England has to do what's right for England on public health issues, but I'll say this: I'm not a smoker, but I was against the smoking ban in NYC when it occurred. But since it went into effect I don't know a single person, smoker or non-smoker, who hasn't seen it as a good thing. And for all the fears that it would kill the bar scene, bar revenues are up since the ban was enacted. The libertarian in me still thinks the employee health argument is a bit silly and that we're better-off without laws like these, but it's not the end of the world.
I do hope you're not referring to those daft little signs saying 'smoking area'. I don't know about Dutch smoke but, unfortunately, the English variety can't seem to read very well and seems to completely ignore them. Although in theory the market would be able to provide a complete range of options for every eventuality, back here on planet earth the reality is that... 1. Smoking areas don't work because smoke can't read as mentioned above. 2. Pub-owners will never knowingly turn away business regardless of how much danger there is to their staff or other members of the public, and, 3. Bar staff aren't usually doing the job as an alternative to being the boss of a major international petrochemical or software business so have little choice but to accept the danger.
What the hell is wrong with the English educational system??? Or are you just plain dumb? Either way, I'm starting to get worried. 1. S-E-G-R-E-G-A-T-I-O-N...segregation...SEGREGATION. (I really hope I spelled that right btw). Can your little brain figure out what I mean by that? 2. Nice try, but if turning a part of your business away means a lot of new business from non-smokers... 3. Yeah... bar staff is like... one step up from selling your ass on the street. Get real. And R-E-A-D for god's sake... there's plenty of smoking bar staff out there... they have no problem working in the smoking area or in a pub that does allow smoking. I have a feeling I'll have to spell it out about 10 more times before you start to understand what I mean. But we'll get there.
You mean segregation - fine. There are several ways of doing that... a. Having seperate rooms which implies a particular layout of the pub where the bar covers both areas at the same time. However, the smoke still goes in between the rooms through the bar, doesn it. b. Having a bar to cover each area area, or, c. Having those bloody silly little signs I mentioned. Most UK pubs have the last one. OK? numbnuts. Jesus H. Christ, pal... you're from Holland and you're trying to tell me about British pubs... now you're trying to tell me about business when I've been in it for over 30 years. Try and wrap your one remaing brain cell around this idea. Businesses don't like to take risks if they can avoid it. OK? Any risks they DO take they want to be absolutely sure the possibility of failure has been minimised as much as possible. That's a FACT. No businessman worthy of the name is going to risk the loss of his existing clientele for the possible benefits of gaining another one. What's the point? In any event pubs already COULD do this. How many non-smoking pubs do you think there are in the UK? Not bloody many, that's for sure. I can only think of one in a 30 mile radius of me. That's why we need compulsion. Uh huh? http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/special_report/1999/04/99/minimum_wage/304424.stm 'There are currently about 1.9m people earning below the minimum wage, according to the Low Pay Commission (LPC). More than half of them are concentrated in seven sectors: Cleaners, sales assistants, care assistants, bar staff, catering assistants, waiters and clerks.' These figures, which are the most recent I can find quickly, indicate that at that time 21% of male bar staff and 35% of female bar staff earned less than £3.60, (that's about 5.10 euros or $6.60), an hour... roughly 190 euros/$200 a week AND roughly a quarter of THOSE earn 20% less than THAT. Now will you please be quiet and stop embarrassing yourself.
I wasn't talking about the current situation. And I think it's very well possible to have smoking rooms with a filter system... I'm talking pubs in general. You poor thing. I guess we should just be happy you're on of the lucky ones that got to work in that business instead of selling your ass... right? Okay... you got me there. The smoking rooms are still an option in otherwise smoke free pubs. You don't do tipping? Over here a job as a waiter/waitress or just about anywhere in that sector is hard work, but very good pay. Nehhhh....
This law is being introduced in the UK though. The proposed law WILL allow smoking in pubs where no prepared food is served. Personally I think that's a mistake. Tipping??? For bar-staff in a pub??? You're kidding, right?
Now I know why I would not want to be a waiter in the UK... Here In germany they get tips (well, not when they do the cleaning up, but at least if they serve...) And if you'd just have good air cicle systems in your pubs it would not be a problem. Why don't they just make a law saying that if they have that kind of system they are allowed to have at least an area for smokers??? And then the ppl cleaning the pub afterwards don't suffer anything...
Serving??? What's that? http://www.sirc.org/publik/ptpchap1.html 'Rule number one: There is no waiter service in British pubs. You have to go up to the bar to buy your drinks, and carry them back to your table. One of the saddest sights of the British summer (or the funniest, depending on your sense of humour) is the group of thirsty tourists sitting at a table in a pub, patiently waiting for someone to come and take their order' That's the thing about foriegners... no sense of humour
Let's see... In England => Can't smoke Can't hunt foxes Can't carry a firearm Can't find a dentist Can't drive on right side of road Any wonder why the best of England headed for the Colonies?
As a smoker in Boston, where the ban's been ongoing for 18 months now (a statewide ban started this May), I can tell you that while I disagree from a civil liberties standpoint, it's not all that bad. I agree that this is something that should be set by the markets. However, I don't really mind it. It's a minor inconvenience to go outside, plus you meet people out there. It does suck in the winter though. Some also argue about lost business. Hasn't really happened here. I doubt it would happen in the UK if it were passed nationwide.