Rookie of the Year

Discussion in 'New England Revolution' started by Soccer Doc, Jul 28, 2002.

  1. Soccer Doc

    Soccer Doc Member+

    Nov 30, 2001
    Keene, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Will TnT be elegable for Rookie of the Year? He was drafted and in my mind that makes him elegable.
     
  2. Coach_Barry

    Coach_Barry Member

    Aug 18, 2001
    Taunton, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    nope

    The buzz is that he is not eligible for rookie of the year because MLS, unlike MLB, counts his overseas professional career.

    But you make a good point and I entirely agree. He was not playing Division 1 soccer and was forced to enter the draft like every other rookie and (unlike LD) was not acquired or allotted or discovered to a team. He should be eligible, but all I have heard is that he won't be.
     
  3. firstshirt

    firstshirt Member+

    Mar 1, 2000
    Ellington, CT / NK, RI
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    the MLS considers playing reserve soccer as professional. if this was MLB it would be like playing AA ball or maybe A ball and he would be eligible for the rookie of the year award. If he is not eligable, then its a travesty.
     
  4. The REVerend

    The REVerend New Member

    Feb 25, 2001
    Newton, MA
    Oh well. I guess he'll just have to score a few more goals and settle for the MVP trophy :).
     
  5. Blathist

    Blathist New Member

    Aug 21, 2001
    Foxboro
    It wouldn't make sense for Twellman to get rookie of the year. To be a rookie, you have to have never played as a pro before. The fact that Twellman played in Germany before he came here would make him ineligable.
     
  6. Danizinho

    Danizinho New Member

    Jul 7, 2000
    Same goes for LA Laxatives' Carlos Ruiz - his previous pro seasons with Communicaciones of Guatemala applies, too.
     
  7. JMMUSA8

    JMMUSA8 New Member

    Nov 3, 2001
    Webster
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    but ruiz was not in the draft, twellman was.
     
  8. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is yet another of the "stupid little things" that MLS can't seem to get right. The idea of a "rookie" is pretty clear cut in sports where there's a farm system, especially the NBA and NFL, where players only go one way. Baseball has a clear rule that a guy can only have played in a handful of games at the major league level to be considered a rookie, so that September callups can be elligible the following year.

    I believe hockey woke up a few years ago when they realized that a 19-year-old draftee from the Brandon Wheat Kings shouldn't be held to the same standards as a 26 year old pro from Europe in their first NHL season.

    So what MLS should do is take a page from soccer leages around the world, and not the US sports establishment, and call it something like "Young Player of the Year" and make the cutoff that you have to be 22 at the start of the season. End of story. Then we wouldn't have people like Sharleze Manza calling Cate a rookie in every article, even though he was 27 and in his 9th season as a pro.

    Tom
     
  9. Rev-eler

    Rev-eler Member

    Feb 13, 2000
    San Francisco
    look only as far as ichiro to see the stretchiness of the "rookie" moniker.

    what did he have?.....an 8 year japanese b-ball career at the highest level before coming over and winnng the award last year?
     
  10. goyette82

    goyette82 Member

    Jan 16, 2000
    Lowell, Ma
    MLS rookie means - Previous year College player drafted to the MLS. Dumb I know considering how baseball does it.
     
  11. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Right, that's the same thing as we're talking about here. Baseball has had its head in the sand for so long that no wonder it still thinks like this. And while MLB may be of a higher standard, you can't compare say, a native Japanese player playing in his home country and becoming a star for several years with some guy toiling away in AAA and not coming to the majors if he had the chance. A guy may very well decide to stay in Japan by choice, but no one will choose to remain in AAA.

    Tom
     
  12. Rev-eler

    Rev-eler Member

    Feb 13, 2000
    San Francisco
    i think t.t. should be considered a rookie given his age and exp.

    tom, what if taylor toiled on the 1860 reserves 'til he was 28, let's say, with no first team call up....came over and had this year....would you feel any different or not? for some reason, i think i might.

    i think mls should look at everyone, case by case and label them as soon as they play with the team at whatever point of the year. given the nature of player moves along with age considerations of the professional soccer player...its very difficult to nail down a definition.
     
  13. ursula

    ursula Member

    Feb 21, 1999
    Republic of Cascadia
    I really feel for you guys; Twellman is the best first year player this year with Ruiz probably second. Neither one is eligible however. This is like last year with Landon Donovan being not eligible either (neither was APC or other vets of foreign leagues for that matter) and he was the best first year young player by far (over the actual rook of the year, Faria).

    However I am glad that we are not following baseball with it's snotty attitude towards the rest of the world: their attitude is that if it didn't happen in MLB than it didn't happen. Twellman and Donovan played and developed in foreign leagues, not college here in the states. For Taylor and Landon that development in Germany was huge for their growth and by the time they started MLS play they were miles ahead of US college players.

    I also like the idea of having a young player's award regardless of their background- have a cutoff age at 22 or 23. There is a youth award that US Soccer gives out- (which I suppose Donovan will win over Twellman this year) why not in MLS?
     
  14. JMMUSA8

    JMMUSA8 New Member

    Nov 3, 2001
    Webster
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    the difference between Donovan and Twellman is that Twellman did go to college, did play 2 years in Germany and was picked in the Superdraft, unlike any of the other guys you named.
     
  15. ursula

    ursula Member

    Feb 21, 1999
    Republic of Cascadia
    Very true.

    In a nutshell:

    -The case for TT is all based on the fact that he went through the Superdraft and nothing else.

    -The case against TT is based on the fact that he played pro ball in Germany and nothing else.

    -As an aside, one doesn't have to participate in a draft to be eligible as neither the winner of the award in 98 (Ben Olsen) nor the runner-up (Josh Wolff) were drafted. However that same year another undrafted player, Stern John, was deemed not eligible for the award becaue he had played A-league the prior year, even though John had attended a US community college two years prior to that.

    -And neither does one have to attend college for any length of time to be eligible for the award as both Bobby Convey and Santino Quaranta received votes the past two years. Of course neither one of those guys had gone pro unlike Twellman.

    The precedent being cited is that playing any level of pro ball makes you ineligible. There is no precedent in regards to the Superdraft, or maybe it's better to say that no precedent has been set about participating in the Superdraft makes you eligible regardless of your past.
     
  16. twell_girl

    twell_girl New Member

    Jul 28, 2002
    cali
    make taylor eligible!!! he deserves it!!!
     
  17. Jim Dow

    Jim Dow New Member

    Mar 20, 1999
    Belmont, MA
    Welcome Twell Girl! He certainly desrves it one that smile alone!

    JIM DOW
     
  18. JohnnyRev

    JohnnyRev Member

    Feb 23, 2001
    Boston, MA
  19. NER_MCFC

    NER_MCFC Member

    May 23, 2001
    Cambridge, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Now I can see a player like Ruiz or Stern John not being eligible if you want to cut it that way, but they at least played on THE FIRST TEAM. Twellman and Donavan never played a minute for their 1st teams in Germany.

    If MLS isn't going to do a Young Player of the Year (and I think they should), they should at least put in criteria that make sense. For example, any player is eligible who has not played a certain number of games or spent a certain number of days on a major league roster in a single season. I think it's something like 15 or 20 games or 45 days. I know that the 45 days is so that players who are called in when roster limits go up in September do not lose their eligibility.

    I think a rational equivalent for MLS would be to call rookies all players who did not have at least 2 games worth of playing time for a 1st team in a professional (as defined by FIFA) league.
     

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