Roster

Discussion in 'Portland Thorns FC' started by cpthomas, Feb 20, 2013.

  1. newsouth

    newsouth Member

    Nov 20, 2010
    Club:
    Santos FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    :confused:

    what does college have to do with the third incarceration of a women's league, where every penny counts for the bottom dwelling players, when they don't get magicjack or wny apartments, etc?

    either do the league right or fold again.

    for example, if a player like ellertson isn't allocated and will earn $15k, then have a list for her like the allocated players, where she can list, where she can afford to play.

    it ain't that hard.

    teams are drafting players out of their affordable regions like they are going to change the soccer world and shift the balance of power in the league. Really? o_O
     
  2. WPS_Movement

    WPS_Movement Member+

    Apr 9, 2008
    Has Amber Brooks even committed to playing for the Thorns at some point in 2013?
     
  3. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
    Well, Ellertson tweeted she wasn't playing this year because of family considerations, despite what others want to interpret about what her college coach tweeted, so I'm not sure you can interpret any thing but that Cindy wasted a pick. Ellertson lives about 20 minutes from Jel -Wen field, so that is where she can afford to play.

    And players are supposed to get a housing allowance, so wanting to stay close to mom and dad isn't a consideration in a professional league, if you want to talk about doing it right. This isn't Youth club soccer where you get to chose which team to give your money to.


    Players do have other options. It is not a monopoly. If they have the skill they can go play in Europe.

    Some have.

    If they can't command those contracts and still have a dream of playing soccer professionally, they should do what pros do and play where their contracts say they will, prove they can command a better contract, and then go where they want.
     
  4. newsouth

    newsouth Member

    Nov 20, 2010
    Club:
    Santos FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    What allowance on top of those 15-20k mega-contracts? Are you talking a daily meal and living allowance like MLB? :confused: Who said that?

    Until this league can pay REAL money, give the bottom dwellers a list. Let them pick the region they want to play. Ellerston was an example. I can't remember all those women's names, don't keep track of soccer like that.

    The un-allocated players aren't changing the soccer world. Now, some come from families with some pennies in the bank, so it probably doesn't matter to them.
     
  5. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006

    Good question. Here's one for you.

    Has Heath?
     
  6. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
    FIFA. Read their document on contracts and player rights

    I can see the conversation with Merrit Paulson.

    "Merrit, we are starting a league like two that have folded, where you kick in 5 million or something, but this time players get to go where they want.....Interested?"

    You brought her up. You must have remembered her name.



    Then it shouldn't matter where they go
     
  7. babranski

    babranski Member+

    Dec 15, 2012
    Raleigh, NC
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It doesn't seem like much, but 15 - 20k, good living expenses (which is a requirment of FIFA), and great benefits, just for playing soccer, is a wonderful thing for a lot of these girls. We're sitting here and comparing their contracts to NFL'ers and the MLB, but the reality is most of these girls are stoked they can live off of doing what they love. They are living a dream of sorts, and some of them are also hoping to catch the eye of Tom with their NWSL play.
     
    goaleemama, cpthomas and Cliveworshipper repped this.
  8. newsouth

    newsouth Member

    Nov 20, 2010
    Club:
    Santos FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    o_O

    I didn't come up with players playing in certain regions. That was the league. Then, it went out the door when players like Ellerston were drafted in parts of the country they weren't interested in, or did see it financially feasible to play in.

    The talent pool is about even after you get past a couple of national team players, so it shouldnt be hard for a team to full its' roster with girls from their region vs forcing someone to sit out a year.

    Exactly, this league isn't the NFL or NBA. That's why you let them pick the area of the country they want to play. Give them the same list as the NT players.
     
  9. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006

    I'm not sure why you keep insisting on using Ellertson as you example. She perfectly fits the model of players being drafted close to their homes. She lives in Clark County, which is directly across the river from Portland, and in fact shares the same Metro regional planning council. If it isn't financially feasible for her to play there, it isn't anywhere.

    That might be a different issue.

    And nobody is being forced to sit out a year. They can go play in Russia.
     
  10. babranski

    babranski Member+

    Dec 15, 2012
    Raleigh, NC
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You keep using the one instance of Ellerston as a reflection of something thats wrong with this league, why? It's obvious Portland made a tactical error, I don't think you should be trashing NWSL for it.

    Your cynicism is disconcerting.
     
    Nacional Tijuana repped this.
  11. WPS_Movement

    WPS_Movement Member+

    Apr 9, 2008
    I'm not so sure that Portland made a tactical error on Ellertson.
    It's possible, but there's still the possibility that Ellertson confirmed to Parlow that she isn't ready "yet" based on family or personal situation, but that she plans to be ready by the middle of the year (in or around June or so). It could be that Parlow knows that Ellertson plans to be there before the end of the season, and Parlow things that it's worth having a player like her for the playoffs, as long as she spends the rest of the regular season getting experience.

    But even if this were true, if I'm Parlow, I tell Ellertson to make sure she's running and training still on her own time, and comes on board in midseason at least "physically fit" (if not soccer game fit yet). She can at least be a 2nd half sub, if she's not ready to play the full 90 yet, and how valuable is that to have a fresh Ellertson starting in the 2nd half (latter 45 minutes) of games late in the season and in playoff matches?

    Or, Parlow just made a tactical error.
    We don't know for sure yet.
     
  12. babranski

    babranski Member+

    Dec 15, 2012
    Raleigh, NC
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    How many tactical errors have the great chess masters made before you go . . ."oh"

    I like to think Cindy's time at UNC made her a wily chess master.
     
  13. necron99

    necron99 Member

    Oct 17, 2011
    Club:
    Washington Freedom
    We still don't have a clear idea of whether supplemental players "declared" themselves eligible for the supplemental draft or not. It appeared that the teams declared players they were interested in and then chose from that list. Did Kaley Fountain, Tasha Kai, Tina Dimartino, Casey Lloyd, Tina Ellertson, etc declare themselves to the league only to decide not to play? If the players themselves never declared themselves to the draft it would be hard to argue they forfeited their rights.
     
  14. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006

    Well, you are right they didn't necessarily declare themselves. All players gaining entry to the league by any method were declared by the club after allocations and college entry draft players. The latter declared themselves. ( but had to meet graduation and elegibility exhaustion criteria)

    But both supplemental draft players and discovery players were identified by clubs, and the first team that Placed a discovery player on its list had first claim to them. At no point were players completely free to choose their club if they were on any club list.

    From ussoccer.

     
  15. necron99

    necron99 Member

    Oct 17, 2011
    Club:
    Washington Freedom
    As we have seen from the courts in cases related to the NFL it would be hard for a player to force the leagues hand in these things. However the player clearly didn't forfeit any rights since they didn't have any involvement. It cannot be argued that their rights were collectively bargained since there is no collective bargaining agreement for the NWSL. The Nat Teamers have a CBA but the non Nat players aren't part of that, and it is not a NWSL CBA. I don't think any player will sue to try and change it. They will probably just sit it out. Hell most other players would probably side with the league because they don't want to bite the hand that feeds them (USSF). The teams probably would side with the league for that reason too. But I don't see how it would hold up in court.
     
  16. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006

    Well, it is true that permanent rights are illegal that is what the Curt Flood reserve clause case was about.

    But rights to a player for fixed periods have been upheld in MLB, NFL, NHL, and NBA. Courts have ruled that the interests of the league are valid, and as long as they dont unduly infringe on player rights, they can be enforced.

    These are limited leagues. If you dont make the NFL, there really isnt anywhere else for you to get top salary.

    And in the NBA, the rights of draftees are negotiated by the players association, who's contract with the league has set the length of player draft rights, incoming player salaries for the first three years , and even the retirement terms for players not yet drafted.

    Here is a list of players whose rights are currently held by the NBA teams. The oldest one on the list I see goes back to 1995

    http://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/draft_rights


    With hundreds of clubs in the world, some of which pay better than the NWSL, soccer players might have a harder time claiming they are denied employment.


    The law does say that players can form a union for collective bargaining. Let's see if they do that, or if the new CBA covers that.
     
  17. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Paulson: Oh, it's like the French league where all the good players play for Lyon and the other teams divide up the rest :)
     
  18. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Actually, this is funny. Ellertson is somehow the poster child for for the supplemental draft which was speculated to have been started out of fear that Portland would get all the good players. :D
     
  19. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    UNC doesnt draft anyone. Basically they call and if the player isnt already going to Stanford, they come.
     
  20. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006

    I thought it was started out of fear Cindy wouldn't get Amber Brooks ;)
     
  21. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    I would rep this if the software worked correctly.
     
    babranski repped this.
  22. babranski

    babranski Member+

    Dec 15, 2012
    Raleigh, NC
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I wasn't being specific to drafting. Tactics wise I think she will be a wizard with the players at her disposal because of her time with UNC. No reason some of that out of the hat and in your face can't translate to Ellertson popping up mid season.

    "Surprise!" says Cindy
     
  23. babranski

    babranski Member+

    Dec 15, 2012
    Raleigh, NC
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I repped you to see if it would work for, sometimes it doesn't.
     
  24. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    i think shes gonna be a real good field coach but shell need time for the administrative stuff.
     
  25. MRAD12

    MRAD12 Member+

    Jun 10, 2004
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    I think some players feel it isn't worth quitting their jobs and moving 2,000 miles away to just play (or sit on the bench) for 4 months of peanuts pay. And some players who even live near NWSL teams may not want to quit their good paying day jobs for 4 months of peanuts pay. I think some teams may have tried to "grab" players before others did not knowing whether that player is committed to playing in the NWSL or not.

    Well, after the season is over and we go through all the changes and adjustments that we know will happen throughout the season, we can then evaluate and figure out what to do better next year. Right now, because of allocations with 3 different feds and salary restrictions and big time players making pre-NWSL foreign commitments, and many players saying they will not play this year, I think all the teams are a little in the "cloud" so to speak, and dealing with changes everyday.

    Can't wait for the games to begin so that things can start sorting themselves out.
     
    RUfan repped this.

Share This Page