Should the Revs trade Pat Noonan?

First off, I've had this thought at well. I am not a big fan of Noonan, especially this year. He seems to me a slightly better version of a Chris Brown or a Bobby Rhine. He'll score goals, but you cant count on him game in and game out to even be a threat.

Right now I dont think he is. We have had enough injuries that right now we have 3 forwards. Twellman, Brillant, and Noonan... Dempsey is good, but he will excel in the midfield more if he is given the time. Dempsey is just too good playing defense to force him to play forward. I see him as a Steven Gerrard type two way midfielder.. one who plays good D, but makes a huge mark in the offensive side of the field as well.

So for now (ie, this season) he is needed for the Revs-- even if it is simply b/c we dont have any other options....unless we trade for another FWD (see my second idea below).

I've thought this too. The other teams around the league seem to have very high opinions of him. For this reason we would probably be able to get a VERY good player out of a team. It seems defence will be the issue in the future, so why not pick up a Pablo Mastro type player? Given that Colorado almost traded him to us for JMM + something, I am will to bet a Noonan + a #1 would do the trick.

If not D, we should look at trading him for a fast forward. We dont have any all out burners on our team. Even Brillant isnt rediculously fast over 40 meters. A player like Eddie Johnson would be perfect. We could probably even get their #1 to go along with the deal.

Sound good?

 

Yes.

 

With Dempsey out, not now - I wouldn't trade him in the first place.

 

Noonan is a useful player, I'd keep him, if only to focus Twellman.

 

Whenever Twellman is on the field, Pat is a huge disappointment. I think we should trade him and hearing about Dempsey makes me think the sooner the better. We could move him along and possibly find someone to fill in for Dempsey.
Noonan seems to do better as THE striker, a role that Twellman takes when he is on the field. Noonan seems lost in the midfield and can't seem to find a place for himself in Twellman's shadow. A change would be probably be good for him and could do good things for us as well.
Lately, he has looked lazy, frustrated and disinterested. Time to go.

 

Two questions and a little spew

- Is it possible Noonan is playing injured?

- Regardless of Noonan's inconsistency, he isn't, that I've heard, a locker room cancer. Doesn't that make the urgency to trade him completely dependent on what we're offered in exchange?

- I do think it's weird that the Noonan-TnT partnership never took off, and still wonder if it's fixable. Dr. George mentioned in another thread a Dutch-style offence in which the mids and forwards freely switched off, presumably making even a zonal D much more difficult. To me that would seem to suit Noonan, who seems like a smart player who is confused about his role.

 

Re: Two questions and a little spew

I agree 100%. I am not suggesting that we unload Noonan to the first offer. I think he has value and could bring us someone who also has value. Somewhat like the Wolde for Chris Brown trade. Sometimes a change of scenery can kick start a stalled player.

 

Momentum is a big factor in sports. This entire year it seems that the momentum has clearly been against the entire Revs squad and despite showing some signs that the tide was starting to turn losing Kamler and Dempsey may just have reversed that trend. That having been said, I think it's hard to say very much about any particular player on a team that's been as beat up and crapped on by the Soccer Gods as the Revs have been this year. There is a reason BA has called Noonan for time with the USMNT. He's a player who has a solid up side but who is having a HARD YEAR just like the rest of the Rev squad. The Revs would be nuts to trade Noonan right now. It would make as much sense as when WRongan and Zenga traded away all our draft picks for a few short term fixes that didn't work anyway.

Please--no panic fixes--please, please, please!

 

Re: Two questions and a little spew

100% agreement. I'd trade absolutely anybody if the deal helped my team, but Noonan isn't an addition-by-subtraction situation, so the deal would have to be reasonable. C'bus and the 'Pids are outstanding defensive teams who can't score. It seems like they might be interested in Noonan in exchange for some defensive help.

 

No. I didn't hear a lot of people calling for Twellman to be traded when he was in a drought, and I don't think it's fair to put Noonan on the trading block. He's a good scorer, when he's on. Lately he hasn't, for whatever that reason is. Bench him, that'll wake him up.

 

He is a good scorer. One who i can see getting 8-12 goals a season for his entire MLS career. Above I called him a slightly better version of a Chris Brown, or a Bobby Rhine... now I think he is more of a Jason Kries.

I dont see him ever becoming a a regular with the national team, but I can see him maturing into a constant all star.

One problem I see is that he doesnt seem to work well with Twellman. Twellman is a super star of sorts in MLS. He is beyond "a good scorer." Obviously we keep Twellman no matter what, so why not find him a better strike partner.

The second problem I see with Noonan is that he isnt a constant threat. Players like Twellman, Ruiz, Ralph... even if they havent been "hot" are given extra close attention every game. Noonan isnt that type of player. Given how he has played this season if i were the opposition I'd much rather Noonan have the ball in an attacking area than Twellman, Cancela, Dempsey, Baker, Ralston, or even Brillant. Even in his one standout game against KC, he didnt seem to be a constant threat. Last season the only games where I would say he was a constant threat was the end of the season games agaisnt the Metro's. Due to this issue, I think a trade for a player like Eddie Johnson would benefit both teams. Noonan will score for Dallas, just not worry teams when he gets the ball . Eddie Johnson would add speed, and a constant threat. Teams couldnt simply focus on Twellman the entire match, b/c the unpredictability of Johnson could burn them. Johnson may not score more goals than Noonan would have, but b/c of the attention he requires, Twellman, Cancela, Baker, Dempsey, etc would be much more productive.

 

To blame Noonan for Twellman's lack of production is shortsighted. Granted Noonan and Twellman don't work together, but both have been effective with the other on the bench. Recall, no Noonan, no playoffs last year. Keeping both and letting them fight for the same spot is the best choice, particularly since Twellman lacks the maturity to put team play first. Also, as we have all seen, Twellman's game is very one dimensional. Shut down crosses from the right and he is lost out there.......even if he is the best American finisher playing today. Noonan is the better (but not great) option when teams force play up the middle and is probably a better holding/target player than Twellman, which is important in a 4-5-1 set up. Recent form aside, Noonan has also demonstrated that he is a better shooter than the rest of the team excluding Twellman (who is in a class of his own). Hence we need both and should keep both, but only play one. Absolutely another striker with speed is needed (Ngwenya would be nice) but consider this, do you really think Twellman will pass him the ball? Actually Cancela's inability to finish is probably a bigger problem than either Twellman or Noonan's form. It is starting to appear that Cancela is ideally suited to the 4-4-2, but lacks the finishing skill to succeed as AMid in a 5 man midfield.

 

no noonan no playoffs last season.

noonan and taylor are having trouble playing together and both are not scoring much, but i wouldn't trade anyone. take turns starting one or the other.
start twellman then sub him with noonan or start noonan and sub him with twellman, maybe that will give both a great boot in the butt to score more. with demps gone for a couple of weeks they should put brilliant up front as the other striker. i think he is very fast and a threat if he is played more. wouldn't mind seeing kamler or ralston paired up with noonan or twellman up front either.

 

I think Johnson is a bust. He's got the all-time leading scorer on his team and he still cant score on a constant rate. Maybe he needs a new home, but at this point Dallas would be drooling for a Noonan/Johnson trade.

 

Given his most recent performance, I thought maybe we should continue this discussion...

He really didnt do that much in the game, although I think he played pretty solid. His header was definetly top class. Despite this, I'd still trade him for Eddie Johnson and a #1. There is probably no way Dallas says not to that either.

I wouldnt call him a bust... according to MLSnet.com he had 6 goals and 3 assists on the year-- sounds pretty similar to our Noonan. I think the new home idea is exactly what he needs. I am sure this year is better in Dallas, but last season was just an awful experience all around. A young (immature) player that had been often injured and given little in the way of coaching couldnt be expected to produce. I can see his revitalization happening in NE in a huge way-- Paul Mariner would get his hands on a still developing forward with all the potential in the world.

Before I go and sound like I think Eddie Johnson is the best player in the world... I think Noonan did have a good game and should probably be given another chance. My guess is that he does nothing next time out, and is subbed in the 60th minute.

 

I think when Twellman was a bit younger (even though he is still young) would play much more of a team game to prove himself...Like he almost had a chip on his shoulder coming into the MLS. Now, I think Twellman is beginning to only pass the ball to players he respects such as Ralston. I find it hard to believe that he respects players like Cancela, when they dribble all day and do NOTHING. The problem with this team is that there is no build up from the back, no urgency (pace), and most importantly, no wing play. Everything is slow and up the middle. If we use the width and play to space more...Things will open up for Twellman as well as others. But dribbling up the middle (Cancela) is not good soccer...Cancela might have good skill, but his tactical knowledge is pathetic. In fact, I don't see this TEAM improving tactically at all. Tactics is where Twellman excels (being in the right place to score). This team is WAY behind in this area...I apologize for the ranting, its just that a lot of this should start falling soley on the coach's shoulders. No more excuses for bad play...

 

Trade the only forward who, for the last year, has consistently been healthy and a goal scorer? I don't think so.

Only five players in the league have more goals than Noonan. He might be higher up if you exclude PKs, I'm not sure.

Try different combinations. But don't trade Noonan until you can replace his goals.

Yes, TnT and Brillant are higher energy forwards than Noonan but most teams don't pair two forwards who play the same style. Noonan's good at taking on defenders. Taylor's a better poacher, more of a one- and two-touch player with a fantastic first step.

They should work well together. it's up to them and SN to figure out why they don't.

 

Are you watching the same Pat Noonan the one we are. You know, the one who shoots 10 yards over the goal, and who doesn't really work for the ball all that much (compared to Twellman). If Noonan played like he did last season, he'd have 12 goals and 7 assists. He'd be ripping up the league, because that is what exactly he did last season.

 

I'd say his goals are easily replaced with what we would get in a trade. Eddie Johnson or an Edson Buddle would easily fill Noonans goal shoes.

I would never say Noonan is good at taking on defenders... he even said himself he has one move!

He does have his moments, so I certainly dont mind keeping him... I just think there may be better alternatives.

 

What on earth makes you think Dallas would want to trade Eddie Johnson for Pat Noonan. Johnson is younger, more athletic and has a much greater upside than Noonan and this year has been equally productive. Eddie Johnson and Cory Gibbs are probably the two most untouchable players on the roster.

That all being said, I would suggest you guys hold onto Noonan until the offseason. Expansion will increase Noonan's value even further, plus you will have many more options on what you could get for him.

 

It didnt have to be Eddie, although he would definetly be one I think the Revs should look into. I mentioned him out of response from a number of posts by members of your board that dont think he'll ever work out. I dont have the time to search through the clutter for them, but I know they were out there. However, I would conceed most were from last season or the off season. Perhaps the majority of Dallas fans now feel he is the savior?

 

You were not the only one on the thread to mention Eddie, so I was responding to everyone that I doubt Eddie would be a possible deal. Eddie has definitely shown signs of making the turn from potential into production. IMO most fans consider him an integral part of the future of the team, although "savior" might be a little strong.

I still say hold onto Noonan until the offseason. One, he will still probably score 10 goals this year, not bad to start your MLS career with back to back 10 goal years. Two, he may just be in a mid year slump and you may want to end up keeping him. Three, with expansion this offseason his value will go up and the Revs could work out some very good deals.