Sky Blue vs Red Stars (Again)

Discussion in 'Chicago Red Stars' started by galsoccer907, Apr 20, 2010.

  1. kool-aide

    kool-aide Member+

    Feb 1, 2002
    a van by the river
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  2. galsoccer907

    galsoccer907 New Member

    Mar 28, 2010
    Galveston
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Yeah, it's delayed because of the FSC game unfortunately.

    Asllani was taken off the field.
     
  3. Smulan

    Smulan Member

    Apr 3, 2008
    Asllani? Matchtracker says Lloyd's injured :confused:.
     
  4. ForeverLOST108

    ForeverLOST108 Member+

    Jan 23, 2010
    Orlando
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Another loss. Outshot them 17-8. New coach anyone? :mad:
     
  5. Fanaddict

    Fanaddict Member+

    Mar 9, 2000
    streamwood IL USA
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    One goal in 3 games is not acceptable. Something must be done,tactics or personnel?
     
  6. ForeverLOST108

    ForeverLOST108 Member+

    Jan 23, 2010
    Orlando
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Especially with the number of shots we've had! New coach maybe? I'd like to see her game comments for today's game. If its another, "We had our chances but it just wasn't our night", I'm going to ask for them to find a replacement. I dont know what they've been focusing on at practice, but its NEEDS to be finishing.
     
  7. WPS fan 55

    WPS fan 55 New Member

    Mar 8, 2010
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Just watching the game, their final pass in the last 3rd of the field isn't there which is needed to even have the chance to shot
     
  8. ratdog

    ratdog Member+

    Mar 22, 2004
    In the doghouse
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Two thoughts:

    1) If the officiating crew today were not a completely incompetent disgrace to the game of soccer, we'd be credited with two goals. As an American soccer fan who has had to watch crappy USSF refs for decades, I can say that those assclowns today were in the top 5 list of all-time worst officials. The ARs were probably the worst I've seen in years. During one of Sky Blue's attacks late in the game, the near side AR had her flag up BEFORE THE PASS WAS KICKED. And, of course, the THREE blown offsides calls decided this game. The first one that called back our first goal was at least a close call. The replay showed it was wrong but you can at least see how the error was made. The second that gifted SBFC an undeserved goal and the third that took away our second goal were not even close and there is NO EXCUSE for those blunders.

    2) Even though we should have had two goals today that were taken away by incompetent ARs, we still wasted chance after chance after chance. The reasons are fairly simple. First, Cristiane is fat and out of shape. It's like watching Paul Gascoine as his career wound down. She needs to hit the gym because she is slow, not sharp, and even with her undoubted dribbling skills, she's ineffective. Second, Emma STILL hasn't figured out the Ella Masar is the type of forward who makes the slashing run into space and needs the ball at her feet. Third, both last year and this year, the forwards we signed do not match Emma's strategy. We had/have the best wing combination in the league with Rapinoe and Carney who are supposed to pump crosses into the box. Fine, but we have NEVER had the Wambach/Cheney/Sinclair-type forward playing who can receive those. Instead , all of our forwards are short and need the ball at their feet, not their heads. Maybe McDonald can be our target forward, I don't know. But she's not playing. And the mismatch between strategy and personnel will continue to haunt us and limit our goal scoring production until we either change our strategy or bring in a target forward to pair with Asllani or Masar until Cristiane gets into proper playing shape.
     
  9. sisyphus

    sisyphus Member

    Apr 17, 2009
    Club:
    Chicago
    agreed on the officials tonight, just rewatched on webcast and its what we all saw in stadium - at least 1-1 and more likely 1-0 CRS. this is a maddening game and i can't help but wonder how we'd all be feeling if a few of these shots go in over the first 3 weeks -- and make no mistake they are a razor thickness from scoring many times. the personnel upgrades this year make a huge difference. bizarrely we were undefeated through first 4 last year and played worse. 21 games to go and much to build on. defense also playing very well compared to last year. I don't know how to blame the missed open shots on coach.
     
  10. ForeverLOST108

    ForeverLOST108 Member+

    Jan 23, 2010
    Orlando
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I also agree on the officials. Cristiane was clearly NOT offsides when she scored. There were at least 2 SBFC defenders behind her. Ridiculous. That was a HORRIBLE call. But we cant just use poor officials as an excuse.


    Oh and look at what Hayes said -

    "I thought Sky Blue came out aggressively in the first half, in the first 20 I thought they had the better of the play. But once we settled down and got on the ball and got our midfield involved I thought we got more dangerous as the first half progressed, and we dominated the latter stages of that period. I think the weather had an impact on the quality of our end product, but anyone who knows me knows I'm not an excuse maker."

    Hmmm
     
  11. ratdog

    ratdog Member+

    Mar 22, 2004
    In the doghouse
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's like a repeat of last year where the defense was mostly solid and our midfield effective (except Loyd) but we just can't score. Last year, we could blame bad luck for SOME of that but after a while if the problem is consistent enough (and by now it is) you have to look at what is going wrong.

    I mean, yeah, part of it really is bad luck (and crappy refs) but that's by far not the whole story. Part of the problem is were creating chances but they're low percentage chances because we have two small forwards going against big defenders and we're trying to pump crosses into them and so our middies and defenders end up taking outside shots. Part of it is we're not maximizing our resources (the whole "why don't we get a target forward to make better use of Rapinoe and Carney" or "why don't we play to Cristiane/Asllani/Masar's FEET" things). And part of it is we have no aerial game so we're missing one potential style of attack that would make us less predictable.

    Finally, if the scoring problem really IS 100% with the players and not at all with the coach, why did we not upgrade our starting talent at forward? We brought in midfielders and defenders but only McDonald as a true forward (yeah yeah, Nogueira and Asllani are listed as "forwards" -then again so is Carney :confused: !!- but they all currently usually play in midfield). And we gave up our one consistent goal scorer in Tarpley to boot!

    Like Karen said in the post-game interview, we're not a bad team. We have individual talent out the wazoo. And it's still early days. But we're not making the most of what we have and we're missing something in our attack. Those are Emma's responsibility and I'm sorry to come out and say this, but at some point we really have to at least start questioning some of Emma's strategic and personnel decisions.
     
  12. ratdog

    ratdog Member+

    Mar 22, 2004
    In the doghouse
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The last thing Emma should do now is start calling out players. They already know they f-ed up and are likely feeling incredibly down now. You don't want to feed the doubt that is now almost certainly to starting creep into their game and risk making them not want to shoot or attack for fear of more failure.

    And Emma is limited to what she can say about the real cause of the loss which was the three horrible officiating decisions that directly decided the outcome of the game.

    That said, Emma did say she will make changes if needed. It's not panic button time yet but it's close and we need to do something.
     
  13. weipenguigumbi

    weipenguigumbi New Member

    Dec 4, 2007
    I understand the negative feelings, but:

    1. Personnel: The right players aren't even in the game, not because Haye's doesn't want them there, but because they're not fit enough to play the required time due to injury. Sitch, Masar, and Klein are tremendous effort players, but they are nobodies "quality" players. Sitch and Klein don't have the quality passing skills, they should really be more defensive players. And Masar doesn't have the finishing skills to be in the positions she always seems to been in. And although you may argue that Hayes has picked these players, she picked these players to be 2nd stringers, and since WPS isn't the land of infinite money and talent they are all very good 2nd stringers.

    2. Tactics: The tactics Hayes is trying to use, are very hard to pull off if the "quality" isn't there. (And honesly I think they are too hard to pull off in general) And Carney, Rapinoe and Formiga are basically the point guards of these tactics, and these players haven't really properly even been their yet.

    So for me making these judgements are a little premature, because I don't even feel like I've seen the starting lineup play. I agree that having someone be a good header of the ball or maybe a supreme speedster to play into space is a tactic that works really well in this league, and maybe that is something that can happen next season. But as of this season that's not the personnel we have, so I think we really need to give the team and Coach Haye's a couple more games to actually get the players on the field and see if they actually have the quality and chemistry to pull it off, because if I learned anything from watching last year it's that crappy starts and slowly building team chemistry can actually work (I'm actually still really shocked that SBFC won, because I initially thought they were awful.)
     
  14. ForeverLOST108

    ForeverLOST108 Member+

    Jan 23, 2010
    Orlando
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States


    Responses in bold
     
  15. ratdog

    ratdog Member+

    Mar 22, 2004
    In the doghouse
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    True for Rapinoe and Carney this year but a) they're not forwards and b) we had this same problem last year when we had everyone available. And even when Carney is in the game, our forwards still can't finish, except for the two goals yesterday. And we don't even have a target forward on our roster so this argument is not relevant there.

    First, see my response above.

    Second, then adjust your tactics to your personnel.

    Again, we had this same situation last year. And the problem is not with our midfield so while bringing on midfielders Rapinoe and Formiga will make us better, it won't necessarily solve the scoring problem.
     
  16. suncraver03

    suncraver03 New Member

    Oct 3, 2003
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    1. Agree on refs--how can you see if a player is offside or not if you aren't able to stay with the back line? The same thing happened last year with Kai getting a winning goal when she was clearly offside. Not blaming Kai...she does what she's supposed to do.

    2. Enough on the AR's but something is going on with the Refs that I don't understand either. This happened in the first SB game, don't remember if it happened in the SLA game, but happened at least three times last night. SB was called for a foul and the Red Stars player tried do a quick restart and a SB player (O'Reilley twice and I didn't see who did it on the other one) jumped in front of the ball so the Red Stars player couldn't restart. The Ref didn't caution or card anyone. You can't do that! So let them get away with it the first time, but warn them and if they do it again---you have to pull out the yellow!

    3. Ditto on the finishing. They had two wide open nets last night, when the SB goalie was out of position and missed both. Just can't do that!

    4. Enough on the Christiane bashing. I'm as much of a Brazil hater (the diving style they play, not the individual players) as anyone, but enough. I think that she is just trying to do too much. She misses Rapinoe more than anyone. There were a number of times last night that she could have given up and stopped running, but she didn't. The weather was horrible enough in the second half in the stands, can't imagine what the footing/wind did to the passing and footing. She had that goal taken away and could have just quit (which she did a couple of times last year). She was still going full speed at 90, running at the goalie to force quick kicks and coming back to play defense. I think she's has progressed enormously from this time last year.

    5. SB is a great team! It's not like this was some pick up team from down the block. Their #12 (can't remember her name but she is from Norway? Sweden?) is a beast! She was all over the field and very strong on tackles/in the air. Kai was all over the field, coming back to the goal box to play defense and then would just jet. Similar with O'Reilly on the other side. They may have gone into the playoffs last year as the #4 team, but they are clearly better than that this year. Kai healthy is going to seriously challenge for most goals. And when they get Rampone back?

    6. Some keep talking about how this number of quality players who can't seem to put it together being the coaches fault. Emma is clearly a good coach and her style has won in the past. We can't judge the coaching if all the pieces aren't in place. Asllani and Christiane, with all their talent on and off the ball, when they have the passing of Rapinoe to set them up? You can't blame a coach when one of your only all stars gets bacterial meningitis! You can't blame a coach when two wide open nets (which are wide open because of the creative passing game you teach) are missed. You can't blame a coach when cross-bars/posts are hit. Or when it's 40 degrees and raining like crazy. I would rather have this run of luck now than later.

    7. Those women played their asses off last night. They worked hard and never gave up. And more importantly they looked like a team, rather than a collection of talented players--like they did so often last year. Before the game I was watching Rapinoe sort of hanging out and playing a touch/juggling game with Christiane and Formiga. It seemed more natural and interactive on a personal level and not just as a formal drill. I like the direction they are moving in. If you saw the first 20 minutes of the second half last week (when they got their goal against STA) it was a thing of beauty. If that is the sort of soccer we have to look forward to...wow.
     
  17. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
     
  18. FreeKicks

    FreeKicks New Member

    Sep 29, 2009
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    It's extremely annoying to dominate the game and still lose. I didn't see it but judging by the empty netters said on match tracker commentary they should have had at least 3.
     
  19. soccerbs

    soccerbs Red Card

    Jun 14, 2006
    The CRS are the same game in and game out. Never anything new or do they get better. They do work all the social web sites very well! Maybe concentrate more on the field !
     
  20. soccerbs

    soccerbs Red Card

    Jun 14, 2006
    Free Kicks.........Dominate play??? or out coached?

    The Red Stars out shot SB but when it cam down to it each team had 6 shots on goal!! Also Sky Blue had many more off side calls then the Red Stars!

    If it was crap outside I would not be pushing forward and dominating the the other half of play. I would be sitting in and protecting. I would wait for the right opportunity to play a ball in, and have my forward get in. When you push forwards in the rain all it takes is one slip and your done. Zero Zero game in the rain you don't risk, you play patient and keep the ball out of your defensive third!

    Sounds like Sky Blue played the right game.
     
  21. Smulan

    Smulan Member

    Apr 3, 2008
    http://www.womensprosoccer.com/ny/players/bios/landstrom-jessica

    She's not "a beast", but she is arguably one of the strongest, most dogged and yet creative players that Sweden has had for many years. It's nice to see her getting some real playing time.
     
  22. FreeKicks

    FreeKicks New Member

    Sep 29, 2009
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars

    uhh 2 empty netters should result in goals, and i'm talking second half, outside of that kai goal it was chi-town with the ball, yeah sky blue took advantage of theirs but to have two empty netters and miss, 2 goals callsed back from being offsides, and a few posts, I call that dominating and it should have been a win.I could also care less about sky blue having more offsides, that somehow means what? Two empty netters, two goals called back, and posts should not equate to 0 goals, plain and simple.
     
  23. ForeverLOST108

    ForeverLOST108 Member+

    Jan 23, 2010
    Orlando
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Thank you! I feel like I've been the only one defending her. She has played SO MUCH better this year than she did at this time last year. Her work rate is on-par with the way she plays with Brazil.. something I thought took a long time for her to do last year. Cristiane is a player that needs the ball AT HER FEET. You would think they realized this by now. She is one of the most talented players in the world with the ball at her feet and from watching the past few games, the times that she does show off her foot skills is only when she gets the ball herself. We pass into space way too much for our forwards who are definitely not the fastest in the league. If you get the ball to her feet, in a dangerous area, she will shoot and likely score. Just look at the shot she took last week against Solo; the ball was played to HER not to space and she ripped a shot that Solo barely saved. I think Rapinoe really understood Cristiane towards the 2nd half of last year. The two of them played off each other very well and I think that will be the biggest difference maker - Rapinoe returning and linking up with Cristiane.



    Oh and for those of you who don't know how skilled Cristiane is in the air, here's a video from a game when she played for Santos back in October. She scores three goals on headers alone. And notice, the ball is played RIGHT to her, something we aren't doing.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8RsyluJAYg"]YouTube- Santos FC 12 x 0 Enforma, Gols Copa Libertadores da América Feminino[/ame]
     
  24. MRAD12

    MRAD12 Member+

    Jun 10, 2004
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Officiating was horrible but CRS had chances. This team just needs some luck to go their way.
     
  25. MRAD12

    MRAD12 Member+

    Jun 10, 2004
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    We have a sh_t load of ball handlers, dribblers, flashy players, etc. Tons of talent. But they are all the same. No one to put the ball in the net. We don't have a Cheney, Wambach, Sinclair type of player that scores goals and gives defenders fits in the box. I see Carney, Christiane, even Asllani come sometimes in the defense to get the ball and then start dribbling up field. These players should be up field in position to recieve the ball and create plays not back with Engen and Margraff.

    Nogueira's goal last week was the only serious shot I've seen this year from the CRS.

    I am happy with Whitney Engen. She is a solid defender for the CRS and USWNT one day. She is fast becoming one of my favorite Red Stars. Plays her butt off every game, 110%, and anticipates well.

    I say, Put Engen up top and see if she can score some goals. Didn't she used to be a forward before Anson moved her back?

    Or maybe we can package a few "flash" players and send them to Boston for Lauren Cheney.

    I'm hoping our luck will turn around, but if we continue the road we left last year and the road we are going now, the organization will be forced to make some serious moves somewhere down the line this season.

    Le'ts hope it doesn't come to that and we can win with the players and coaches we have now.
     

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