Serie-A Rankings: Legione Straniera 1980-87

Discussion in 'Players & Legends' started by msioux75, Aug 29, 2011.

  1. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    The good thing of the issue is that it has also height and weight of every player. Of the winning squad Napoli, it is noticeable how Maradona is the only Napoli player with a weight higher as "size minus one metre" (exactly 70kg at 1.68m). Very interesting stats, incl. substitutions, yellow cards etc.

    68 journalists voted for a team of the season.

    Zenga (66 votes), De Agostini (43), Ferri (40), Baresi (26), Bergomi (36); Manfredonia (26), Bagni (61); Mancini (23), Maradona (64); Virdis (60), Vialli (60; same as Virdis)

    Two journalists didn't vote for Zenga. They preferred Pazzagli and Landucci.

    Four journalists didn't vote for Maradona. They chose for Giuseppe Dossena (Ciotti of RAI television), Antognoni (Gazzaniga of 'Il Giorno'), Matteoli (Grandini of 'Corriere della Serra'), and again Matteoli (Mura of 'la Repubblica').


    The full list:

    1. Zenga (Inter) 66
    2. Maradona (Napoli) 64
    3. Bagni (Napoli) 61
    4. Vialli (Sampdoria) 60
    4. Virdis (Milan) 60
    6. De Agostini (Verona) 43
    7. Ferri (Inter) 40
    8. Bergomi (Inter) 36
    9. Ferrara (Napoli) 33
    10. Francini (Torino) 27
    11. Baresi (Milan) 26
    11. Manfredonia (Juventus) 26
    13. Mancini (Sampdoria) 23
    14. Altobelli (Inter) 20
    15. Renica (Napoli) 19
    16. Tricella (Verona) 18
    17. Romano (Napoli) 13
    18. Brio (Juventus) 12
    18. Giannini (Roma) 12
    18. Giordano (Napoli) 12
    21. Iachini (Ascoli) 9
    22. Mauro (Juventus) 8
    23. Diaz (Fiorentina) 5
    23. Ferrario (Napoli) 5
    23. Tassotti (Milan) 5


    Greatest "revelation":

    1. Ferrara (Napoli) 30
    2. Alessio (Avellino) 14
    3. De Agostini (Verona) 7
    4. Iachini (Ascoli) 4
    4. Notaristefano (Como) 4
    6. Romano (Napoli) 3
    7. Francini (Torino) 2

    Greatest "disillusion":

    1. Donadoni (Milan) 20
    2. Platini (Juventus) 15
    3. Laudrup (Juventus) 15
    4. K.H. Rummenigge (Inter) 8
    5. Junior (Torino) 2
    5. Pruzzo (Roma) 2


    That's it! (double checked!)
     
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  2. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
    Great post, Puck :cool:
    Some interesting conclusion can be made, but for posting in other thread to not banging this one, you know.
    Other conclusion is that that season show the decline from top level for many stars of the 80s.
    Also that italians gave a good supporting cast to the foreign stars. Topping the list (even considering a bias in favour of them)
     
  3. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    #128 PuckVanHeel, May 23, 2014
    Last edited: May 23, 2014
    Thanks for your friendly words.

    I thought the incomplete ranking of the 1986-87 (by this praiseworthy magazine) looked ugly, and I was able to track it in a library.

    The voting results are at pages 44 to 48 of the same issue (issue 21 of year 1987).

    Red cards aren't kindly dealt with by the magazine ('France Football' is the most extreme example around), probably a reason why Bergomi receives many votes but not one of the two best grades for his position. He had two red cards that season (= low grade in two games).
    Seems as well they give a slight bonus for a goal from open play (no PK, maybe), example is Bagni with his 4 goals in total.
    But it's certain a red card sees a hit in the match grade.

    Full list of red cards, so you can adjust for it:

    Bergomi (Inter) 2 red cards
    Ferroni (Avellino) 2 red cards
    Abate (Udinese)
    Albiero (Como)
    Ancelotti (Roma)
    Bagni (Napoli)
    Boldini (Atalanta)
    Boniek (Roma)
    Brambati (Empoli)
    Dell'Oglio (Ascoli)
    Edinho (Udinese)
    Galparoli (Udinese)
    Gentillini (Brescia)
    Hateley (Milan)
    Invernizzi (Como)
    Iorio (Brescia)
    Larda (Torino)
    Oddi (Roma)
    Passarella (Inter)
    Progna (Atalanta)
    Pruzzo (Roma)
    Rocchigiani (Fiorentina)
    Romano (Avellino)
    Salvadori (Empoli)
    Schachner (Avellino)
    Tardelli (Inter)
     
  4. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
    Red cards and goals scored are good reasons to up(down)grade a certain rating, imho.

    Just, i think that it would be 2 or 4 more/less points in the overall performance (for example, 180 points in 30 games). Not a big difference to ranked a player in a diferent level (from ** to *** for example)

    I hope do you get my point.
     
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  5. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    #130 PuckVanHeel, May 24, 2014
    Last edited: May 24, 2014
    That's what the 'disillusion' question to the 68 journalists more or less shows, true.

    If we look at the grades of foreigners in 1986-87 and compare with 1985-86, it supports this idea. Guerin Sportivo strived for comparability across seasons and unity in standards, but 'we' should keep in mind that it is still difficult though to maintain equal standards over all seasons (but adjacent seasons are less problematic as seasons 20-30 years apart if you understand what I mean).

    In 1986-87, the 4th and 5th best foreigner had both a grade of 6.29 (Cerezo and Elkjaer). In 1985-86, that would've put them at the 15th best foreigner place. Just below Berggreen at 14th with 6.30.

    The third best foreigner in 1986-87 had a grade of 6.34 (Briegel). In 1985-86 that's a joint 12th place with Wilkins (at 6.34 too).

    The 2nd best foreigner in 1986-87 showed a grade of 6.38 (Passarella). That's a joint 11th place in 1985-86 (Barbas).

    The foreigner with the highest grade in 1986-87 boosted a grade of 6.49 (Maradona). In 1985-86 that translates into a joint 8th place with Platini (with 6.49 too).

    Platini had btw back then a rapid decline in the 2nd half of the 1985-86 season, with average ratings in 1st half much higher.

    http://books.google.com.br/books?id=Kb4ThFgFRVgC&lpg=PA50&dq=boniek maradona&hl=pt-BR&pg=PA50#v=onepage&q=boniek maradona&f=false
     
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  6. tony-soprano37

    Dec 5, 2008
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    it shows the class of ruud krol that when he was way in his thirties still such a great and important player.

    very very underrated player sometimes.. ruud krol same class as scirea and beckenbauer.

    yet beckenbauer is freqeuntly mentioned top 10 all time and krol never..
     
  7. Once

    Once Member+

    Apr 16, 2011
    Those are the Guerin rates shared by msious75. If we take in consideration the rates provided by DbsCalcio, which are an average of three other sources (Gazzetta, Corriere and Tuttosport), the average of the four sources combined would be the ones bolded:
    CLUB-----PLAYER-----ROLE-----COUNTRY-----GAMES-----AVG.
    Ascoli--------
    Avellino--Jorge JUARY--Forward----Brazil-----12-----6.56 / 6.55
    Bologna--ENEAS Camargo--Forward--Brazil----20-----5.95 / 6.01
    Brescia-------
    Cagliari-------
    Catanzaro----
    Como---------
    Fiorentina--Daniel BERTONI--Forward--Argentine--25--6.21 / 6.24
    Inter--Herbert PROHASKA--Midfielder--Austria----28---6.54 / 6.50
    Juventus--Liam BRADY--Midfielder--Rep.Ireland---28--6.57 / 6.53
    Napoli----Ruud KROL--Defender----Holland------29---6.92 / 6.98
    Perugia--Elio FORTUNATO--Forward--Argentine--12--5.62 / 5.61
    Pistoiese----Luis SILVIO----Forward----Brazil----6--5.45 / 5.41
    Roma---Roberto FALCAO---Midfielder---Brazil---25---6.81 / 6.77
    Torino--Michel VAN DE KORPUT--Defender--Holland--22--6.07 / 6.06
    Udinese--Herbert NEUMANN--Midfielder--West Germany--25--6.67 / 6.67

    TOP 5 remains the same:
    1- Krol--------- 6.98 (probably still the top rated player in Serie A after putting together the 4 sources)
    2- Falcao------ 6.77
    3- Neumann-- 6.67
    4- Brady------- 6.53
    5- Prohaska--- 6.50

    I dismiss Juary here due to his too few games.
     
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  8. Once

    Once Member+

    Apr 16, 2011
    Same here again:

    CLUB-----PLAYER-----ROLE-----COUNTRY-----GAMES-----AVG.
    Ascoli--Francois ZAHOUI--Midfielder--C.Ivoire----8---6.37 / -----
    Avellino--Jorge JUARY--Forward----Brazil------22-----5.86 / 6.02
    Bologna--Herbert NEUMANN--Mid--W.Germany--20--6.05 / 6.09
    Cagliari-------
    Catanzaro--Viorel NASTASE--Forward--Romania---14---5.98 / -----
    Cesena--Walter SCHACHNER--Forward---Austria---28---6.45 / 6.44
    Como--Dieter MIRNEGG--Defender----Austria-----11-----6.02 / 5.97
    Fiorentina--Daniel BERTONI--Forward--Argentine---30---6.15 / 6.13
    Genoa--Rene VANDEREYCKEN--Midfielder--Belgium--25---6.47 / 6.45
    Inter--Herbert PROHASKA--Midfielder---Austria-----28---6.11 / 6.03
    Juventus--Liam BRADY--Midfielder--Rep.Ireland----29---6.22 / 6.24
    Milan---Joe JORDAN----Forward----Scotland-----22----5.46 / 5.57
    Napoli-----Ruud KROL---Defender-----Holland-----27----6.77 / 6.87
    Roma----Roberto FALCAO----Midfielder----Brazil----24---6.65 / 6.70
    Torino--Michel VAN DE KORPUT--Defender--Holland--23--6.15 / 6.07
    Udinese---ORLANDO Pereira---Defender----Brazil-----29---6.33 / 6.08

    Top 5:
    1- Krol--------------- 6.87
    2- Falcao------------ 6.70
    3- Vandereycken--- 6.45
    4- Schachner------- 6.44
    5- Brady------------- 6.24

    I dismissed Zahoui for too few games.

    Franco Causio was the top rated player for Guerin and considering that DbsCalcio shows a rate of 6.94 for him, he remains the top rated player that season in Serie A.
     
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  9. Gregoriak

    Gregoriak BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 27, 2002
    Munich
    Franco Causio is one of my favorite players of that era (early-70s to early-80s) so I am pleased to see he still had it in him by that late stage of his career. At that point he was 33 and had lost his place in the Italian national team. Due to his fine performances that season he made it into the 1982 World Cup squad for Italy, even playing a few minutes in the final itself. One of the most skilled wingers of his era.
     
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  10. Once

    Once Member+

    Apr 16, 2011
    Same thing for this season:

    CLUB-----PLAYER-----ROLE-----COUNTRY-----GAMES-----AVG.
    Ascoli--Francois ZAHOUI--Midfielder--C.Ivoire-----3-----n.g / -----
    Avellino--Jeronimo BARBADILLO--Forward---Perú---30---6.52 / 6.58
    Avellino--Soren SKOV--Forward----Denmark------16-----5.27 / -----
    Cagliari---Julio C. URIBE---Midfielder----Perú------20-----6.3 / 6.34
    Cagliari--Waldemar VICTORINO--Forward--Uruguay--10--5.01 / -----
    Catanzaro--Viorel NASTASE--Forward--Romania----9----5.68 / -----
    Cesena--Walter SCHACHNER--Forward---Austria---30---6.12 / 6.16
    Fiorentina--Daniel PASSARELLA--Defender--Argentine--27--6.38 / 6.34
    Fiorentina--Daniel BERTONI--Forward--Argentine---16---6.36 / 6.24
    Genoa--Rene VANDEREYCKEN--Midfielder--Belgium--3---5.5 / ----
    Genoa--Jan PETERS---Midfielder---Holland----19----6.57 / 6.54
    Inter--Hansi MÜLLER--Midfielder---W.Germany---22--6.23 / 6.30
    Inter---Jorge JUARY---Forward-----Brazil-------21----5.52 / 5.52
    Juventus--Zbigniew BONIEK--Midfielder--Poland---28--6.16 / 6.26
    Juventus--Michel PLATINI--Midfielder--France----30---6.61 / 6.66
    Napoli-----Ruud KROL---Defender-----Holland----30----6.37 / 6.30
    Napoli---Ramon DIAZ----Forward----Argentine----25----6.09 / 5.93
    Pisa----Klaus BERGGREEN---Midfielder----Denmark----29--6.44 / 6.50
    Pisa----Jorge CARABALLO---Midfielder----Uruguay----7---5.65 / -----
    Roma----Roberto FALCAO----Midfielder----Brazil----27---6.77 / 6.64
    Roma---Herbert PROHASKA---Midfielder---Austria----26---6.53 / 6.58
    Sampdoria---Liam BRADY---Midfielder---R.Ireland----29---6.64 / 6.66
    Sampdoria---Trevor FRANCIS---Forward---England---14---6.75 / 6.62
    Torino--Michel VAN DE KORPUT--Defender--Holland--27---6.28 / 6.24
    Torino--Patricio HERNANDEZ--Midfielder--Argentine--28---6.05 / 6.16
    Udinese---EDINHO Nazareth---Defender----Brazil-----30---6.52 / 6.53
    Udinese---Ivo SURJAK---Midfielder----Yugoslavia-----29---6.16 / 6.25
    Verona---Wladyslaw ZMUDA---Defender----Poland-----2---n.g / ----
    Verona---DIRCEU Guimaraes---Midfielder----Brazil-----29---6.53 / 6.67

    Top 5
    1- Dirceu----- 6.67
    2- Platini----- 6.66
    3- Falcao----- 6.64
    4- Francis---- 6.62 (played half the season)
    5- Baradillo and Prohaska both with 6.58

    Pietro Vierchowod was Guerin's highest rated player. Considering the average of the other three sources gives 6.67 he likely (cant say for sure) remains the top rated player in Serie A in 1982-83.
     
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  11. Once

    Once Member+

    Apr 16, 2011
    Now this one:

    CLUB-----PLAYER-----ROLE-----COUNTRY-----GAMES-----AVG.
    Ascoli--Alexander TRIFUNOVIC--Midfielder--Yugoslavia--19--5.82 / 5.96 (13 games in DbsCalcio)
    Ascoli--Jorge JUARY----Forward-----Brazil-------27-----5.91 / 6.05
    Avellino--Jeronimo BARBADILLO--Forward---Perú---27---6.58 / 6.72
    Avellino--Ramon DIAZ----Forward----Argentine----24----6.25 / 6.33
    Catania----PEDRINHO----Midfielder----Brazil------27-----6.09 / 6.19
    Catania---Donizete LUVANOR---Midfielder---Brazil---30---5.75 / 5.78
    Fiorentina--Daniel PASSARELLA--Defender--Argentine--27--6.68 / 6.52
    Fiorentina--Daniel BERTONI--Forward--Argentine---26---6.13 / 6.06
    Genoa---Francisco ELOI---Midfielder---Brazil----17----5.75 / 5.86 (10 games in DbsCalcio)
    Genoa---Jan PETERS----Midfielder---Holland----16----6.23 / 6.16
    Inter---Hansi MÜLLER---Midfielder---W.Germany---26---6.46 / 6.45
    Inter----Ludo COECK----Midfielder----Belgium----9----6.14 / 6.22
    Juventus--Zbigniew BONIEK--Midfielder--Poland---27--6.37 / 6.38
    Juventus--Michel PLATINI--Midfielder--France----28---6.84 / 6.71
    Lazio---Joao BATISTA---Midfielder---Brazil----25----6.29 / 6.26
    Lazio--Michael LAUDRUP--Midfielder---Denmark---30---6.17 / 6.29
    AC Milan---Eric GERETS---Defender---Belgium---13---6.24 / 6.32
    AC Milan--Luther BLISSETT--Forward---Jamaica---30---5.73 / 5.77
    Napoli-----Ruud KROL---Defender-----Holland----21----5.75 / 5.78
    Napoli---DIRCEU Guimaraes---Midfielder---Brazil---30---6.22 / 6.34
    Pisa----Klaus BERGGREEN---Midfielder----Denmark--28--6.36 / 6.52
    Pisa-----Win KIEFT----Forward-----Hollanda----23----5.65 / 5.64
    Roma---Roberto FALCAO---Midfielder---Brazil---27---6.75 / 6.65
    Roma---Toninho CEREZO---Midfielder---Brazil----30---6.52 / 6.45
    Sampdoria--Liam BRADY--Midfielder---R.Ireland---28---6.68 / 6.65
    Sampdoria--Trevor FRANCIS--Forward---England---15---6.42 / 6.35
    Torino--Walter SCHACHNER---Midfielder---Austria---30---5.76 / 5.85
    Torino--Patricio HERNANDEZ--Midfielder--Argentine--29---6.24 / 6.06
    Udinese---EDINHO Nazareth---Defender----Brazil-----29---6.4 / 6.41
    Udinese------ZICO------Midfielder-----Brazil-----24----6.77 / 7.00
    Verona---Wladyslaw ZMUDA---Defender----Poland-----5---n.g / -----
    Verona---Joe JORDAN---Forward----Scotland-----12---5.98 / 5.78 (7 games in DbsCalcio)

    Top5 would be:
    1- Zico-------- 7.00
    2- Barbadillo- 6.72
    3- Platini----- 6.71
    4- Brady------ 6.65
    5- Falcao----- 6.65

    Guerin's top rated man this season was Platini. Considering the average of the four sources looks like Zico had a good margin above him.
     
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  12. Once

    Once Member+

    Apr 16, 2011
    Maradona's first season would look like this:

    CLUB-----PLAYER-----ROLE-----COUNTRY-----GAMES-----AVG.
    Ascoli---DIRCEU Guimaraes----Midfielder---Brazil---27---6.44 / 6.39
    Ascoli--Patricio HERNANDEZ--Midfielder--Argentine--26---5.69 / 5.80
    Atalanta----Lars LARSSON----Forward----Sweden----4---6 / -----
    Atalanta--Glenn STROMBERG--Midfielder--Sweden--27---6.28 / 6.34
    Avellino--Jeronimo BARBADILLO--Forward---Perú---24---6.46 / 6.74
    Avellino--Ramon DIAZ----Forward----Argentine----27----6.21 / 6.38
    Como---Dan CORNELIUSSON---Forward--Sweden--17---6.05 / 6.01
    Como---Hansi MÜLLER---Midfielder---W.Germany---14---6.23 / 6.28
    Cremonese--Wladyslaw ZMUDA--Defender--Poland---12---6.15 / 6.26
    Cremonese----Jorge JUARY----Forward----Brazil----19----5.8 / 5.93
    Fiorentina--Daniel PASSARELLA--Defender--Argentine--26--6.34 / 6.27
    Fiorentina----SOCRATES----Midfielder----Brazil----25----5.84 / 5.93
    Inter----Liam BRADY----Midfielder----R.Ireland----29----6.27 / 6.32
    Inter--Karl-Heinz RUMMENIGGE--Forward--W.Germany--26--6.48 / 6.50
    Juventus---Zbigniew BONIEK---Midfielder--Poland---26---6.41 / 6.48
    Juventus---Michel PLATINI---Midfielder---France----30---6.49 / 6.52
    Lazio-----Joao BATISTA-----Midfielder---Brazil----18-----6.11 / 6.05
    Lazio---Michael LAUDRUP---Midfielder---Denmark---30---5.82 / 5.96
    AC Milan---Ray WILKINS---Midfielder---England---28----6.57 / 6.44
    AC Milan---Mark HATELEY---Forward---England---21---6.81 / 6.80
    Napoli-----Daniel BERTONI---Forward---Argentine---27---6.24 / 6.20
    Napoli---Diego MARADONA---Midfielder---Argentine---30---7.0 / 7.02
    Roma-----Roberto FALCAO----Midfielder---Brazil---4-----6.4 / -----
    Roma----Toninho CEREZO----Midfielder---Brazil----22----6.48 / 6.57
    Sampdoria--Graeme SOUNESS--Midfielder--Scotland--28--6.58 / 6.63
    Sampdoria--Trevor FRANCIS--Forward---England---24---6.19 / 6.34
    Torino--Walter SCHACHNER---Midfielder---Austria---27---5.9 / 6.02
    Torino-----JUNIOR-----Midfielder-----Brazil-----26-----6.83 / 7.02
    Udinese---EDINHO Nazareth---Defender----Brazil---26---6.29 / 6.43
    Udinese------ZICO------Midfielder-----Brazil-----16----6.4 / 6.50
    Verona--Hans-Pieter BRIEGEL--Midfielder--W.Germany--27--6.62 / 6.82
    Verona--Preben ELKJAER Larsen--Forward--Denmark--23--6.39 / 6.49

    Top 5
    1- Maradona------ 7.02 (rounded down)
    2- Junior---------- 7.02 (rounded up)
    3- Briegel--------- 6.82
    4- Hateley-------- 6.80
    5- Barbadillo----- 6.74

    Maradona is the highest rated player that season with virtually the same rate average as Junior (but like 0.05 above him)
     
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  13. Once

    Once Member+

    Apr 16, 2011
    Now this one:

    CLUB-----PLAYER-----ROLE-----COUNTRY-----GAMES-----AVG.

    Atalanta--Glenn STROMBERG--Midfielder--Sweden--30---6.26 / 6.56
    Atalanta----Jan PETERS----Midfielder----Holland----8---6.46 / 6.54
    Avellino--Joao BATISTA-----Midfielder---Brazil----14-----6.27 / 6.38
    Avellino--Ramon DIAZ----Forward----Argentine----27----6.52 / 6.57
    Bari---Gordon COWANS----Midfielder---England---20----6.06 / 5.94
    Bari-----Paul RIDEOUT----Forward----England-----28----6.17 / 6.30
    Como---Dan CORNELIUSSON---Forward--Sweden---28----6.04 / 6.01
    Como---DIRCEU Guimaraes----Midfielder---Brazil----25----6.58 / 6.57
    Fiorentina--Daniel PASSARELLA--Defender--Argentine--29--6.68 / 6.62
    Fiorentina -----
    Inter----Liam BRADY----Midfielder----R.Ireland-----29----6.05 / 6.01
    Inter--Karl-Heinz RUMMENIGGE--Forward--W.Germany--24--6.39 / 6.50
    Juventus---Michael LAUDRUP---Midfielder---Denmark---29---6.31 / 6.42
    Juventus---Michel PLATINI---Midfielder---France----30----6.49 / 6.56
    Lecce-----Juan BARBAS-----Midfielder---Argentine---24----6.38 / 6.34
    Lecce---Pedro PASCULLI---Forward---Argentine---23----5.85 / 5.90
    AC Milan---Ray WILKINS---Midfielder---England----29----6.34 / 6.34
    AC Milan---Mark HATELEY----Forward---England---22----6.09 / 5.97
    Napoli-----Daniel BERTONI---Forward---Argentine---26---6.14 / 6.22
    Napoli----Diego MARADONA---Midfielder---Argentine---29---6.58 / 6.69
    Pisa---Klaus BERGGREEN---Midfielder---Denmark----29----6.3 / 6.44
    Pisa-----Wim KIEFT-----Forward-----Holland-----30-----6.2 / 6.30
    Roma-----Zbigniew BONIEK---Midfielder---Poland---29---6.7 / 6.66
    Roma----Toninho CEREZO----Midfielder---Brazil----18----6.58 / 6.45
    Sampdoria--Graeme SOUNESS--Midfielder--Scotland--28--6.13 / 6.17
    Sampdoria--Trevor FRANCIS--Forward---England---14---5.97 / 5.99
    Torino---Walter SCHACHNER---Forward---Austria---28---5.83 / 5.93
    Torino-----JUNIOR------Midfielder-----Brazil-----30------6.61 / 6.60
    Udinese---EDINHO Nazareth---Defender----Brazil---30----6.27 / 6.27
    Udinese----Jeronimo BARBADILLO--Forward---Perú---22---6.17 / 6.31
    Verona--Hans-Pieter BRIEGEL--Midfielder--W.Germany--28--6.17 / 6.20
    Verona--Preben ELKJAER Larsen--Forward--Denmark--21--6.19 / 6.29

    Top5:
    1- Maradona------- 6.69
    2- Boniek----------- 6.66
    3- Passarella------- 6.62
    4- Junior----------- 6.60
    5- Dirceu and R. Diaz both with 6.57

    Renato Zaccarelli was Guerin's highest rated player of the season. DbsCalcio puts his average at 6.60. Since I dont have his Guerin rate I dont know if he would still be the highest rated one that season if counting all four sources.
     
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  14. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Also Gazzetta dello Sport had Platini higher. It only shows the first three names but I can figure out it was at least 0.20 points higher than Zico (6.94 is the highest average in history they've given, although their project started in 1982). Guerin Sportivo had Platini 0.24 points higher than Zic0.

    It means that the eventual end-result of 7.00 vs 6.71 in favor of Zico (0.29 points higher) is due to Tuttosport and Corriere dello Sport their considerations and average grades.

    Which sources are regarded as more trustworthy should everyone decide for himself but I've always understood that GS and GdS are the two most reputable (what I've heard and read).
     
  15. Once

    Once Member+

    Apr 16, 2011
    This would be season 1986-87:
    Foreigners:

    1. Diego Maradona (Napoli) 6.49 / 6.63
    2. Daniel Passarella (Inter) 6.38 / 6.47
    3. Hans-Peter Briegel (Sampdoria) 6.34 / 6.48
    4. Antonio Carlos Cerezo (Sampdoria) 6.29 / 6.30
    4. Preben Elkjaer (Verona) 6.29 / 6.26
    6. Zbigniew Boniek (Roma) 6.28 / 6.31
    7. Karl-H. Rummenigge (Inter) 6.24 / 6.33
    8. Ramon Diaz (Fiorentina) 6.23 / 6.28
    8. Trevor Francis (Sampdoria) 6.23 / 6.02 (Atalanta)
    10. Michel Platini (Juventus) 6.20 / 6.31
    10. William Brady (Ascoli) 6.20 / 6.16
    12. José Dirceu (Avellino) 6.16 / 6.33
    13. Leovegildo Junior (Torino) 6.12 / 5.99
    14. Klaus Berggreen (Roma) 6.06 / 6.26
    15. Nazareth Edinho (Udinese) 6.01 / 6.03
    16. Raymond Wilkins (Milan) 6.00 / 6.08
    17. Johnny Ekstroem (Empoli) 5.94 / 5.99
    17. Alexander Trifunovic (Ascoli) 5.94 / 6.02
    19. Glenn Peter Stromberg (Atalanta) 5.88 / 5.87
    20. Claudio Branco (Brescia) 5.84 / 5.96
    21. Michael Laudrup (Juventus) 5.82 / 6.08
    22. Daniel Bertoni (Udinese) 5.81 / 5.77
    22. Mark Hateley (Milan) 5.81 / 5.90
    22. Walter Schachner (Avellino) 5.81 / 5.93
    25. Wim Kieft (Torino) 5.81 [sic!] / 5.83
    26. Dan Cornelliuson (Como) 5.69 / 5.70

    Top5:
    1- Maradona----- 6.63
    2- Briegel-------- 6.48
    3- Passarella---- 6.47
    4 and 5- Rummenigge and Dirceu both 6.33

    Guerin's top rated player was Walter Zenga. Considering his average in the other sources was 6.83 he was likely the top rated player in Serie A that season.
     
    JamesBH11 and msioux75 repped this.
  16. Once

    Once Member+

    Apr 16, 2011
    Dont have the Guerin rates fot the following seasons, so cant keep going unfortunately.
     
  17. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
    Superb resume, Once, thanks

    Luckily for me, Barbadillo still had a high rating, checking more sources.
    So, you can't accuse me of being peruvian-biased
    hahahaha
     
    Once repped this.
  18. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Here it is. This is definitely the Gazzetta grading.
    http://football-ratings.blogspot.com/2014/02/serie-highest-averages-ratings-in-one.html

    That suggest GdS had at least a 0.31 gap between Platini and Zico (the full top three, with Platini at top showed at least a 0.20 gap). Guerin Sportivo had a 0.24 gap in Platini his advantage.
    So a 0.27-0.28 deficit together (at least).

    But all sources together show a 0.29 advantage for Zico, meaning that Tuttosport and Corriere dello Sport account for the reverse swing.
     
    msioux75 repped this.
  19. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
    Fair comment.
    For the most cases, the combined sources match the Guerin grades.
    And i think, you clearly show for what reason Zico would get the #1 place.
    I get the idea of both, Platini and Zico, performing a world class 1983/84 domestic season.
     
  20. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Circumstances and respective teams (Juve, Udinese) cannot be compared but statistically Platini had one goal more (two field goals more) and markedly more assists (I think 2 assists vs 10+ assists).

    But in any case, logical thinking shows something is not right. Tuttosport + Corriere della Sport have at least a 0.56 gap between Zico and the Frenchman!
    Esp. when considering that GdS had highest grade ever for Platini (6.94), and GS + GdS together have a gap of 0.27 (at least) in favour of the Frenchman.

    It's a personal feeling but a gap of 0.6 points feels close to 'bizarre' (also if it would've been in favour of the Frenchman).

    Hmmm, I see some more marked deviations between DBScalcio and Guerin Sportivo (differences of 0.30 points or more in grades).
     
    msioux75 repped this.
  21. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

    Sep 17, 2004
    Yes agree 86/87 was Maradona's best form (if not best ever)
     
  22. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

    Sep 17, 2004
    Very good remark ... that's why I am not so impressed with those ratings ... so subjective depends on what they "rate" (? unknown)

    For example, if one go for win percentage of team, then Platini was surely betetr (advantage to betetr team) but if one go for individual performance then Zico was up there with the very best - even he was not fully fit
     
  23. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    The logical derivative is that taking a average of four/five sources doesn't necessarily result in more accurate impressions as taking one or two sources (preferably 'the best' and most reputable/prestigious publications).

    A gap of 0.60, by Tuttosport and Corriere dello Sport together, is similar to the gap between Maradona in 1986-87 (6.49) and the 19th best foreigner Stromberg (5.88), by Guerin Sportivo.
    http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads...traniera-1980-87.1811217/page-5#post-30208755

    Or the gap between #1 Boniek in 1985-86 (6.70) and #25 Hateley (6.09), again by Guerin Sportivo.
    http://books.google.com.br/books?id=Kb4ThFgFRVgC&lpg=PA50&dq=boniek maradona&hl=pt-BR&pg=PA50#v=onepage&q=boniek maradona&f=false
     
    JamesBH11 repped this.
  24. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

    Sep 17, 2004
    Agree so ...
    It just gave some people who did not watch the games back then some good hints of how those players perform .. but not exactly and truely their form per se ... sadly
     
  25. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

    Sep 17, 2004
    A bit off topic... Simeone was never among my favorite players in his time, but he did impress me as Caoch.

    The 360+mils value team is struggling against 75mils team in UCL final now in extra time, ... 1-1 with a header goal apiece

    ... even they did better with ball possession from last 25mins into extra time.
    It looks like another penalty shoot out will be a decisive factor just like UCL2003
     

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