Serie-A 1960-61 (Stars not making the top-50) Players with high-probability to make the top-50: Considering the #points of the last-ranked in his role. x > 7,00: Maschio (24g), Cervato (27g), Demarco (23g), Sivori (26g) Players with medium-probability to make the top-50: Considering the #points of the last-ranked in his role. 7,00 > x > 6,50: Liedholm (25g), Gustavsson (29g), Skoglund (24g), Lojacono (27g), Boniperti (27g), Firmani (28g), Maldini (30g), Picchi (30g), Vernazza (29g), Selmonsson (23g) Players with low rating: Considering the #points of the last-ranked in his role. 6,50 >x: da Costa (30g), Vinicio (30g), Abaddie (30g), Manfredini (31g) Less than 20 matches: Bonifaci, Ghiggia, Pascutti, Montuori, Angelillo.
My estimation about best players in Serie-A 1960-61: 5 stars(0): - 4 stars(1): Buffon 3 stars(10): Charles, Lindskog, Losi, Balleri, Seghedoni, Bolchi, Tagnin, Guarneri, Corso, Ocwirk 2 stars(21): Pestrin, Garzena, Baccari, Fontana, Vincenzi, Trebbi, Ferretti, Marocchi, Trapattoni, Schiaffino, Hamrin, Pin, Sassi, Pelagalli, Carradori, Ghezzi, Gasperi, Bicicli, Bugatti, Salvadore, Altafini. Arguably 3-stars: Maschio, Cervato, Demarco, Sivori. Arguably 2-stars: Liedholm, Skoglund, Gustavsson, Boniperti, Lojacono, Firmani, Picchi, Vernazza, Maldini, Selmonsson .
dbscalcio offers some ratings for this season in series A. What I don't know is what sources they used to obtain those ratings. Does anyone know? The top 10 in this case were: 1.- Buffon: 7,067 2.- Lojacono: 6,870 3.- Charles: 6,855 4.- Cudicini: 6,788 5.- Lindkog: 6,758 6.- Losi: 6,750 7.- Santarelli: 6,717 8.- Bolchi: 6,707 9.- Seghedoni: 6,697 10.- Boniperti: 6,685
That’s the question, mate. In fact we don’t even know how reputable that website is, considering there is no way to confirm the original source or authenticity of it.
Before 1956-57 season there's no ratings, only ordering players by roles. 1957-58, 1962-63, 1964-65 seasons are missing. 1961-62 season, the order by role, seems due to a voting, not a rating system by match.
Here's the DBS top20 for 1960-61 season It looks like they input a correction factor (reducing 1 point for every 4 games) The order is the same as the ranking I posted, except for the fact that the list I take, favours players with most games: - My top50 had an average of 32,2 games by player. - DBS inclusions in top50 had an average of 27,6 games by player.
DBS additions for 1960-61: 3 stars (4): Lojacono, Cudicini, Santarelli, Boniperti. 2 stars (19): Janich, Rosa, Grani, Sivori, Cometti, Maldini, Magnanini, Picchi, G.Sarti, Mazzoni, Orzan, Castelletti, G.Gaspari, Dinelli, Liedholm, Marchesi, Mialich, David, Girardo. 1 star: Skoglund, Gustavsson, Cervato, Maschio. Low rating: Vernazza, Selmonsson, Firmani, Demarco
1960-61 Foreigners (38 players in 18 clubs) Very Good (6) - Charles, Lindskog, Lojacono, Ocwirk, Rosa, Sivori Good (7) - Altafini, Gustavsson, Hamrin, Liedholm, Massei, Schiaffino, Skoglund Decent (12) - Abaddie, Calvanese, Conti, Cuchiaroni, da Costa, Manfredini, Maschio, Pentrelli, Siciliano, Tacchi, Vernazza, Vinicio Bad (2) - Demarco, Selmonsson Few matches (11) - Angelillo, Antoninho, Bonifaci, Clerici, del Vecchio, Desiderio, Ghiggia, Guaglione, Locatelli, Montuori, Morrone
1959-60 DBS Calcio Top10 (34 rounds instead 31r that I got) 1) BUFFON, Lorenzo --- GK --- Genoa --- Ita --- 20 --- 7.28 2) CHARLES, John --- CF --- Juventus --- Wal --- 34 --- 7.08 3) HAMRIN, Knut --- RW --- Fiorentina --- Swe --- 34 --- 7.06 4) LIEDHOLM, Nils --- RM --- Milan --- Swe --- 28 --- 7.04 5) SIVORI, Omar --- IL --- Juventus --- Arg --- 31 --- 7.03 6) LOSI, Giacomo --- CB --- Roma --- Ita --- 34 --- 6.80 7) SEGHEDONI, Gianni --- CB/LM --- Bari --- Ita --- 29 --- 6.80 8) BUGATTI, Ottavio --- GK --- Napoli --- Ita --- 33 --- 6.78 9) ANZOLIN, Roberto --- GK --- Palermo --- Ita --- 34 --- 6.70 10)MAZZONI, Mario --- RM/IR --- Bari --- Ita --- 26 --- 6.69
DBS additions for 1959-60: 4 stars (1): L.Buffon. 3 stars (3): Liedholm, Mazzoni, Lindskog. 2 stars (22): E.Greco, Carpanessi, Battara, Panetti, E.Greco, Gustavsson, Segato, Leopardi, Vincenzi, Fogli, Matteucci, B.Sarti, Bernasconi, Benedetti, Cappa, Menegotti, Pesaola, Prini, Stacchini, Manfredini, Maldini, D.Arce. 1 star: Montuori, Ocwirk, Grillo, Picchi, del Vecchio, G.Rivera, Demarco. Low rating: Vinicio, Firmani.
1959-60 Foreigners (35 players in 18 clubs) Extraordinary (4) - Charles, Hamrin, Liedholm, Sivori Very Good (1) - Lindskog. Good (9) - Arce, Cuchiaroni, Gustavsson, Leopardi, Lojacono, Manfredini, Maschio, Pesaola, Vernazza Decent (14) - Altafini, Angelillo, Conti, del Vecchio, Demarco, Grillo, Massei, Montuori, Ocwirk, Pentrelli, Rosa, Selmonsson, Skoglund, Tacchi Bad (3) - Abbadie, Schiaffino, Vinicio. < 20 games (4) - Calvanese, da Costa, Ghiggia, Tozzi.
This is true but what I would say is that their ratings do tally up very well to other sources where you can verify them. I can't remember looking through any and finding them to be wildly different from other sources. Overall I think it's right to be a little cautious but it is a very good source. Edit: Though I would really like to know what the sources are.
Although it's a different league, for Barcelona 2005-06 I've seen some differing assessments compared to DBScalcio. For 1983-84 Serie A the same with different opinions on whether Platini, Falcao, Zico, Brady were the best and which one was the worst, with quite a standard deviation, and differences in grade between the best and worst. Looking at compatriots, there are some seasons, like 1992-93 (one example) where the top players don't have a certain starting place in the national team. For this season (as well as others for another club, for Inter) Winter was by all sources I've seen the top player in his position and even one of the top players overall, in the world's best league (speaking of that: it can underappreciate some flair players like team-mate Gascoigne, and it can underrate non-defensive players). Winter however didn't have secure place for the national team, let alone his best positions (against England for the WC '94 qualifiers he didn't play, and then was a late sub in the 2nd match). Rijkaard meanwhile kept on delivering the goods (there are rumors about why his 1992-93 ratings were lowered... after a stellar 1991-92). Opposite cases exist too, like aforementioned CS in 1999-00; per DBScalcio one of the worst countrymen of the league and his worst season, per my idea more like the opposite (for me it just doesn't compute, for reasons said there). I'm in strong disagreement there. Perhaps or arguably for the marquee countries ('brands') there is a better match, a better synchronization, with who are rated top and who - for example - play for their national side. There are simply many caveats in place, as was revealed later around Calciopoli when everything came on the streets. Overall though, I wouldn't say DBScalcio is less reliable or reputable than some other main sources or publications within particular circumstances, or even non-problematic circumstances. That Hans Henningsen dude for example (World Soccer correspondent in the 60s and 70s) was also an agent for Puma. Creates at least a potential conflict of interest I'd say, even if only subconsciously (has WS ever given that information/disclaimer to their readers?). edit: for 1960-61 Serie A it is also true cautions or sending offs bring down ratings, and that was a problem for Sivori...
I remember at the beggining of DBS it can be viewed his sources, in case of Serie-A, Corriere dello Sport and Gazzeta dello Sport (from my mind), sadly I can't see which sources they're using now. The case of Sivori (1961 BdO winner) is interesting. By overall points, he doesn't makes the top5 in his role (1960-61), for Corriere dello Sport, playing only 26 matches (missing the rescheduled match vs Inter, in which Sivori scored 6 goals). Considering the points from last rated Inside Left, Sivori could get at most a "Very Good" (3 stars) rating. Checking the DBS ratings, Sivori gets a rating, in between, Good and Very Good (2-3 stars) season. The next season, 1961-62, he gets 4th place in his role (by votes, I think), at most, a Very Good season, here. But the previous one, 1959-60, he gets an Extraordinary (4 stars) season.
1956-57 DBS Calcio Top10. 1) LIEDHOLM, Nils --- RM --- Milan --- Swe --- 26 --- 7.36 2) JULINHO Botelho --- RW --- Fiorentina --- Bra --- 30 --- 7.05 3) PINARDI, Umberto --- CB --- Lazio --- Ita --- 29 --- 7.03 4) FONTANA, Alfio --- LM/RM --- Milan --- Ita --- 34 --- 6.92 5) SCHIAFFINO, Juan --- IL --- Milan --- Uru --- 29 --- 6.89 6) VENTURI, Arcadio --- LM --- Roma --- Ita --- 27 --- 6.89 7) LOVATI, Roberto --- GK --- Lazio --- Ita --- 34 --- 6.82 8) BUGATTI, Ottavio --- GK --- Napoli --- Ita --- 32 --- 6.77 9) POSIO, Celso --- LM --- Napoli --- Ita --- 29 --- 6.76 10)VINICIO, Luis --- CF --- Napoli --- Bra --- 34 --- 6.74 Note: Gandolfi (GK) played only 18 games
DBS changes for Ideal XI 1956-57: Pinardi x Gustavsson Eufemi x Losi Fontana x Pilmark Vinicio x Secchi Selmonsson x Longoni
DBS resume for 1956-57: Extraordinary (1): Liedholm. Very Good (15): Julinho, Pinardi, Fontana, Schiaffiino, Venturi, Lovati, Bugatti, Posio, Vinicio, Ferrario, Bonifaci, Bernasconi, D.da Costa, Stucchi, Pesaola. Good (38): Franchini, Lindskog, Abbadie, Bandini, Selmonsson, Eufemi, Ghezzi, Giuliano, Magli, Pin, Ocwirk, Farina, Gustavsson, Bernardin, Pilmark, Morin, Montuori, Comaschi, Segato, Orzan, Corradi, Menegotti, Boniperti, Carradori, Secchi, Losi, Muccinelli, Galli, Bergamaschi, Ricagni, Maldini, Chiappella, Tacchi, Cervellati, Greco, Invernizzi, Benedetti, Bean. Decent: Gratton, R.Conti, Vinyei, Cervato, W.Gómez, Sentimenti IV, Arce, Skoglund, Magnini, Bearzot, Ghiggia, Frignani, Carapellese, Lorenzi, Vivolo, Firmani, David, Mari. Bad: Annovazzi, Pandolfini, Pivatelli, Hamrin, Dido, Giacomazzi, G.Nordhal, Rosa, Viola, Szoke, Blason, Vonlanthen, Bredesen, Massei, Sandell, Pascutti. <20 games: Gandolfi, Lojacono, Angelini, Vernazza, Soldan, Burini, Tozzi, Boccardi, Jepsson, Aronsson, Cuchiaroni, Buffon, Praest, S.Parodi, J.Parodi, Natteri, Cancela, Morello, R.Moro, Seghini. 45 Foreigners in bold, playing in 18 clubs.
I think the challenge in La Liga is that the scales used by the papers aren't the same (ie, you can't always directly compare the ratings from AS, Marca, Mundo Deportivo, Sport or any of the other regional papers) and they don't cover all the teams. I was just looking at the 2007/8 season for La Liga and Barca had the 17th highest rated squad, Atleti the 18th highest and they finished 3rd and 4th.
Yes I agree with this. One other interesting aspect is how it has been said for ages: 'In Italy they judge strikers by their efficiency. One in two or three chances have to be a goal.' The Holland variant of that is: 'forwards shouldn't lose the ball more than 30% of the time, after which his own team has to chase the ball again'.
Serie-A 1963-64 According Corriere dello Sport, for cummulative points, the top players were: 1. Janich - 248 points 2. Albertosi - 243 3. Schnellinger - 239 4. Fogli - 239 5. Colombo - 238 6. Negri - 236 7. Pagni - 236 8. Haller - 235 9. Da Pozzo - 232 10.Balleri - 231 This resume considered the 34 rounds, excluding play-off matches for title and relegation: There's also another source, posted by Titanlux about this season.
Serie-A 1963-64 season, based on average performances (CdS). Not appears in his role by Total Points due to few matches played. Maybe Top-15: Maldini CB-22, D.Sani IR-20, Maschio IR-20. Maybe Top-25: Zoff GK-27, Sormani IR-25, Suárez IL-26. Maybe Top-50: Losi CB-29, Rosato CB-30, T.Jönsson IR-27, Rivera IL-27, Seminario LW-23.
Ideal team 1963-64 (Corriere dello Sport unnoficial) -------------------------- Albertosi Robotti ----- Janich ----- Schnellinger ----- Facchetti --------------------------- Fogli ----------- Haller ---------------- Sivori Meroni ------------- Vinicio ---------------- Corso Arguably: Maldini-CB, Dino Sani-IR, Sormani-IR, Suárez-IR, Maschio-IL.