I don't think that's fair. Tite has been arguably one of the best coaches in the world since he started. Coaches that are considered "great" outside of Mourinho, always had a huge financial advantage over their rivals. Remove the financial advantage from Man City, what is Guardiola doing?
Wouldn't say he was brilliant but also not pedestrian. He put Ronaldo twice in front of the goal in the final.
At 18 you don't know how a player will develop. European sides are buying up flash in the pan players all the time. Then you stick them on the bench for 2-3 years, hinder their development.. by the time they're 20-22 they are no longer better than another 18 year old that stayed in Brazil, played the league for 2-3 years. Plenty of examples of that happening.
That's a bit of a different point than the main one you were making. That's hypothetical. Some players develop some don't. Regardless if they go or stay. Vin Jr. for example developed very well after he went to Madrid.
It's not, if a player goes to Europe too young and doesn't develop, he will be a worse player than one that developed because he stayed in Brazil and kept getting play time. Meaning that the best players aren't necessarily in Europe. Again, take a young player out of his element, and his support, he'll be a worst player at the end of the day. Meanwhile our league is still developing the players that stayed, and they end up becoming better than their counterparts in Europe.
Also.. I don't believe Vini Jr is great. I believe he's just fast and plays with players that help his style. I don't think he's that skilled at all, look at the video I posted.
He is a winger. He developed as such and is good at it. I don't think he would have turned into a Neymar or Ronaldinho if he stayed in Brazil longer. Keep in mind also that club coaches in Brazil nowadays, don't really work on developing players as they used to in the past.
Where do you get this idea they don't work on developing players? So they: - dont work on developing players - dont have tactical advantages - dont have good players - dont have good training regiments - wouldn't be able to develop a player yet somehow... Team A with 250 million payroll plays Team B with 25 million... Team A struggles to beat team B right? Vini Jr would never be able to be Neymar and Ronaldinho simply because he isn't a skilled player. He works out well in Europe, when a more skilled player like Ganso will never work in Europe. Nottingham Forest got Scarpa and had no clue what to do with a skillful player like that. Yeah Steve Cooper is the greatest coach ever... some Welsh dude can develop Andrey Santos better than Abel in Palmeiras. So what you're saying is that Steve Cooper is a better coach and developer than most Brazilian teams? That's your take?
I mean... for the country that develops a huge amount of talent... saying club coaches don't working on developing players is just saying a whole lot of nothing. Next you'll say... Brazil's national sport is volleyball, not even futebol.
Over the years I've seen interviews with coaches like Tele saying they used to help players develop and improve technique. I could be wrong, but I don't think you find that in the pros nowadays. Coaches are more worried about tactical systems. Scarpa skillful ? If we are calling him an example of Brazilian skill then our bar has dropped a lot. He is an OK player in my view. And I am a Palmeiras fan. He can cross the ball very well but pretty meh in every other department.
We develop so many players over and over that we haven't developed a decent striker since Fred. And that was already a step below his predecessors. Suarez gave an interview saying he was impressed with how every team in Brazil has a fast player. But he also said that the movement of defenders isn't very well coordinated so finding space is easier. He is hitting 14 goals at 36 years of age. So scoring goals like Paulinho has this season, isn't saying much and doesn't necessarily translate to the NT IMO. But I'd agree with you that he probably has space in the NT right now. But that's because like I said, for whatever reason, we haven't been developing strikers.
Again, you're saying the country that develops the most amount of talent, isn't as good as developing talent as Welsh coach Steve Cooper. Scarpa is extremely skillful. You don't lead your team to 2 Brasileiros and 2 libertadores by being unskilled. Much like Veiga, you can't really take the ball away from him, like most attacking mids in Brazil, he excels in taking the ball, taking on a player while still having control to either pass or shoot with a player on him. And he can cross, shoot and pass better than Guimaraes who worst than him by a lot when it comes to skill.
Endrik, Leonardo, Paulinho, Vitor Roque are all under 22 Brasileirao is one of the hardest tournaments to score. So not sure where he's getting this from. This ain't La Liga. A player with 20 goals is likely going to be top scorer. Suarez is 36 and a world class player. I'm not comparing Paulinho to Suarez, he needs to eat a lot of "feijao com arroz" to become Suarez. There are tons of over 30 year old players all over Europe still performing at a high level. But when they do in South America, it's because the league sucks? Isn't Luka 38 years old? I just listed a bunch of strikers we've developed recently. Dudu is hurt now, but he should have been in the NT for a couple of years now, including the WC. Before we had Romario then Ronaldo, Brazil always had a committee of players play as a striker. But we dont always have a Romario and Ronaldo up front. Nobody does.
You know what's crazy... Ange Postecoglou is considered a better coach and talent developer than anybody in Brazil, he's an Aussie by the way, they really understand their socceros! Ya'll can talk around it all you want. All of these English, Scottish and Australian Coaches aren't better than any coach in Brazil. They just speak english, and because of that they are smarter.
Scarpa didn't even play that many games in 2018 in that title. In 2020 he played a few of the Libertadores KO games but didn't even play in the final. Saying he lead us to those titles is just not true. The only title he really lead the team to was last year's Brasileirão when Veiga got injured. Anyways, we are way off the initial topic. We will just disagree on this.
You're talking about base development. I was talking about when hit the pro level. But we haven't had a great striker in a long time. I don't see how that's even debatable.
You're comparing it to Ronaldo and Romario? Nobody has had those strikers. As I said before, Brazil had a striker committee before we got Romario, then we got Ronaldo right after. The idea that you're going to get the next 2 strikers in the Brazilian all time list after Pele in the same generation is insane. Also.. I believe it's Pele, Romario and Ronaldo. Romario was such as ass they kept him out of WCs, because he would 100% outshine Ronaldo on both WCs he was left out (and the 1990 WC too)
The topic is still the same, European development of our NT is causing our NT to take steps back. Go back to calling up National League players, and players will remain on the league or come back to the league to get the call up. Do you really believe they want to play in the EPL... they're just going there for a chance to get a call up.
Seriously??? Doesn't make ANY sense.... Because ALL WC winners of the let's say last 30 years had most their players or best players playing in europe!
@Guigs I remember you from several years ago. You were always a poster whose writing was thought-provoking and if I'm not mistaken, you wrote some good stuff on the national team re: 2013 and 2014. I hope you become a regular. As another poster wrote, the defeat vs. Colombia took away any hope I had of him being successful as a national team manager for now. I like him, I respect his hard work, and kudos to him for the Libertadores title with Fluminense. But he's overwhelmed - this job is too much for him at the moment. Four strikers? With Colombia boasting physically strong and agile players, we needed more volantes. If he does this against Argentina, a team whose midfield is arguably even more robust than Colombia's, Brazil runs a serious risk of losing its first-ever home WCQ match.
I think you have a romanticized view of football. They go to EPL for money. For money they would even agree not to be called up to the national team. That's why many promising talents go to Russia, Arabia or China.
Brazilian, Argentinian, Spanish, Italian, German, Nigerian, Japanese top players go to the EPL because that’s currently the richest and most prestigious league in the world - similar to what Italy and Spain used to be. Can’t believe we are even having this discussion. If the Brasileirão was as good as you say it is, you would have seen better results from our clubs in the FIFA Club World Cup. European teams don’t care at all about this tournament and still manage to win it all the time. In England, the coverage of the Club World Cup is extremely small, nobody cares about it. A Carabao Cup game or even a Championship (2nd division) game gets more public interest. In summary: let’s not get stuck in the past. Football has evolved and so should we. This type of raiz mentality is what makes our football weaker.
Predicted line-up against Argentina: Alisson, Emerson Royal, Marquinhos, Gabriel Magalhães e Carlos Augusto; André e Bruno Guimarães; Raphinha, Gabriel Jesus, Rodrygo e Gabriel Martinelli. Diniz is going all in with his 4 attackers formation…
I honestly think he's just doing what he's told. The call ups clearly aren't his decisions. João is a bench player in Albion, that barely plays, you're saying he had time to scout this guy? The problem clearly is CBF and the sale of players. Avg age of the team is under 25 right now.