I agree with DanB that it is less typical for outside backs in a 352 to make many overlapping runs (than it is for outside backs in a 442), although DC plays the formation exactly the way that you describe here (with Brian Carroll as protection). I prefer that the outside backs 'underlap' if they are coming out of a 352, because they are not USUALLY as mobile, or skillful at beating men in close space along the line, as fullbacks. But that is not quite the case with your fullbacks. If they do overlap, it is important that the off-side outside back stay home to provide additional cover. But what is especially important is that the entire line get involved in linking play and sustaining play during extended sequences of possession in the attacking zone. If the defenders do not first pass through the midfield and secondly support the midfield once the whole team pushes up - then it is very difficult to maintain solid attacking pressure. Some backs are much better at subtly positioning themselves off-the-ball to be useful as options at the back, quickly moving the ball or switching it to another player to unbalance the defense. If backpasses to defenders take too much time (i.e. if defenders do not push up enough) or become too predictable (in terms of how the ball is cycled), it causes the entire team to get static and the defense will also fail to 'bite' when defenders have the ball. If Dorman or Marshall are having especially weak games from a distribution standpoint, it makes sense for them to hang-back more and allow Riley and Heaps to occasionally make runs from deeper positions and try to get involved. Even though Heaps and Riley are playing in a 3 man backline, both are (or were) capable midfielders and are worth 5 - 6 solid attacking touches a game. Makes sense to use them after a couple of crosses (in a row) go awry.
No. Cancela doesn't have a future with this team. Unlike Smith and Dorman, SN is done investing in Cancela. He is not designated as a regular super-sub or we'd have seen him at RBNY. He is delegated to a "know quantity" that SN will use in a "roll-the-dice" because we are behind situation. I get what he is trying to do. I may be wrong in estimating Cancela has value to other MLS teams but I see his best contribution to this team as trade bait for a upgrade at some position. I see a bigger role as trade bait than as occasional bench sub. BTW, What does it take to "claim" a starting role? I'm interested because that might explain Franchino's regular starting role. The bar is certainly set differently for Cancela. 3 games in, I'd say Twellman hasn't claimed a starting role either. But we'll see him start again next week.
In order for Cancela to claim the starting role, I think we would need to change back into a 352 or a 442. Cancela does not fit into the 343 as he basically just an attacking midfielder and most 343's do not support a pure attacking midfielder. He does not have the defense to be a two way midfielder or the forward mentaility. I think Cancela may eventually regain his starting status on this team, even if it is only for home games. As Nicol, appears to prefer a more defensive style on the road. I would prefer to move back to a 352 or even a 442 with Cancela starting at attacking midfield, moving Dempsey back into the midfield. Against NY we were getting the better of play. I do not think Nicol wanted to risk a defensive laps that Cancela may have brought. While I do not agree with this, I can understand where Nicol may be coming from. I think Cancela does have a role to play here and will be one of the first subs off the bench in many games as well as starting throught the world cup. He may also play his way back into a starting role by helping to create a more fluid team.
franchino has less (not even on the same scale) skill than Cancela. but he sure doesn't ever say die. and he does do more to keep the ball out of our net than cancela does. he's a lunchpail guy, and very consistant - both for his good (hard work, defenseive effort) and his bad and ugly (bad touches, passes to other team). apparently that counts for more in Nicol's estimation (and in the league table for that matter) than being 'silky' or 'sublime'... you could even argue that cancela is INCAPABLE of replicating what franchino is good at (and vice-versa) I think if cancela was a leading scorer in MLS over the past few seasons, Nichol would give him a bit more rope. don't be silly comparing him to twellman. and to state the obvious, cancela's done with this team when he quits, retires, or is traded or sold abroad. Nicol has no incentive to encourage any of those options, unless someone better comes along. given our potential depth issues during the WC, i'd say cancela's close to untouchable. you know of anything like that happeneing? if not, he's going to get time when Nicol wants to try a different look, or if injuries or WC callups move him up the chart. That could change if he 'claims' his spot in practice, and in the games he gets into. and patfan1 - a couple of 1/2 chances in a losing effort where your attack is useless doesn't usually get a coaches attention. Cancela is fighting 2 battles. - 1 is the style of play the team has to take on when he is on the field, and - 2 is his actual performance. He could play very well, but still not be the prefered option if Nicol is 'over coaching' or trying to put his 'best' defensive line up out there. in reality, - 1 his 'style' hasn't made much of an impact on the teams success, and - 2 his play has been average at best.
Snipped just to save space. I see alot of overlap in our opinions. To SN, defense matters. Cancela is not about defense and, at his age, isn't going to magically change his ways. I simply don't get the league table comment. Only defense matters? Go ahead, call me silly. I'll compare Cancela to Twellman because it is a team game. Cancela's perceived performance is sometimes his fault sometimes the teams. I don't often see him cut any slack while Twellman will get alot. I guess I need to define "DONE." I'll begin by asking where you work. Big corporation or small business? For me right now it is the former. There are plenty of people where I work that are 10, even 15 years from retirement. But everyone knows they will never get another promotion, never get more than a "cost of living" sized raise. The company knows what they can do, it lets them do it, but it doesn't want them to manage anyone or anything. It doesn't want to give them any additional responsibility. They are "done." Cancela is done. SN knows what he can do, he will even let him do it from time to time. But SN doesn't see Jose as his midfield leader. He is done. (And BTW, I bet on a personal level that SN likes Cancela so this isn't about "hate") You may be right that Cancela will get more exposure during the WC but that is like making one of my big corporation "donners" an "acting" lead of something until the company can hire a more permanent solution. Cancela could start 8 straight during the WC then be released by August. BTW, your argument about how he is untouchable also speaks volumes about the lack of improvement of team depth
I don't think it's really about Pepe's defense any more. Nicol knows that he will try, but not have too much impact. I think the problem is just that he doesn't make enough difference offensively on a consistent basis. I'm as big a fan of "attractive soccer" as anyone and Cancela is by far the best at that as anyone on the Revs. But that rarely translates into "effective soccer". Maybe it would if he had 2 or 3 guys on the same page with him (we used to say that about Cate), but that's besides the point, since it's really all about results. As for him not magically changing his ways, I thought (although didn't expect) that he could have hit the weight room and gotten stronger and faster to be able to ride off the inevitable challenges. Strength is very underrated in football and Cancela's a weakling.
Okay, all I'm maintaining is my definition of "he's done" with the Revolution and that we should try to use him to upgrade at some position. Okay, keeping in mind that I'm saying unload him and that I don't have the energy to dig up the data, my simple mind says: The Revs had a higher points-per-game average over the 1st half of 2005 than the last half. That first half was when Pepe saw more playing time and more starts. So how does results factor into it? I can see him getting stronger but have a hard time envisioning him getting faster. Okay, he didn't bulk up. It's his fault. It really doesn't matter (to me) at this point. Boy, I wish there was some real REVs news because this horse is well and thoroughly beaten beyond death.
and that sums up the next 5-6 days of our lives unless my plan at meet the revs to tell dempsey that Joey called him and "inbread sheepfcuking brokeback texan who punches like a girl" works. then we'll have plenty to talk about
It's a dead house but relevant one when the revs aren’t scoring there is a skillful player on the bench while less skillful players are playing. My two cent on this debate it part tactical and part style. I've made this point before but it's worth repeating that Cancela's problem has more to do with a style contrast then anything else. The Revs rely on moving the ball quickly with only one or two touches while Cancela tents to hold the ball for longer periods of time and tents to slow the pace of the team. However, I think Cancela improved greatly in this area at then end of last year and I don't think this is a problem anymore. My other point is tactical, I think having a long road trip to open the season SN was playing it conservative and going with a defensive lineup. I think we will see Cancela's mins. improve over the course of the next few weeks.
They may "go to ground" at a similiar rate, but Twellman is getting decked by the likes of Jim Curtin, while Cancela is abused by the Jesse Marsch's of the world. He actually played about 2500 minutes last season, so I don't think it's that cut and dried. He ended up with 2 goals and 5 assists and had a goal and an assist (almost half of his overall stats) in the last couple of games, so I'm not sure that his first half was better. He DID have a lot more playing time in the first half (and in first halves).
The results were better in the first half, whether he got more goals and assists then or not. I was responding to the "results matter" post which I assume meant the outcome of the game. But the nature of your post tells me results don't matter unless he scores or has an assist? Could you have picked someone other than Jim Curtain? Or is that the point? Twellman is getting decked by the scrawniest defender in MLS?
Jim Curtin is "scrawny"? Whatever, Twellman is usually tasked with trying to hold the ball up against the opponent's central defender, generally the biggest, strongest guys in the league. When the Revs foolishly play high balls, Twellman usually ends up with a forearm in the neck and a hard landing. Cancela is going to get hacked and trampled by whatever midfielder is closest. It makes little sense to let him handle the ball when he's so easy to knock down - you can do it with so little effort, that it rarely draws a card. And yes, statistics rarely show the whole picture, but at attacking mid, particularly on a team that scores lots of goals (as the Revs have until lately), I think he should be picking up more than 5 assists. But, as I've pointed out many times, last year the Revs scored late very often and Cancela usually departed early.
Twellman is routinely decked whenever he receives the ball with his back to goal, regardless of whom we are playing against. I suppose my point is that both Twellman and Cancela are players with limited skill sets, luxury players if you will. Twellman can't dribble, pass, hold the ball effectively, or shoot from distance. He makes an effort to defend (to his credit), but is only a USMNT candidate because he is the supreme poacher. Cancela can't head, run, penetrate, shoot from distance, or reliably win balls in the midfield. He makes more of an effort to defend than he is given credit for, but is not a defensive presence. He is, however, the silkiest dribbler and has the best vision on the team. Both Cancela and Twellman force the players around them to work harder. Yet for many on this board, Cancela is a burden, and Twellman is untouchable. IMO, it's not that Cancela is a bad player, it's that those two on the field at the same time doesn't work. Twellman needs two-way center mids who can carry the ball into the attacking third, and threaten to score. Cancela needs a center forward who can get into good space, and attack with the ball at his feet.
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Jon Martin again. Great analysis Jon. My guess is what you point out in your assessment is the reason we see Dempsey playing a withdrawn forward/AMF with TnT and Noonan up top. Duce can carry the ball at his feet and just loves to attack from deep. In some respects the same with Noonan. Both these players are complamentry to TnT's style and limitations. Of course this works much better when there is effective wing play whipping in crosses
prettty fair assesment. except twellman's goal scorring and late game winners are a luxury just like winning games are a luxury. the diff between the two is that the one thing twellman does is LEATHAL and the one think cancela does can sometimes be productive and create chances, and sometimes not. also, to be fair, a striker can suck for 89 minutes, and have 1 minute of brilliance or luck, and earn his paycheck. a midfielder is counted on for much more and doesn't have that luxury. that works against cancela, and is probably part of why he is where he is on the depth chart.
I had mentioned that before about dempsey playing back, I started to think I was nuts and was banging my head against a wall and not a person on the planet agreed. glad to see I'm not alone. there are a lot of guys on here who know a lot so it's nice to see when I'm not too far off the mark Thanks btw, I hit him props for this comment earlier
I only disagree with your analysis on this point he can Shoot for distance and score but really does. i'm not sure why this is, but it is. In fact, this is one of the Revs areas of weakness, we don't shoot well from distance.