchandise than the "soccer-mom" set. And they provide the atmosphere free of charge. Try to imagine a Metrostars game without the ESC or DC United without La Norte and the Screaming Eagles/Barra Brava or, even beter, the Fire without Section 8. That's really it. Sachin
As the Section 8ers seem to be the prime example of a team's supporter group(s) being a success, can any Chicago fans give us a run down of your interaction with club officials? I'm curious to see how things are run around the league
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Soccertown USA You're right, I guess it doesn't really matter as long as they don't get in my way/bother me, then who cares. I'm paying more to support a team, if everyone else doesn't want to, not much I can do about it. Thanks for opening my eyes. It'll be nice next year to have a sellout pretty much every game for the G's, however i'm moving to London, so I won't be able to see any of it =( On the bright side i'll have some good stuff to watch anyways.
I honestly don't know why so many people think that it's an either-or proposition with respect to supporters groups and "soccer moms." GPK seems to think so and too many MLS team front offices seem to think so. (And not that I'm picking on you, GPK, but you just happen to the lead voice of dissent in this thread.) Frankly, the two best front offices in this league, Dallas and Chicago, have done a good job accomodating both groups of fans. And while the road hasn't always been completely smooth, there's enough goodwill between the respective front offices and the supporters that very few people are talking about cancelling their season tickets. Certainly not publicly. I think that many MLS front offices need to understand is that both groups of fans can peacefully co-exist and that you don't need to take away from one to give to another. Does it take imagination? Yes. Is there a possibility that you might have to do things a little differently than you're accustomed to? Yes. But it can be done. In Dallas, one entire side of the stadium is general admission and is referred to as "the festive side," while the other side is reserved seating and is referred to as "the family side." Voila! You've got the two groups 75 yards away from one another and there are few complaints from either side. In Chicago, they have Section 8 and they go out of their way to tell anyone that might be interested that it's not going to be "soccer smiles" in there. And accomodating both groups of fans should be done. After all, the people in the supporters groups can be the easiest sales they're ever going to make. Treat 'em with respect and they'll show up for every game and buy season tickets, no matter what stupid promotion you're running. Wednesday night game? They're there. Open Cup game they're there. Rain? Shine? They're there. And they'll buy shirts and replica and stuff. And I think that they demand precious little in return. Give 'em a place where they can do their thing, don't subject 'em to a bunch of hassle from soccer moms because they stand or because they're too loud, don't subject 'em to hassle from security outside of serious lawbreaking, and treat them with a little respect because they're easy sales and they add a little bit of atmosphere. That's all there is to it.
I must not be clear enough in my discussion. I don't not think for one second that it is an either or prop. I think if you have situations such are 70% of the markets (exempt DC, Chicago, Dallas), the percentage of hardcore supporters are greatly outnumbered by the "casual fan". I don't doubt for one second if the Revolution suddenly had 10K additional fans, who fell into the "hardcore" category, that the Revs would open the entire lower bowl and do the family/fanatic side thing like Dallas does. I think supporters groups need to look in the mirror more, try harder to understand the concerns of the front office and be a little less demanding of their time, resources, etc.. Get a section....have fun...grow it...Grab a second section.... Fenway Park has "family sections" with no alcohol. Yankee Stadium doesn't sell beer in the blechers for security reasons...Don't like it, don't sit there...If its for you, great. Your list is alot shorter than others I've seen on the boards over the past few years....
Not that this makes it better because it's foreign, but the Euro stadiums I've been to (Milan, Juve, Man U, Parma, Verona, Bologna) all have their supporters in a single section of the stadium, as well as a designated section for visiting fans (Parma's has a netted, plexi glass surrounding for the visitors, it's amusing sitting there.) These sections may be a little section, they may be an entire tier (usually the second of two or three tiers.) Not every fan in Italy stands and cheers with flairs in hand for 90 minutes. Both sections along the touch line (and sometimes an end line as well) are all seated sections. The atmosphere at these games which seems so much greater than ours actually originates from the one, well organized section Not everyone is going to be hardcore. Not everyone wants to sit down either. Especially since MLS has the "luxury" of open seats, one would think it wouldn't be challenging to accomodate both sets of fans.
YES!! thats what they want!!! But the problem is getting that section. And even when you DO get it they STILL hassle you. Thats all supporters want anything else is icing on the cake. ALl supporters group want is to have a section to do what they want. Give them that and they wont complain about mascots or crappy shite like that. Although I do agree that muzak is a bit annoying for ANY fan.
I dunno, but I dunno what Kearney has to do with Soccertown USA either. Anyways... so why is Kansas City the title of this thread? Boo-yah Jeff! We still remember.