News: Seleção General Discussion 2023 - 2025 [R]

Discussion in 'Brazil' started by Ombak, Jan 20, 2023.

  1. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Ombak repped this.
  2. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Dodo (Fiorentina) is on the preliminary list. I think he got a call up before, or maybe he was mentioned but didn't (in 2023). I still expect Vanderson and Danilo for now, and they will certainly also be on the preliminary list.

    The only other ones mentioned in the article are from Flamengo: Gerson, Fabricio Bruno, Leo Ortiz. Very likely Gerson gets called in but the central defenders are just options if the initial choices drop out due to injury.

    The article also points out Rodrygo has been recovering better than expected:

    https://ge.globo.com/futebol/seleca...l-da-fiorentina-e-novidade-em-pre-lista.ghtml
     
  3. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
  4. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Endrick out is fine, for a rest, though it's going to generate too much talk. Hopefully that is handled in the press conference today and doesn't distract much later.

    Murillo instead of Beraldo is a very welcome surprise.

    Keeping Danilo in there just shows how slowly they move along and how conservative they are (which again, just leads me to say it would be better to call up 25 or 26 names to get another one in in those positions).

    Keeping Andreas in this call up means a better initial midfield line-up than we had last time, but that still needs so much work.
     
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  5. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Rodrygo and Militão went off injured in the Madrid game today. Not looking good for either. They will be cut.
     
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  6. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    #831 Ombak, Nov 9, 2024
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2024
    Militão in particular really concerns me, let's hope it's just a painful scare and not a new knee injury.

    Well, that was wishful thinking... Militão tore his other ACL. Another season gone.
     
  7. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Reportedly Martinelli and Leo Ortiz have been called in to replace Rodrygo and Militão.
     
  8. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
  9. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Today's training session:

    https://ge.globo.com/futebol/seleca...rupo-dividido-e-sem-pistas-de-escalacao.ghtml

    Just exercise for those who played on Sunday and some drills for those who played Saturday. No real clues as to a line-up, but the article points out that the only big questions are in midfield, where the last 2 matches had different line-ups due to suspension and injury. What combination of Andre, Paqueta, Gerson, Bruno Guimaraes will we get this time?

    MY guess for the other positions is Ederson; Vanderson, Marquinhos, Gabriel, Abner; ?, ?; Raphinha, Savinho (Luiz Henrique), Vini Jr.; Igor Jesus
     
  10. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
  11. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Tomorrow's match is earlier than usual. 4pm US Eastern time (6pm in Brazil).

    The line-up was confirmed by Dorival already. Same starting line-up as the Peru match, minus Rodrygo (injured) and with Vini back:

    https://ge.globo.com/futebol/seleca...ra-liberdade-de-movimento-e-fundamental.ghtml

    Ederson; Vanderson, Marquinhos, Gabriel Magalhães, Abner; Bruno Guimarães, Gerson, Raphinha; Vini Jr, Igor Jesus, Savinho
     
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  12. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Ugh ... might end up missing it.
     
  13. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
  14. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
  15. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
  16. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I haven't been posting much due to life, but I did have some thoughts about the disconnect between the team and the fans (not in the financial sense, which is its whole own story with CBF doubling down on ticket prices) and how there might be something there... just not enough to get Brazilians on board.

    Just on ge alone, there is a glass half-full take:
    https://ge.globo.com/blogs/painel-t...a-de-pausa-e-inteligencia-no-meio-campo.ghtml

    The traditional "time to fire the coach" take:
    https://ge.globo.com/blogs/blog-do-...-de-trocar-o-tecnico-da-selecao-e-agora.ghtml

    And this interesting statistical quirk:
    https://ge.globo.com/futebol/futebo...ao-do-top-10-da-fifa-com-menos-derrotas.ghtml

    Of the top 10 FIFA ranked teams in the world, Brazil have the fewest losses this year. That's definitely progress compared to 2023, but as the same article points out "por outro lado apresenta o terceiro pior ataque" the 3rd worst offense on that list.

    I think we all see the "improvement" and agree we're still far behind where we want to be and the offensive stats and the vulnerability at times are what lead to that feeling.

    But that feeling that us fans have definitely doesn't extend to the team, based on Dorival Jr. and Raphinha's post-match comments. That's ok, I would expect them to highlight the positives.

    But I also thought the post-match commentary on TNT reflected this disconnect well:

    On the one hand, the commentators see the progress. On the other, the are like "but it might be too late and we might need to replace Dorival". And these are some of the level-headed commentators.

    And then there were the comments by Bielsa:
    https://www.espn.com.br/futebol/sel...ndo-tiver-dois-melhores-jogadores-do-universo

    Dorival mentioned Bielsa was veyr complimentary, and he wasn't lying. To be fair, besides the hyperbole, I think there's also a lot of just praising our talent on the field. And he says when we have the two best players on the field, referring to Vini and Neymar, probably. And who knows if we'll have Neymar back in conditions to make a difference.

    But we're in a very weird place. Were it not for 2023's disaster, this campaign would be contrasted directly with Tite's insane success in qualifiers. That would be a very different perspective. But there is enough results-wise and maybe even under the hood, to suggest we might see that improvement next year.

    Then again, CBF could just hit the panic button or need a distraction and fire him... or we could lose more players to ACL injuries... and never find a midfield... so, we're still not close to where we want to be. It's just... it might be within reach. Maybe?
     
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  17. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Just to add to the disconnect between fans and the team ... before the game players were asking for people to show up and show support, but then the ticket prices are R$200 - R$800+ ... I am not sure what they are expecting. They need to start having a conversation with CBF about this if they want a full stadium.
     
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  18. Estuardo A. Lopez

    Jul 9, 2014
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Brazil's inability to score goals at critical moments and games makes me mad because this seems a problem since 2002. At the World Cup quarterfinals Brazil can score only goal.. What the F*ck.
     
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  19. Estuardo A. Lopez

    Jul 9, 2014
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Also, the general consensus is that Vini Jr did not have bad games against Venezuela and Uruguay. I agree with this sentiment and one solution to the lack of goals for Brazil is for Vini Jr to get cooking and start scoring goals. Somehow I have this fantasy where Vini wakes up and goes on a scoring bonanza for Brazil just like he does for R Madrid. Just imagine Vini scoring hat-tricks for Brazil.
    I hope he gets there soon because that would solve many or Brazil's problems.
     
  20. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    My two cents is that we still need more of a 4-4-2 or at least some two-forward system.

    That benefits Vini and works with the number 9 we need. The issue is, as it has been for a while, the midfield. You can put wingers on the left and right of a 4-2-3-1 and kind of have a 4-4-2 but that's very fragile. Still, that's sort of what we had against Uruguay and it was better.
     
  21. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    celito repped this.
  22. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
  23. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Well, merry Christmas everyone!

    There has been some CBF news since I last posted, and I thought I'd summarize here before going into a preview of next year.

    The rumors about Ronaldo being interested in becoming a candidate for President of CBF were true. He has confirmed his interest and we've heard some people, including former players, voice their support.

    https://www.uol.com.br/esporte/fute...elecao-aprovam-nome-de-ronaldo-para-a-cbf.htm

    Important note: this is for the 2026 election, so don't expect some big change this year.

    In fact, what is likely to happen this year is Ednaldo will try to consolidate his power. He has been doing so already, first by making himself eligible for two more terms:

    https://www.uol.com.br/esporte/fute...eger-por-duas-vezes-na-presidencia-da-cbf.htm

    And of course by continuing to offer favors to state presidents and working with FIFA.

    He has also continued to fail to delegate responsibilities and maintained Ramon Menezes as the men's U20 coach:

    https://ge.globo.com/futebol/seleca...da-para-disputa-do-sul-americano-sub-20.ghtml
     
  24. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Rodrigo Paiva was fired by CBF recently. He has been connected with Flamengo and also has a professional relationship with Ronaldo and it was rumored he would be on his team for Ronaldo's candidacy for CBF President.

    There is also reportedly a sexual harassment lawsuit he is supposedly named in, but that suit is currently under wraps and he is not confirmed as being accused in it.

    https://www.uol.com.br/esporte/fute...os-demissao-da-cbf-e-nega-caso-de-assedio.htm

    It seems he had a falling out with Ednaldo, it remains to be seen if the rumors of him being named in the suit are true, or not.

    So, for 2025, I expect we might see some more similar things, some people allying with Ronaldo, Ednaldo continuing to consolidate power and and maybe discredit those who leave CBF or back Ronaldo up.

    Reportedly CBF already expressed displeasure about one Globo presenter endorsing Ronaldo:

    https://www.uol.com.br/esporte/fute...s-ana-maria-braga-pedir-voto-para-ronaldo.htm

    I don't expect Ronaldo to win. He'd have to convince a lot of state federations that currently benefit from Ednaldo to break with the power structure and endorse an outsider. But as I said above, the election won't be until 2026, so there is time to build a plan and a coalition. Who knows.
     
  25. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    So, onto the national team itself. I don't expect any big changes, unless things go south for Ednaldo and he needs a distraction.

    Upcoming schedule:

    March - 2 qualifiers (vs. Colombia and in Argentina)
    June - 2 qualifiers (in Ecuador and vs. Paraguay)
    September - the last 2 qualifiers (vs. Chile and in Bolivia)

    Honestly, winning at home against Chile and Paraguay should be the points we need to qualify at the bare minimum. The difficulty will be the same as it has been this year: finding the balance and consistency that the coaching staff claims is right around the corner (and that some analysts and some opposing coaches see hints of) but that to us seems no closer than it was in Copa América.

    There is one big obvious question early next year: will Neymar return in March and what will he contribute?

    The other big question, personnel-wise, is whether Bremer and Éder Militão will return at the level they were at before their ACL injuries. Bremer might be back for the September matches, Militão probably not until after that, meaning our central defense will be Marquinhos and Gabriel for the foreseeable future. As much as people dislike Marquinhos, this is still a pretty solid defense, especially if we finally improve the protection in front of them.

    And the other questions are the usual, who can we bring in to shore up the midfield? To become the permanent laterais and to offer options on offense?

    Some players who are really standing out right now are João Pedro, Gabriel Jesus and Matheus Cunha. GJ has just been for a couple of matches and we'll see if he can maintain. JP got a call-up earlier but was dropped due to injury, so it wouldn't be surprising to see him. But Matheus Cunha has been the stand-out now for a few weeks.

    Of course, the problem with all 3 of those is that they compete more for a second striker/creator position more than for the pure 9 which the "esquema com pontas" calls for. So here's to hoping we move closer to 2 forwards again somehow.

    For right-back Vanderson continues to be above average for his club. The suspension in the last qualifier was unfortunate, but the March matches will be huge for him.

    For left-back, I still think we need to see Caio Henrique and Carlos Augusto again, both who are playing regularly, sometimes as subs, sometimes as starters. Samuel Lino has continued to figure as a left midfielder at times with recent Atletico Madrid changes so I don't expect him to get a call up at left-back.

    Moscardo and André Santos are two names I could see breaking through after the qualifiers if they do well in this second half of the season and then get playing time at their bigger clubs in 2025-26.

    For March, I hope we see new options at left-back, a complete midfield and maybe Matheus Cunha at number 9 as an option.
     
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