Shutdown!

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by Caesar, Sep 30, 2013.

  1. minerva

    minerva Member+

    Apr 20, 2009
    Denver, CO
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    if the Democrats gave those concessions without a one-for-one concession from the GOP, then they're bad negotiators. but you have to recognize that the very fact that the Dems were the once giving the concessions means that they were the ones executing their agenda, while the Reps were powerless to execute theirs. all the Reps could do is hobble the Dem agenda. so if you're a Dem, that's a good thing. because even if you didn't get everything you wanted the way you wanted, you at least got some. while the Reps got none of their agenda executed. all they succeeded in doing is to hobble the Dem agenda and made sure that it wasn't fully executed the way the Dems would have liked.
     
  2. MattR

    MattR Member+

    Jun 14, 2003
    Reston
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Look, I'm all for closing the government, but none of this "I get to pick what to close" crap. Close it all. Government provides useful services, and as soon as a government shutdown shuts down those services suddenly everyone thinks its some ploy.

    Look, you SHUT DOWN THE GOVERNMENT. So, you CANT GO TO GOVERNMENT-RUN PLACES.

    Okay? If McDonald's shut down, you think you could just play outside in their swingsets or would they lock it up?
     
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  3. minerva

    minerva Member+

    Apr 20, 2009
    Denver, CO
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't know if it's true or not, but very early on in the shutdown (within the first couple of days), before this became the political football it is today, I remember hearing NPR interview the head of NPS who stated basically that even when you're not aware of it, there's always a presence of some kind (eye in the sky? law enforcement in civilian clothes, etc. who knows? he didn't elaborate) at all the monuments - in DC at least. probably not so much at the more remote sites. and he basically said that this wasn't the case with the shutdown, so they had to close them down.
     
  4. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    Anybody have that cartoon? The one where Obama and a Republican are studying the distance between them, and the Republican says "Tell you what--you move a little and I'll move a little." So Obama moves about half the distance between them, and the Republican moves about half that distance away from him and says "Okay, now lets do it again."
     
  5. minerva

    minerva Member+

    Apr 20, 2009
    Denver, CO
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    that's a perfect analogy, and I agree wholeheartedly that if you shut the government down, then it should be shut down completely, except for essential (life, health, safety, property) functions. the GOP, sensing the unpopularity of the shutdown, want to re-open the more public aspects of the government, while holding the rest of us feds as a bargaining chip.
     
  6. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And really, it's perfect apropos they've latched onto the closing of something that literally does nothing and decried how horrific that is.

    Meanwhile, meat inspectors are not on the job.
     
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  7. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And did he sell the children into sex slavery?
     
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  8. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Based on Facebook and letters to the editor on our local paper's website, it seems the two things the American people are really worked up about regarding the shutdown are: the closing of war memorials on the national Mall, and the fact that members of Congress continue to draw a salary.

    I probably should have posted that observation in the "American People Failure" thread.
     
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  9. minerva

    minerva Member+

    Apr 20, 2009
    Denver, CO
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I can't help it that the Dems are poor negotiators. Obama should not move an inch without an equivalent move by the GOP. but given the fact that the Dems are in power and are executing their agenda, it necessarily follows that they're going to have to give up more than the GOP, who are not in power and all they can do is try to hobble the Dem agenda.
     
  10. minerva

    minerva Member+

    Apr 20, 2009
    Denver, CO
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    which is why politicians can play the American people like a fiddle.
    if you want to blame someone for why our government doesn't work (although I would argue it is actually working just the way the founding fathers intended it), start by looking in the mirror.
    people may be dumber in terms of knowing about political issues today than they were 200 years ago, but their opinions are just as divided now as they were then.
     
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  11. y-lee-coyote

    y-lee-coyote Member+

    Dec 4, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    I do not have a vested ownership interest in Mc Donalds playgrounds. But fair enough, i still think it is ridiculous, but it is not worth arguing. If I decide I want to go to a national park I will and if they want to arrest me, well that is the chance I took.
     
  12. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    I think you missed the word "away" in my post-- s'why I was hoping someone had the cartoon...
     
  13. dapip

    dapip Member+

    Sep 5, 2003
    South Florida
    Club:
    Millonarios Bogota
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia

    [​IMG]
     
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  14. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    This one was in my local paper today, even though it was from about three weeks ago...

    http://www.startribune.com/opinion/224716582.html
     
  15. VFish

    VFish Member+

    Jan 7, 2001
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Anyone that pretends Obama wants to end this shut down is delusional. Despite his lack of leadership, he gets to blame the shutdown on the GOP, they look bad, and it takes all the focus off the disaster of a rollout of ObamaCare.
     
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  16. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And yet... your boys on Team Red decided that this was what they wanted.

    Honestly, that doesn't sound very bright on their part.
     
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  17. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Maybe if the far right wing of the GOP wasn't delusional enough to threaten screwing the global economy in order to get their way on everything, there would be more attention paid to the rollout of the ACA.

    Of course, if people were focusing on that, it's possible that quite a few problems might've been solved by now. Which of course is the absolute last thing the Congressional GOP wants... I mean, absolute last, as in they want the ACA to work even less than they want to screw up the global economy.
     
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  18. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That is the point, we have idiots who don't understand what an ER is meant for.

    This should be everywhere. Part if it is knowing where they are located.

    You read too much into my statement, but I also agree with what you say here. Part of this issue is getting people to get regular medical preventive care - IOW, see your doctor on a regular basis.

    I have not gone down that road specifically for the points your bring up. But I also think that along with the ACA, there needs to be regular information sent out about preventive care and medicine. I know some of it is that people don't like to be told they have to change their behaviors, such as cutting out foods they like.

    That is a good question.
     
  19. VFish

    VFish Member+

    Jan 7, 2001
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Not my boys, just because I think your boyfriend is FUGLY doesn't mean I think the GOP has played this well.
     
  20. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Of course not. You crank up the radio whenever the band come on, you own every CD they've released, you like them on Facebook, but you haven't bought the concert t-shirt because, you know, you haven't drunk the kool-aid.
     
  21. VFish

    VFish Member+

    Jan 7, 2001
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Atlanta
    OH NOZE! A global economic meltdown all because Barry has vowed he will not negotiate with the terrorists!

    And it is the Affordable Care Act. Can you guys not humor me and type out the name of the bill if your going to call me a racist for referring to it as ObamaCare? The ACA can't be fixed because it is fundamentally flawed.
     
  22. appoo

    appoo Member+

    Jul 30, 2001
    USA
    I doubt you even understand the fundamentals of the bill.
     
  23. minerva

    minerva Member+

    Apr 20, 2009
    Denver, CO
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    no, I got that. but that just means the Dems are poor negotiators. it's natural that the ruling party will have to make more concessions than the minority party, but that doesn't mean there shouldn't be concessions by both sides. it doesn't mean the Dems make concessions while the Reps don't make any. the final bill that the President signs should include concessions by both sides. but more (or bigger) concessions by the ruling party.
     
  24. VFish

    VFish Member+

    Jan 7, 2001
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Atlanta
    What makes them my boys is the fact you can't deal with someone that doesn't think your boy is cute or smart. I opposed Iraq and thought Medicare Part D was too expensive. Hell, I held my nose voted for John F'n Kerry over Iraq alone.
     

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