Soccertown USA

Discussion in 'MLS: General' started by GreatZar, Sep 3, 2002.

  1. GreatZar

    GreatZar Member

    Colorado Rapids
    United States
    Mar 29, 1999
    Denver, CO, USA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Rapids need just under 16,000 for their final match (ball give-away night sure to exceed this number) to have a season average of 20K/game. So you might think I'd be spouting off that Denver is Soccertown, USA.

    ***WRONG***

    The Rapids front office has become an amazing selling machine for everything. Kids shirts, soccer balls, pre-game food, new Invesco Field, bobbleheads, fireworks, charity runs, Broncos wives vs Rapids wives, double-headers w/Yanks, and double-headers w/WUSA. At least it's not Beach Boy concerts and beanie babies anymore (somewhat soccer related events these days).

    Meanwhile, what have the Rapids done for core fans?

    1) Fan appreciation night where people WITHOUT season tickets get to buy a ticket for any seat in the house for end-line prices.

    2) Supporters section moved to behind the end-line from touch-line near the top of the 18.

    3) Badgering of fans by stadium announcer "come on Denver, make some noise." Has opposite effect...in fact it tells the casual fan that this game atmosphere is PATHETIC. If the PA kept quiet, I think the fans would generate their own atmosphere (but the PA guys are used to baseball, basketball, hockey, etc games where fans only cheer when told to do so).

    4) At the 80-85 minute, during run of play, they play a "cool" video called peanut butter jelly and pipe music in to get kiddies to dance and shake their tail (so cameras can pan stadium for cute kiddies with spirit).

    5) Rapidman (mascot) roams stadium during run of play throwing t-shirts into the audience if they *SCREAM* loud enough.

    6) After having a unique identity for 6 years with green uniforms, announce that they're changing to black and blue to match their team's new attitude. For those of you who are attached to teams that have constantly changed colors, this might not be a big deal (you might even be happy about color change if you're a KC fan). But this is similar to the Columbus Crew going black and blue and abandoning black/gold. Nice to know that the Rapids will now be impossible to distinguish from Quakes, Wiz, and Revs.

    7) We hear the Galaxy (another Anschutz team) is stealing our green identity.

    8) Constant ticket sales INSIDE supporters sections (even behind the end-line) to people who are "shut up and sit down" types. While this doesn't stop us, it causes a issue with security frequently because there's no Rapids front office support to tell security to leave us alone. We basically have to shout down security and the fans who refuse to move to better seats.

    While we don't have muzak playing during run of play (other than PB&J thing near the end of a match), I'll suspect it will start again next year. Why?

    Because this supporter has had it.

    And the Rapids probably don't care. They can sell tickets so well, that having supporters probably means nothing to them. I actually believe they hate supporters because the "shutup and sit down" crowd they sell tickets to complain about the noise we make (and then they feel obliged to make amends to these freak baseball fans who prefer a nice quiet atmosphere so they can talk with their friends rather than watch the game).

    And I'm sure the Rapids front office will come on here and tell me how lucky I am (as a supporter) to be able to buy $100 season tickets and that I should shut the f-up and be happy with the glorious atmosphere generated at Invesco Field.

    Next year, I'll be buying $15-$20 single game tickets (for every single game) for the year to continue and support the game itself. I could give a Ratz @$$ how cheap the tickets are. I bought a loaded Honda Accord V6 because they sponsor MLS fur krist sakes. But they've pushed this Rat too far and I won't be running the River Ratz next year. They've proven to me that they don't value the adult supporter in Denver.

    When the Rapids stop treating the Denver soccer fans like Broncos/Avs/Nuggets/Rockies fans (you're just a cog in the machinery that desires corporate seat buys and sterile canned kiddie atmosphere), I'll return to leading a supporters club (if they want me back). But since they want just another "major league" fan, I'll be just that. A "shut up and sit down" quiet fan that feeds them the money they want in return for being able to watch the game I love in a nearby stadium.

    If you thought MLS' niche was appealing to the common fan (cheap entertainment with fan driven atmosphere), don't come to Denver.
     
  2. jmeissen0

    jmeissen0 New Member

    Mar 31, 2001
    page 1078
    i can fully understand you being upset, but what can you possibly change by doing this?

    if you don't stand up to them, how will things change for the better?
     
  3. GreatZar

    GreatZar Member

    Colorado Rapids
    United States
    Mar 29, 1999
    Denver, CO, USA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What would I do if I ran the Rapids to counter-act the above mentioned (itemized) garbage?

    1) Fan appreciation would be free beer/meal when presenting season ticket to concessions for one night. I'd also say getting a decent International match to Denver, but I think the Rapids have tried this and the cost is prohibitive.

    2) Supporters section at the touch-line 18 yards from end-line (like it has been from 1999-2001). Black-out seats from Ticketmaster for first 10 rows and black out seats in section closer to endline next to supporters. Sell tickets to blacked out section seats either at the front office (to people who know what they're getting into) or at the box office day-of-game (with warnings of excessive noise and "obstructed view"). Have a Rapids rep reintroduce security to allowing people with a ticket anywhere in the house to allow them to come to supporters section EVERY SINGLE GAME (yes there is that much turnover in security here). In addition, have Rapids rep be present for first 10 minutes of match to be there to nip problem cases in the bud (relocate for people that would call the office the next day complaining about view/noise).

    3) Have stadium announcer SHUT UP. Never direct fans to cheer (let Denver create their own atmosphere). Other announcements prior to goal kicks.

    4) Shvte can the peanut butter jelly dance during run of play. Never play any music during play.

    5) Have Rapidman only come out during injury delays, pre-game, and at half. THAT'S IT. If you want to give away a bunch of t-shirts, announce seat numbers for winning tickets during half (pickup prize at gate #? anytime).

    6) Keep green for primary uniform color. If you want to sell black and blue merchandise, go crazy. Just keep the primary kit green. Hell, make a third kit black/blue and sell that if you want. You've developed a tradition. If you ditch it, you'll never have the tradition of a European/SAmerican club. Celtic, Nigeria, and Ireland fans don't have a problem w/green. Why should we?

    7) If Galaxy wants green, that's up to them. We've been green all along. But if you switch green from one Anschutz team to another, you're treating all of MLS like the rest of the major leagues in this country. NFL teams can change colors because they have waiting lists for seats and corporate box buys that pay for everything (the little fan barely matters). MLS' best selling point is supposed to be how we're different from the other major leagues and we care about the individual. Do something like this, and you'll out-n-out loose fans.

    8) See #2 above.

    I guess I'm done spouting off...
    :(
     
  4. GreatZar

    GreatZar Member

    Colorado Rapids
    United States
    Mar 29, 1999
    Denver, CO, USA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't think things will change for the better (with or without me). They (Rapids) can sell tickets and they don't care.

    Banging my head against a brick wall for long enough only produces bumps. Only an idiot continues...the wall isn't getting hurt by the activity.
     
  5. GPK

    GPK BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 5, 1999
    San Diego, CA
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Another hard core fan that thinks the league owes them something more than the other 15-20K that attend matches.....

    I am getting so sick of this attitude.
     
  6. _chachi

    _chachi New Member

    Mar 15, 1999
    new jersey, usa
    what does this thread have to do with kearny, nj?
     
  7. metrocorazon

    metrocorazon Member

    May 14, 2000
    I dont see how most of his points dont benefit the other 15K in the stadium.
     
  8. eric d

    eric d Member

    Sep 9, 1998
    Spoken like someone who actually has no clue about what being a SUPPORTER really is.

    Keep the flock mooving. Baaah Baah.
     
  9. GPK

    GPK BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 5, 1999
    San Diego, CA
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As if you know me....

    Count me in for one who could care less about eric d's top 10 ways to demonstrate his support for a soccer club....
     
  10. eric d

    eric d Member

    Sep 9, 1998


    Fixed your post!


    I don't make lists. That's what your sooooo good at.
     
  11. GPK

    GPK BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 5, 1999
    San Diego, CA
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Fixed yours. This isn't about me eric d. Its not about GreatZar specifically either. I hear this kind of stuff from Revs fans (surprise), Fire fans, Crew fans...every team.....

    Some big supporters tend to feel like they are owed something becuase they formed a supporters group or have season tickets. I say ************************. By tickets and go to the match, or don't. We are consumers.

    Why should we get a free beer or hot dog because we come to every match? Why should a team have to close down sections becuase 4-10 rows of people want to stand?

    If 15-20 thousand hard cores could fill the stands each match...great...otherwise, its a give and take...

    I'm hearing to much about taking.....
     
  12. eric d

    eric d Member

    Sep 9, 1998
    Right. Why don't you just say, soccer is a CONSUMER PRODUCT not a SPORT. I want to be a supporter not a consumer. You think otherwise. And psst, guess what Soccer can make it without being sold out to consumer interests.

    Half the teams in this league do not DESERVE their hardcore fans. Guess what those few leave and this league will go no farther than the WUSA.

    Did you ever work for the MLS?
     
  13. weasel

    weasel New Member

    Oct 31, 2000
    NYC
    I hear you on this one. I have the same problem with the DCU front office/stadium staff.

    I attended all the '96 games for DC, and have been a season ticket holder for the last 6 seasons. Throughout this time, I've been paying for "VIP" - midfield, under cover - seating at about $22/game with season tickets, and $28 for single game tickets for friends and family. The staff at the games never check tickets, so anyone can buy a cheap end-line ticket and sit wherever they want.

    I'm not buying tickets next year because I'm tired of subsidizing all the seat-hoppers. I've talked to DC staff numerous times and they have never done anything to address the problem, despite their assurances. There's a limit to my patience and it's finally been exceeded. I'm sure they don't really care, but at least I'll feel better. Besides, there's always the EPL on Fox. Screw 'em.
     
  14. GreatZar

    GreatZar Member

    Colorado Rapids
    United States
    Mar 29, 1999
    Denver, CO, USA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I will say the Rapids don't owe me a thing. And I don't owe them a thing either. And come next year when I stop paying $600 for 6 season tix (when there's only 4 in my family and I only use 1.5-2 season tix a year on average) and begin paying for actual butts in seats at $200/season, we'll be even.

    I'd also like to recount a cute instance that happened a few weeks ago. A dozen or so college age people decided they wanted to do the "supporter thing." They joined the Ratz during the first half since the Rapids were attacking the goal directly in front of our section. For the second half, they went to the opposite corner of the field. Within 10 minutes, the "sit down and shut up" crowd had summoned security and had them EVICTED from the section for simply being too loud. Security told them the only place where that kind of support was allowed was in section 129 (Ratz Nest). Ideally, the security should tell these "fans" "I'm sorry, your at a soccer match" (again, IMHO).

    I'm sure that will grow new supporters to replace me post haste.

    My desire is simply to have an atmosphere that will grow the sport (in my eyes). I've been willing to take shvte seats and be a super extrovert for 6 years. Whatever progress that was made has been lost and it's time for this putz to step aside.
     
  15. GPK

    GPK BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 5, 1999
    San Diego, CA
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Re: Soccertown USA

    How do these people affect your enjoyment of the match?

    I never understood why people get so irate about people who have the balls to move up to better seating at an event. If they're in your seats, move 'em. Otherwise, how do you know they're in the wrong ones and what does it matter in the end?

    Also, explain how you are subsidizing seat hoppers?
     
  16. GPK

    GPK BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 5, 1999
    San Diego, CA
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    For me consumers=supports 95% of the time when it comes to attending games.

    Why is it a sellout if the Fire gets multiple complaints about a chant or the Revs get multiple complaints about standing and the groups are asked to make concessions.....

    Your attitude about the teams not deserving the hardcore fans is the attitude I'm taking about...What makes any of us feel we deserve the right to have special privilages and dictate the volume of the loadspeaker?


    No, I haven't. Why, did you?
     
  17. eric d

    eric d Member

    Sep 9, 1998
    I ask nothing special. Just to be treated properly. I haved paid for season tickets since '96 and bought multiple game tickets as well. I have been ************ on by the Metros and their cohorts in the NJSEA since day one. I am tired of it, and they don't deserve my blind faith anymore. I will not be re-upping next year unless some drastic changes are made.

    What about that attitude is so wrong?

    (PS Your "attitdue" is what reeks up the front offices of the league and the MLS HQ).
     
  18. GPK

    GPK BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 5, 1999
    San Diego, CA
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Believe me, I hate this as well. I've come close to blows at a few Nats games because I like sitting at midfield and I'm nuts....

    But the way to do this is educate. Shouldn't you have told those college kids that they'd be shut down elsewhere?

    Soccer Mom and Dad are not going to go along with this. There are "supporters" sections in England as well....we need to focus on ways of building those sections one at a time...not by trying to demand that the organization do it our way or we're gone....
     
  19. profiled

    profiled Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 7, 2000
    slightly north of a mile high
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Re: Re: Re: Soccertown USA

    It sucks when I pay 28$ for a good ticket, and some clown pays 10$ for a cheap ticket, yet gets to sit in the same good seats as me.

    It's like the whole free ticket thing, if you give out free tickets, and people know that it will happen, people don't buy tickets because they can get them for free.

    Same thing, why should I spend almost 3 times as much to get the same damn seat?
     
  20. GreatZar

    GreatZar Member

    Colorado Rapids
    United States
    Mar 29, 1999
    Denver, CO, USA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    In 1996 when I was a "normal" fan, you could hear crickets at Mile High Stadium (when they weren't playing muzak). That quiet morgue-like atmosphere is what I tried to eliminate. That is what "supporters" help give MLS: atmosphere.

    Sounds like GPK would rather the supporters atmosphere didn't exist and would rather a nice quiet game of footy. His choice.
     
  21. GPK

    GPK BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 5, 1999
    San Diego, CA
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm sure that the saint you are, you've never done anything to provoke the NJSEA either.

    How is that I go to 12-16 matches a year and I never run into all the trouble that I hear so many other people talk about? I'm just lucky I guess.
     
  22. GPK

    GPK BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 5, 1999
    San Diego, CA
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Did you actually read my post?
     
  23. eric d

    eric d Member

    Sep 9, 1998
    It easy. You are just an arsehole. You assume that I know nothing about you, yet you assume plenty about me. Ha. Good for a laugh. Let see everyone else is wrong and you by your lonesome must be right. Makes sense to me.
     
  24. GreatZar

    GreatZar Member

    Colorado Rapids
    United States
    Mar 29, 1999
    Denver, CO, USA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Didn't know it would happen. Absolutely floored me when they told me their experience. And they assured me it wasn't an issue of language. Simply noise ("Go Rapids" simple chants and such).
    The Ratz began in section 101. Moved at the request of the team to 109. Then switched to 115 when we upset too many people and the Rapids didn't back up their promised support. Moved to 121 and bothered no one. Moved to 128 at request of team and lived there for 3 years with lots of problems and luke warm support from Rapids. Moved to 129 in new stadium at request of team.

    I'd say the Ratz have been more than accomodating.
     
  25. GPK

    GPK BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 5, 1999
    San Diego, CA
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Re: Re: Re: Soccertown USA

    Because you have the dough and you feel better about buying good ticket. I'm just not sure how people know about these "clowns" and if they do, they should say that "the other part of my group sits there" or something....

    You shouldn't have that problem at all next year though
     

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