Seattle Sounders FC - San Jose Earthquakes (Wednesday, 5/13) pre/in/postgame thread [R]

To be fair, our midfield against Vancouver was also a sieve the entire game, with Vancouver moving at will thru the lines. In fact I think we offered more resistance against Seattle, as little as it was.

I’m more concerned about our starters getting that badly outplayed at home than our B Team getting badly outplayed on the road (which would happen with virtually any team).

The story of this game was basically that the B Team was set up for failure and they failed, and now people are shocked that they failed. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

One issue with our midfield is that among the 6/8’s, we really don’t have a speedy ball winner type. Everyone has either slow or average speed. So you see a lot of guys chasing opposition midfielders from behind as they slalom into our final 3rd. I hope Bruce doesn’t do the 4-4-2 again against Dallas. That makes the problem worse.

 

This game was kind of like the mirror image of the game against Seattle at home when they were heavily rotated and the heavily rotated team got the 1st goal but got hammered all game long in their own box. The difference was their non-rotated dominant home team came thru in the end and ours didn’t, but the margins are small.

In this game it was dominant non-rotated home team 24 shots and 3.4 xG to 11 shots and 1.7 xG to heavily rotated visiting team. In our home game it was dominant home team 24 shots and 2.8 xG to 7 shots and 0.5 xG for heavily rotated visiting team. Adding up the numbers, it's largely a push, and we actually come out a bit ahead. Yes, it's just numbers, and we lost twice, but it's something.

 

1) Why is Buck on the team again?
2) Jona is not good enough in the destroyer role... he's like a third backup for Niko in my mind.
3) Blame Roberts for the Ferrara goal... it was his pass and not Floriani getting skinned that was the problem.
4) Our flanks are useless with Marie and Skahan out there... don't play them together as we need at least one side that is strong.
5) I too am surprised we didn't get the push on the penalty. Can't figure out why that wasn't sent for review.
6) Blame the lack of a point on Harkes. His defensive effort on Nouhou's cross for the last goal was pathetic... he had plenty of time to confront him but decided to play 10 yards off.

 

Agree with the relative play in last night’s game. Disagree with reason for concern. This squad can play with anyone. I might reconsider if they lose at home to Dallas.

 

I barely noticed Buck, I think partly because he wasn't involved in much of anything (until a few moments in the 2nd half, like taking a free kick), and partly because he looks a bit like Skahan - similar build and gait, semi-blond guys, and for someone with not great eyes, they look about the same. Most of the time when I thought - oh, is that Buck(!?), it was actually Skahan.

 

I listened to Schmet's postgame and the contrast between him and Bruce is pretty funny. It's like Mr. Rogers to Oscar The Grouch. And as NedZ pointed out in the Heritage Cup thread, Schmetz mentioned Heritage Cup a couple of times, and not just in passing. He said it's important because it's important to the fans. If someone asked Bruce about it, I think he'd probably say he doesn't even really know what it is.

The one kind of disingenuous thing about Schmetz's postgame though is that someone mentioned that this is the 1st time ever that they'd swept the series with the Quakes (I think that's what was said but not sure). Then he went on to say that their home form is "impeccable" and then bragged about their win against the Quakes at PPP when they were heavily rotated. The disingenuous part is that he never mentioned, at any point in the postgame, that the Quakes were heavily rotated in this game.

 

I noticed Buck and Jona. They were mostly poor.

Our midfield was:

Jack S - - - - Nick - - - - Paul
- - - - Jona - - - - - Noel

Jack cut into the middle fairly frequently. So did Paul. Jona and Buck both sucked. And it hurt that Max behind them was unsteady. Also, Jack J was inconsistent.

We really fell apart.

Again, we need some reinforcements. I’d be happy to dump either Noel or Jona and hire a better d-mid to replace them.

If we need to play either Noel or Jona again, we’ll be in trouble.

Go Quakesfans!!

 

I thought we were badly outplayed. Not as bad as against Wankouver, but badly.

Again, really crappy “officiating.” Clearly biased in favor of the sounders. That concerns me too. Two games in a row with shit refs who hate us. That’s a steep hill to climb.

That said, we played poorly. We’re lucky that so many sounder shots were off target or it could have been a blow out.

We need to rotate fewer players, but more often. We can’t send out such a heavily rotated squad and expect to do well.

Go Quakesfans!!

 

I'm not as worried since I do believe our starters can play with anyone... when Beau and Budda were in the game changed (to some extent with the help Judd).

The problem is our bench. Too much drop off in midfield. Better stay healthy.

 

Jona has looked fine in limited duty with the 1st teamers, mainly helping to put games away. Once again, class, I need to point your attention to JazzyJ’s law. The best way to evaluate your depth players is when they are playing with (mostly) starters. When you put them all in together it’s unlikely anyone’s gonna look very good because they’ll be struggling collectively as a team. And that’s especially true when you’re playing a good team on the road and they’re playing their 1st team.

We have a lot of 6/8’s but I think we need a speedy ball winner type, a description that fits none of our current 6/8’s. Someone to help win the midfield. Peak Judson is probably the closest thing to that as a recent Quakes player. I don’t think Vieira is there in terms of buzzing around and disrupting the midfield. He’s fairly slow and doesn’t get stuck in as much though he does generally win 50/50’s and he’s a better passer than Judson.

 

I agree with your contention that any of these subs play better when surrounded by starters. Jack has gotten to play with the starters a fair bit and looked really good. But when he’s with a bunch of scrubs, not so much.

Jona isn’t terrible if Vieira or Beau are on the pitch with him. But with Buck and Nick? That wasn’t going to work.

I’d dump Buck and sign a replacement. And I wouldn’t play Jona next to other subs, well maybe next to Harkes late in a game.

Go Quakesfans!!

 

It's less than something - it's absolute bullshit that nobody but Strat-o-matic nerds give a flying ******** about. The only stat that matters is the one that shows up in the W-L-D colums...

 

QFT:

 

No need to get your knickers all in a tussle. People have talked about "fair result" / "unfair result" / "the score flatters them", etc. forever in soccer. xG is just a way to associate a number with that, but not everyone needs to like it. It's fine!

 

Finally saw the game. We got jobbed on the PK...that was a ridiculous non call on the two handed push. Seattle is a quality side, the rotated squad we sent out was clearly disjointed and collectively mediocre...
Buck was just a passenger in that game...neither here nor there...just floating around. Jona has skill but always seems to get caught out...the pairing of those two supposedly protecting an inexperienced CB pairing was asking way too much...just a recipe for high pressure on the D. With Munie out, Roberts was the directing CB, he had a pretty rough game... his intercepted pass started the counter that led to their first goal, granted...both Jona and Buck couldn't get back fast enough. Floriani had some big stops but some critical gaffes. He should've had help when he got cut back to the right on ferriera's goal. He has to try to block ferriera's potential left footed shot...that's his primary job...Romney was late covering for the cut back shot. Romney is just surviving out there...he'll make a play or two, but overall he puts too much pressure on our D. Third goal was just a disorganized marking crapfest...no pressure on the cross...floriani and Roberts both near Jasinski who's actually tight on his mark...three defenders on one attacker...with Romney having two attackers on the backside to deal with...Romney gets there too late to bail out Roberts...who should have accounted for de rosario.

But a game like this is a big time learning experience for Jasinski, Floriani and Roberts in an organizing role...just an onslaught of pressure to deal with.

I'm not a big fan of our hybrid zonal marking on corners...Ragan had a field day getting a run up to the crosses...he should have put away at least a couple of his 4-5 chances...mostly ragdolling Buck in the process. Need to have an actual CB on a guy like that...the dude is Goodson level,

schmetzer shouldn't crow over this game at all...when Leroux came in, the game changed...and with some of the other attacking starters we had several golden opportunities to
Break the tie...we got after them on our counters...but squandered our chances.

we need to get to the break and recover and heal up....also, agree with others for the need to upgrade our depth...Buck and Jona are not viable options as central mids

 

Couldn’t agree more. Once you get past our starting 11 things get thin. I get the short week but you gotta keep half the starters in. Especially in such a big game. I would hope team could get 1 or 2 quality players to shore up the roster.

 

So far, I'd say Buck is not a viable option at any position but given Bruce's apparent inability to admit defeat with a player he specifically went after I'm sure we'll keep seeing him...

 

I could do without Harkes and floriani too.

 

You’d think that Bruce would have had enough experience admitting defeat on a player he went after by now: Kaye, Lima, Buck…Romney now sitting on the bench mostly, collecting nearly $1M salary.

And not that I’d consider these failed players but he also went after Chicho and Josef then got rid of them and crowed about “addition by subtraction”. If we could just find the guy who made those additions that we then needed to subtract to get better!

The most charitable way to look at it is that Bruce didn’t know our team well and wanted to get some known quantities into our squad to drag us out of the dungeon. After a year with the team he realized that we had a lot of under-appreciated, under-utilized talent on the roster and that those guys he brought in were just getting in the way. He’s basically making hay with a bunch of acquisitions made by the supposedly bad GM Chris Leitch: Beau, Niko, Munie, Judd, Bouda, Ricketts, Benji, Skahan, Marie, etc. Will CL ever get credit for that? Nah, probably not, outside of this post, and certainly not from Bruce.

 

Basically what's happening with the Quakes is what everyone here expected. That is, Bruce decided to go into the season without filling out the whole roster and the moment we need to rotate or deal with injuries to our starters the team takes a major dive into our old Quakes.
It's been absolutely great that our starting 11 have been so competitive from the get-go but eventually these things were bound to happen. It's a very long season. Hope Bruce has 2-3 good to very good players coming in, otherwise I see us tanking the second half of the season. We can't sustain a whole season without injuries or drop in form and right now if any of our starters go down we've seen already the backups are not really up for the challenge. We've got a 3-4 bench guys who should actually be in USL.

 

Our backups have been pretty good when played in the context of mostly starters. Skahan had a brace in a game. Paul Marie had 3 assists in one game and has 4 assists in 192 minutes on the season, which is ridiculous. Nick Fernandez has 2g, 2a in 3 starts (and most of those minutes were with the B Team). Jona has looked pretty good coming in late to help seal wins. Harkes has filled in many times, at least servicably. Jasinski has done well in his stints at RB.

It's not that I don't think we could use some help. You should always be looking to improve your roster. But you can't throw your B Team all out together on the road against a very good MLS team playing their A squad and when they don't do will, conclude that none of them are any good.

And BTW our form started to drop even with everyone healthy. That's not just lack of depth, that's also the inevitable regressing to the mean after a ridiculously hot start, and some fatigue. I think a bigger problem with the depth is not the players but how Bruce has used it. He's going with a "binge and purge" system where he drives the starters into the ground, then tries to compensate by throwing all of the bench players in at once. The better alternative IMO is to work some rotation into your lineups from game to game. I think Schmetzer does this.

 

Arena seems to have an affection for Harkes.

I think it is because he was close to hs dad.

 

I don't understand the hate for Harkes. He's a serviceable two-way midfielder in MLS, and his beautiful combination with Beau in the box (Beau-tiful, haha) created Judd's equalizer. You could certainly do a lot worse.

Goss and Bogert on Soccerwise made the case that this was actually an encouraging showing by the Quakes, showing that the collective team built by Bruce's staff can at least compete with a top team on the road even without their big names and relying on fringe players. They also gushed about how good Judd is and even suggested Ricketts as a post-WC national team callup. A year ago I would have had my money on the likes of Skahan and Marie headed to USL or real estate brokerage, and here they are generating goals and assists....to say nothing of Nonso and Fernandez.

I don't know if I can really question Bruce trying to rack up some points while riding the hot hand. Niko is certainly an unlucky case but I would put that down to an existing condition with his adductor since it seems to be a recurring injury.

 

Yeah, I listened to that. It was kind like, wow, Bruce is a genius taking these no-name players and almost getting a result on the road against a good squad playing their A-Team. In fact they even did a bit where they listed 3 players - Jasinski, Crockford, and a made up name, and you had to guess which one is not the real Quakes player.

But it can't all just be Bruce and the players are terrible or "USL players". Virtually every player on our team looks better this year because they're getting regular minutes on a team that is, collectively, playing good soccer. And I think that goes for the depth players as well as the starters. We are all kind of looking at these players in a different way.

I don't know about Adimabua, but Fernandez should not be thought of as a USL player or real estate broker. Last year was his 1st professional year and he was one of the best players in Next/Pro last year (highest G+ in the league), + he has 2g, 2a in 3 starts this year with the 1st team.