Former D.C. forward, Roy Lassiter will be on the HOF ballot this year. Does he get voted in? Many would say yes for setting a league record of 27 goals in a season which still stands today would get him in along with his 88 career goals which is second only to Jason Kreis. Otheres could say no due to him only having 3 good seasons in his 7-year mls career. What do you think?
Roy is so underrated because of the amount of people that say the league was just weak when he played. That is bull. He put up great numbers and I still remember the game against Necaxa I think it was where DC was up and looked better until Roy got hurt. After he got hurt United lost a dimension and gave up 2 goals to lose.
Tough call... clearly a huge impact player on offense and in the midfield -- a constant scoring threat when he was in the box and a horrible dribbling/passing menace in the midfield. You would stand in anticipation of the impending goal when he was in the offensive third and cringe when he got the ball in the midfield.
Him being on the list speaks to the "on a silver platter" passes he was given by Etch, Harks, Jamie, etc... One dimensional, but a good dimension which was utilized by the coach and team in a deadly way. Not Hall of Fame IMHO.
Yeah, I'm thinking that there are probably others who deserve it more than he does. Is Harskie in the HoF?
He may not have had many dimensions, but a lot of other players received passes on platters from Etch, Harks, Moreno, and anyone else you can think of, but not many put them in the net like Roy did. I think you're selling him way short. Sure, it's one dimension. But it's a Hall of Fame dimension if you ask me. Vote him in.
Had he continue to have a good career after leaving DC and/or a more productive tenure with the MNT, then I would say yes. He's really on the ballot for only three excellent seasons, which resulted in 63 of his 88 goals, and that's hardly worthy of induction into an HOF.
27 goals 4 assists 10 goals 2 assists 18 goals 8 assists 18 goals 11 assists That 4 year stretch compares well with a lot of other top scorers Jaime Moreno 16 goals 8 assists 16 goals 11 assists 10 goals 13 assists 12 goals 7 assists Jason Kreis 9 goals 8 assists 18 goals 15 assists 11 goals 13 assists 7 goals 10 assists Razov (skipping 2001) 14 goals 7 assists 18 goals 6 assists 14 goals 8 assists 14 goals 6 assists Raul Diaz Arce 26 goals 2 assists 15 goals 6 assists 18 goals 8 assists 13 goals 7 assists Diego Serna 11 goals 9 assists 10 goals 2 assists 16 goals 10 assists 15 goals 15 assists Those are the best 4 year scorers I can think of in MLS and Roy is right there with them.
Also, he was a playing professionally before MLS. Could he have had 2 or 3 more really good seasons if MLS started before the World Cup like it was suppose to?
After I posted, I realized that I have no idea about HoF requirements. What is the percentage of players that get in? Something like 5%? 10%? 30%? I think that makes a difference. I didn't think of putting some kind of lower limit of years for players, especially for those players who were mid-career at the start of MLS. Like Roy was. Doesn't seem fair. But even if there is some lower limit, what is it? 3 years? 4? 5? If it's 5. Etch is in trouble, because he only had 4 clear-cut good years, and I think any HoF would be a joke without Etch. Besides, as a forward whose responsibility is scoring (so stats actually mean something, as opposed to stats on a defender) Roy had 5 decent or better years, with three years being outstanding. Year G A 1996 27 4 - #1 scorer this year, still the record for goals scored 1997 10 2 - OK year 1998 18 8 - Tied for 4th in scoring 1999 18 11 - Tied for 2nd in scoring, good number of assists 2000 8 9 - OK year, actually had more assists 2001 7 ? - was playing for KC now 2002+ ? ? - obviously on the decline, didn't bother looking it up. He comes in at his peak as the league gets started and has 3 great years, and 2 OK ones. Hard to keep him out unless you only let in a very small percentage of players.
But a Hall Of Fame-worthy career encompasses the entire career, not just a four-year stretch. Kreis continued to put up very good numbers in the in the ensuing years (43G, 31A). Moreno is at 33G, 31A. And you're leaving Preki, whose numbers are exceptional over an 8-year period (77G, 110A, out of the equation. Preki came into the league at roughly the age Lassiter is now, and probably would've had a typical year had he not been injured all season. 96-97: Carlos Valderamma 98-99: Marco Etcheverry Even in 2000 in Miami, he had Serna, Martin Machon and Welton setting him up. In 2001, nobody on KC had more than six assists. 2.5 great years. You're forgetting he sulked the entire second half of the 1999 season, and only woke up for Game 3 against Columbus. Again, if he had had any success with the National Team during his peak, his decline could be overlooked, but 4 goals in 32 caps is not at all distinguished.
If he gets in it is on the Gale Sayers argument. Over a 4 year span he was great, though his career was probably too short (in Roys case to rapidly declining ability) to put up some monumental numbers. Still I think he might get in based on the fact that when he retired he was the all time leader in Goals, not sure if he was for pts or not or if Preki passed him by then, most goals in one season, and that he set the standard for scoring by which all other forwards in the league will be judged. Another thing to keep in mind, his 88 goals, due to the structure of the league, may in fact keep him in the top 5 or 10 in league goals scored for a very long time. Jaime Moreno, whom we would probably all agree should be a first ballot MLS HOFer may not get to 88 career MLS goals in spite being a solid goal scorer throughout his career.
I might buy the Gale Sayers argument if Lassiter's career had been derailed by a serious injury as Sayers's was. I loved Rocket Roy but I don't think he gets in on the strength of just a few very good seasons. He wasn't a complete enough player to warrant consideration for entry to the HOF for anything but the numbers he piled up in a relatively brief period of time. Simply put, he didn't produce enough over a longer career.
This is crazy. Anyone who is denigrating Roy Lassiter's career achievements is living in an alternate reality. He's done more, in a career, than just about any other American forward. I don't know what the criteria is for Hall of Fame induction or how many other players he would be up against, but it's a no-brainer that Roy is at least Hall of Fame caliber. He may have a few questionable incidents in his personal life but his production on the field was as good or better than Wynalda, McBride, Kries or anyone else who's played in the past decade or two. It's the US Soccer Hall of Fame that's considering him. So while he may not be in the same league as Pele or Ronaldo or Van Basten, he's still miles ahead of almost any American forward.
http://soccerhall.org/halloffame.htm By these eligibility requirements, Lassiter deserves to be on the ballot. Production on the field doesn't count in national team games? It should count more, because it shows how the player performed at the highest level. Wynalda: 34 goals - played in three World Cups McBride: 25 goals - scored in two World Cups Moore: 24 goals - played in three World Cups Donovan: 15 goals Stewart: 17 goals - played in three World Cups Perez: 13 goals Lassiter was undeniably an important player for United, and one of the best players in the early days of the league. But that doesn't necessarily translate into a Hall Of Fame-caliber career.
Lassiter owned the car... he just didnt make the payments on it AFTER selling it to a former teammate in Tampa. Not nice for sure, but technically since I "broke" the story around here I like people to get it right --He stole a TV in COLLEGE. I don't think that required a get away car. The guy had great legs. Did I miss the tax evasion thing somewhere or is this just made up to add humor?
Actually, yes they did. Every player in the position Lassiter was in scored a lot of goals. Steve Rammul scored 14 for god sake. And RDA actually scored more goals in two full seasons than Lassiter when he held the same spot. 1996: RDA - 23, Steve Rammul - 14 1997: Moreno - 16, RDA - 15 1998: Lassiter - 18, Moreno 16 1999: Lassiter - 18, Moreno 10 Sorry to say it (since I think Lassiter was undervalued when he played), but if OTC had played up top for DCU 1996-1999 he (it?) would have scored a dozen.
I am actually surprised we havent had anyone complaining about his "first touch" around here... --To this day, probably one of the dumbest criticisms I have ever heard about a United player. Maybe it was the TV thing, maybe it was the third person speech pattern, but I could never understand why people took such glee in crapping on Roy. Especially when it was coming when he was at the top of his game (The man had a slow second half of season... yet carried us throw the playoffs) and from the same people that said they preferred that a$$hatt child molester Diego Serna to Roy. (remember THOSE great BS.com conversations??)
I agree Roy is a tough call either way. His induction would be based on a Gale Sayers-type argument, and maybe you could give him additional consideration based on the fact that he had already played some pro ball before MLS started (and did well; I believe he led the Costa Rican league in goals one year). As pointed out, he was a one-dimensional player who was an outstanding performer within that one dimension. Under the right conditions, he was arguably the best striker MLS had for the first four years or so of MLS. On the other hand, he was the sort of player who didn't help his team at all if that one dimension could be neutralized. I guess the problem in deciding is that, at least for MLS players, there isn't really a standard yet by which he can be judged. In most sports halls of fame, a few outstanding years but a relatively short career won't get you in, unless the few years were really among the all-time most dominant, like Sandy Koufax in the mid-60's in baseball. On the other hand, a boatload of good but not great years along with one or two really outstanding ones will usually get you in. Somebody like Steve Ralston or Mark Chung, for instance, would probably qualify. And then there's the performance on the national team. Does the fact that Lassiter's national team performance was mediocre hurt him? It might, but the question is, Should it? I feel like maybe yes, because I'd give more consideration to players like McBride, whose MLS credentials alone certainly wouldn't qualify him as a Hall of Famer but who proved to be a better player at the international level than Lassiter. We're going to run into this problem a lot, since many of the better players MLS has will go to bigger leagues after a few years in MLS. If you don't induct players who have short but outstanding MLS careers, you're going to leave out a lot of great players. All right, so I convinced myself. I'd vote for Lassiter.
Roy is up for his career achievements, not just his DC numbers. You conveniently omitted his 37 goals scored during '96 (27) and '97 (10). Also, why not post the scoring leaders for DC United's other years (Chris Albright had the opportunity to play with Etch and Jaime - why didn't he score lots of goals?)? I think, if you post scoring stats to show a more long-term picture, you will find a precipitous drop-off in goal production after Roy left. Did anyone besides ATC have a double digit goalscoring year between '99 and this year (Esky.) ? I believe Roy Lassiter still has the most goals of any MLS player if you include playoff goals (88 regular season + 13 in playoffs). And if you include CONCACAF Cup, US Open Cup and other official competitions I think he still winds up with well more than other players. It's taken 9 years for anyone in MLS, our nation's top league, to break his career regular season totals. And I know Kreis has much fewer playoff goals than Roy. If the Hall of Fame favors USMNT heavily over league stats, then Roy does not deserve induction. But if they take everything into account, he should get in. Lanky - do you have Roy's career stats with the USMNT? I'm actually a bit surprised he got up to 20 caps. I thought Roy would be a good call-up for road qualifiers in Central America, since he had played down there. He wasn't the best fit for our starting XI during his prime (quallies for WC'98) but I think he would have been a good person to have in the locker room and on those road trips. Also, does anyone know who all is on the ballot for next year and how many can be inducted at once?
You've conveniently omitted his record in his last two years (7G in 2001, 0G in 2002). Because Albright and ATC aren't up for consideration. Hell, AJ Wood scored 8 goals in 1999. http://sams-army.com/index.php?Mlist=player&Pid=9 32 caps, four goals. The Central American road qualifiers were where he did well, scoring twice there in 1997 (San Jose and San Salvador). His other two US goals came at RFK in 1995 against Saudi Arabia (coincidentally coming on as a sub for Wegerle), and at a WCQ against Costa Rica in Palo Alto in 1996.
Thanks, Lanky. Last time I remember him on the field in a Nat jersey was in the RFK friendly vs Argentina. I think he was involved in the US goal. Here's a list of who was eligible for the Hall of Fame this past year: http://soccerhall.org/Player_Eligibility2004.htm Off that list, Wynalda, Caligiuri and Michelle Akers were inducted. Anyone have next year's list of eligibles? from Lanky: I did post his career MLS totals. I think they speak for themselves.