Revs v CRapids, 9/18 Post Match [R]

Discussion in 'New England Revolution' started by Danizinho, Sep 18, 2003.

  1. Rev-eler

    Rev-eler Member

    Feb 13, 2000
    San Francisco
    as soon as i saw taylor take the ball from cancela....i said no way is this going in (although i thought the reason would be going wide). everyone around me was saying the same thing.

    what a selfish move on HIS part. this is not like manny swinging for the fences in the 9th when the sox just need a single....and one can say "hey he is what he is, we just have to take the good with the bad". this was a break in play. time for thought. and for the very reasons HE, HIMSELF, stated today in the globe today....HE should have known HE wasn't the person for that situation.

    i heard people saying that this was probably a result of the scoring race and tnt wanting to keep pace. i don't buy that at all. this was outright selfishness. HE wanted the storybook comeback ending. the whole enchilada. HE wanted to be the hero and didn't think about the fans or, more importantly, HIS team ahead. I don't really care how young HE is or what HE'S done for the team in the past......this was inexcusable.

    i'm thoroughly disappointed in HIS unwillingness to say how lame it was publicly. "he made a big time save" HE says. hey t, go back and check the tape on it. Slyde could've made the save....you kicked it about as hard and predictable as some 10 year old kid during a halftime promotion. then again, slyde would've probably helped you and your confidence by doing the ol' ball thru the legs thing and then giving you a big furry pat on the tush and a free coupon for some yogurt.
     
  2. ktsd

    ktsd Member

    Jul 20, 1999
    Bethel, CT, USA
    Actually, I'm in agreement with you on both of these counts. But I had the benefit of a TV replay... I have to wonder how it looked in person.

    However, I DO think Carrieri to a swipe a someone (Heaps, maybe?) after he was beaten off the ball. But then the camera was panning quickly away from the incident to follow the ball.

    Overall, I don't think it was as harsh a game as the number of cards made it seem. Sure there was some weight being tossed around in both directions.... but it IS a contact sport!

    Kevin D.
     
  3. Beast_Ed

    Beast_Ed Member

    Jul 15, 2003
    Boston MetroWest
    I'm so bored and friggen frustrated with the Rev's .. it's taken many years for me to finally say this.

    Oh god, I need prozac.

    I wish the Revolosers had a real leader on the field .. some sort of supporting player that could run the team, score goals, make assists, and make everyone work for EACH OTHER on the field.

    Beastie
     
  4. rkupp

    rkupp Member+

    Jan 3, 2001
    I also thought Cancela should have taken it. The one he did take was so well done, the goalie had no idea where he was going. I think the Revs ended up losing 2 points because they dared think about the scoring race instead of winning the damn game! You never use a guy who hasn't played in a month, and you USUALLY don't use the guy who was fouled - unless he's clearly your best!

    I thought the carping about playing too much to Twellman is all 2nd guessing. That's the way they've played all year - and scoring hasn't been their main problem. Twellman OFTEN has tough games where he's just missing time after time, and then, late in the match finishes one off. Well this time it didn't quite happen.

    A "coming off two-week injury" Chris Brown for Twellman???? Get REAL! So, Brown had a hat-trick where he was set up beautifully every time - now he's Ronaldo?

    Kamler had a couple of great chances. Ralston had chances. Heaps had a couple of chances. Joseph managed a dangerous shot. Cancela had chances. Twellman had lots of chances and wasn't too far off. And, he earned a PK, which should have been enough.

    When the game got to 10v9 there is so much open space that possession is magnified. Every time you give up the ball, your defense has to work extra hard and long to get the ball back. So you need to be more conservative in maintaining the ball.

    Somebody on this team needs to smack Rusty upside the head. After he took the elbow, he lunges at the ref and practically begs for a yellow. A minute later he's still carping at the ref and finally commits the intentional foul that gets he the yellow that he was clearly pining for. After the hit he was down of the turf for about 2 minutes - surely enough time to clear his head and get composed - and still he acts like an idiot.

    I thought it was pretty telling that none of his teammates pulled him aside to make sure he calmed himself down.

    Kamler's foul was reckless, but not intentional and not dangerous, and was an attempt to play the ball - similiar to Califf's kick to Twellman's shnoz - he just whirled and kicked at where he thought the ball was. It was a yellow at best, and probably not even that. When you start giving straight reds to the "nice" guys in the game for a makeup call, you're losing control.

    The end result of the reds is all bad for the Revs. Mastro and Becks miss playing against the Fire, which is bad for us, and Kamler misses Columbus.

    I thought Leonard played pretty well, although he got himself trapped with the ball. He used his speed well when other players were tiring. We have to keep in mind that this kid has had very little playing time - he brought a lot of energy and hard work.

    I liked the way Nicol adjusted to the man down. Replacing Kamler (after a while) with Leonard, going to a 3-1/2 man defense with Joseph playing central defender/defensive mid.

    I also thought Joseph had an incredible game as a destroyer. He hustled all over, broke up plays, intercepted passes and started the Revs possession time after time - right up until the final whistle.

    The main thing the Revs did wrong, IMO, is they started forgetting to use Cancela in the 2nd half.
     
  5. The Magpie

    The Magpie Member

    Nov 19, 1998
    Cambridge, MA
    Pierce can wink at a player these days and be issued a card...

    .... and for the people who are taking Twellman to task: while he didn't have his best game and he uncharacteristically blew a p.k., he also played in his first match coming back from a dreadful injury where he's quite clearly not as match fit or mentally sharp as usual, proceeds to go out there without a protective mask, gets hit in the face at least a couple of times, reportedly can't breathe through his nose, goes on to play the full 100 minutes, was part of an offense that outshot the Rapids some 19 to 6, this without benefit of a capable back-up who was fully fit...

    He's put up the numbers to justify his reputation as a "franchise" player, and last night, while not finding the back of the net and clearly struggling, backed that up with one heullva gutsy performance.

    The Magpie
     
  6. gotyourback

    gotyourback Member

    Jul 18, 2002
    Aurora/Arlington
    Three key facts:

    1. Twellman
    2. Ralston
    3. Cancela


    All three were "off". Sorry Magpie, but if Cancela runs to open space (and there was plenty of it last night) and looks good doing it, it doesn't mean he's "impressing" at all. The fact is, he had numerous opportunities for quality services - and squandered them all (well, 90+%, anyway... but when there's that much open space and you're 'looked to' for playmaking...).

    Ralston was about as 'insignificant' as you'll ever see him... which is rare.

    Twellman was obviously off, and, quite frankly, should've been subbed off at 70. I saw him with his head down when he got over the PK, and immediately thought that Garlick had a solid chance of correctly reading the shot. PK-101... get over the ball with your head up at that moment and make the goal tender commit. If he doesn't commit either way, just make sure you put a little pace on the ball when you place it in a corner.

    Yes, most teams have a player on the field who 'steps up' and takes the initiative for PK's (usually a player who has more experience, or is the leading goalscorer), and it's no surprise that Taylor did just that. But at what point do you know you're having an "off" night? In this regard, I can't blame him. It was early. But, I don't think he should've disregarded Cancela for this particular, critical event - in the whole Revs season.

    IF THERE WAS EVER A MORE IMPORTANT SET PLAY TO BE EXECUTED DURING THIS WHOLE SEASON, I CAN'T THINK OF IT.

    Taylor should've thought twice when he shrugged off Cancela. That was not the time to be selfish.


    Plain fact is, that if these three players, or at least two of them - don't have good games, then the Revs are in trouble. However, how often do you think that will happen? I really believe that if all three play to their potential, or at least close to it, the Revs could get into the playoffs with critical momentum.

    And that fact, could bring them to the MLS Cup final, once again.
     
  7. Beast_Ed

    Beast_Ed Member

    Jul 15, 2003
    Boston MetroWest
    Agree with you GotYourBack ..

    our three main threats all had off nights ..

    I am really hoping the best for Noonan though .. he's a solid player.

    Beast Ed
     
  8. AvidSinger

    AvidSinger New Member

    Sep 6, 2002
    Massachusetts
    I think, though, that a lot of those could be chalked up to some very tenacious defense by Colorado.
     
  9. KevTheGooner

    KevTheGooner Help that poor man!

    Dec 10, 1999
    THOF
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Andorra
    If Brown was less than 100%, what was Twellman. 110%? I think not. Very suprised he wasn't subbed out. Don't get me wrong, he's a great player but your first game back after a long layoff should be about 70 minutes long, no more. The guy will take much longer to recover now because of all that running.

    And did anyone else watching The Deuce grimace to hear Rob Stone go wild over Garlick's save? Wyno did right in pointing out it was a poorly taken PK (looked like one I would take) and that Twellman didn't look confident stepping up to the spot. Even I thought he was going to miss it based on the look on his face- he looked scared as hell.
     
  10. AvidSinger

    AvidSinger New Member

    Sep 6, 2002
    Massachusetts
    There was also Carrieri elbowing Heaps in the face pretty much right in front of where I was sitting. It wasn't a hard elbow by any means, but the intent was absolutely there, so at least a yellow card should have come out.
     
  11. Rodan

    Rodan New Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Providence
    A bit surprised to see all the dour pronouncements about the Rev's performance.

    A little perspective: Colorado had gone 9 - 1 - 1 in their last 11 games. Colorado was never even remotely in this game - the Revs kicked their collective asses, dominating possesion and outshooting them 19 - 6.

    But the Revs didn't win. Well...

    The comments about Pepe, Twellman, and Ralston also seem strange to me. Pepe was doing great until mangled by Beckerman. Obviously the effects lingered, because he seemed to be less of a factor after that brutal foul. Twellman and Ralston worked their asses off. But give the Colo defense credit - they were very organized in their own box (where the Revs like to lurk) and limited the Revs to less-than-lethal chances. Garlick, BTW, is also a very good keep.

    Twellman missed a PK. In any league in the world the returning, league-leading scorer takes that kick - and his team backs off. That's the way it works. He missed. Now Twellman is 4 - 1 in PKs. Sucks, but...

    Officiating confusion, unfortunately, is just the status quo in MLS - the end result (despite frequent and capriciously awarded cards) being more physical play.

    Prus looked indecisive and snitty the whole game. Kamler's foul was exactly analogous to Califf's a few weeks ago. Clearly unintentional and he may not have even known the player was coming. But it gave an indecisive guy (Prus) a way to even things up. Not only did he not card Carrieri for his juvenile antics, he didn't even warn him verbally. The result - cards, mayhem, a circus.

    I don't know if these guys are just badly trained or utterly incompetent - but there simply has to be better out there (how about A-league refs?)
     
  12. Chicago1871

    Chicago1871 Member

    Apr 21, 2001
    Chicago
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Tough game. I still am in shock that you guys didn't rush the field and lynch Mr. Red right there after the Kamler call.
     
  13. rkane1226

    rkane1226 Member+

    Apr 9, 2000
    Club:
    Stade Brestois 29
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Add to that the fact that he was creating shots and they weren't going that far wide at all. I think he played pretty well. I agree that Noonan seemed to be much less a part of the offense but I can't say that was Twellman's fault.

    The only complaint about Twellman I agree with is that he shouldn't have taken the PK, particularly after being fouled.

    I wonder if Garelick deserves any credit for guessing the right way to dive?
     
  14. Ross

    Ross Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Straight outta Qtown
    My sentiments exactly.

    It was bad enough to have had that happen right in front of us. But then on SportsCenter this a.m. they included Garlick's fabulous save in their top ten moments for the week. Pa-leese. Makes you wish for a local broadcast.

    amy
     
  15. patfan1

    patfan1 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 19, 1999
    Nashua, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The first time I looked up after the penalty was called, Cancela had the ball. Twellman didn't shrug him off, he took the ball from his arms. Cancela didn't look so happy, and once Twellman missed, the look on Cancela's face was even more upset.
     
  16. pwykes

    pwykes Member

    Apr 18, 1999
    Auburn, MA
    I don't think anyone is accusing them of slacking off. If working hard was the most important thing, Wolde Harris would have been the team's MVP.

    I think Twellman was having an off game for him which is not surprising since he hadn't played for a month. In addition, the Rapids defense did a great job of shutting him down - especially in the air.

    Replacing him after 70 or so minutes would have mad sense and would have been a good tactical move.

    I also don't have a problem with his taking the penalty kick - I just wish it wasn't so lame. I haven't seen such a poor penalty kick since the last one Alvarez took.
     
  17. socdoc

    socdoc New Member

    Mar 30, 2002
    CapeCod MA
    Lime Chicken's comments about Twellman are right on. The offense plays stupidly with him on the field. Although his personality encourages it, it is his teammates who perpetrate it, and Nicol's fault for not correcting it (or perhaps advising it).
    The Rev's offense is reduced to two options. Either a defender kicks a long ball to Twellman, or the central midfield plays a ball wide for the outside midfielders to bang into the box. Sometimes a goal results, most of the time possession is lost.
    For example, I counted turnovers by the Revs against Colorado. They lost or gave the ball away 96 times by my count. This did not include shots or QUALITY passes into the box (i.e., balls that came close to a player in position to shoot, even if no shot resulted). Some interesting trends are evident.

    25 times the ball was lost because of poor quality balls to Twellman (not counting ineffectual crosses). Twellman gave it away himself another 10 times.

    Heaps and Franchino each gave it away 10 times, mostly with inaccurrate long balls forward (many included above to Twellman). Ralston, Kamler, Lamossa also lofted 3-4 prayers to Twellman each. Lamossa lost it 7 times but 2 were dangerous mishits to a rapid player. Pierce lost it 5 times.

    Ralston had 11 ineffective crosses (out of his total of 17 turnovers) and Kamler had 6 poor quality passes into the box (out of 9 total turnovers), Leonard added another three or four.

    Noonan hardly ever made a bad pass, only 3 total, but was dispossessed 6 times in the dribble, most late in the match.

    Joseph lost the ball only 4 times, and two of these were cross attempts (poor quality)

    Cancela gave the ball away only once in the first half. He ended up with 12 turnovers. 4 were either poor corners or blocked crosses, the others were late in the game when tired target players often didn't get to the ball, or when he tried something desperate. Cancela handled the ball far more than anyone else and his passing accurracy was impressive......though he clearly plays the simple pass in preference to a lower precentage attacking ball......leaving the latter to defenders and outside midfielders.

    Conclusions.......Franchino, Heaps, and Lamossa should be told to stop attempting speculative long balls more than one or two times a game. Noonan (or Fabbro) should be the primary target for entry passes with Twellman running off of them. Ralston is forcing too many balls into the box and needs to be more selective. Noonan shouldn't dribble outside of the box. Cancela should take more risks in the attacking third. Sounds alot like how they played when Twellman was injured doesn't it? If they can do it with Twellman we should be fine.
     
  18. NER_MCFC

    NER_MCFC Member

    May 23, 2001
    Cambridge, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Interesting analysis, but unless we're going to talk about Australia v American Samoa, doesn't that sentence apply to every single attack by every single team that's ever played the game? Goals are always rare in soccer. Even poor keepers generally save about 2/3 of the shots they see; nearly half of all shots aren't even on goal and another chunk of attacking forrays never even lead to a shot.

    It's useful to see where and how turnovers take place, but they are a fact of life, and I would be shocked if any reasonably even game didn't produce tons of them for both sides.

    I suppose you could step back a bit and argue that they shouldn't have played so much to Twellman because he didn't look particularly sharp, but you seem to be implying that playing Twellman and using him the way they do is costing them goals in general. I just don't see that.
     
  19. Jim Dow

    Jim Dow New Member

    Mar 20, 1999
    Belmont, MA
    .... But I think those complaints miss the point. IMO, the first 30' featured some of the most creative development ever put on display by the Revs. SN has been bashed on this board for being "too English", but the Revs close control was, at times, really pretty, and was more than the Raps could handle. And has there been a better defensive effort by the team all season? Has Heaps played a better game in a Rev uniform ever? I really felt that until Prus allowed the game to deteriorate, the Revs were reaching for a higher plane of soccer consciousness......
    JOHN MARTIN

    I heartily agree. The passing of the Revs before Cancela got chopped was as good as I have ever seen by this team. Yes, they overfed Twellman BUT had he been the 1/2 step quicker that his 100% self can do he would have had three, if not four goals.

    More important, Colorado is a much faster team than the Revs, man for man. What that meant was that no Revs front player could beat their Colo. opposite number around the back. How many blocked crosses did we see last night? At the other end, both the backs and the wingers had to labor to make sure that Rapids players didn't go around them. What this meant was that all the Revs outside players had to watch their backs and not overcommitt territorially. It was smart, no Rapids goals, but frustrating in that it made players like Ralston, Kamler, Franchino and Heaps appear tentative.

    Twellman certainly should not have taken the penalty but where is the line between confidence and selfishness? Hopefully now he knows better. Cancela is a veteran pro, Taylor a young guy who has many lessons to learn.

    Overall this was an abosolutely fascinating game that was BOTH beautifully and horribly played (and officiated). Sure, we lost two points but we also played great defense and offense that might have scored three or more goals. Such things happen.

    I can say one thing for certain, this is the most skillful Revs team ever and, if everyone stays around, can develop into one of the most entertaining teams in the league.

    JIM DOW
     
  20. gotyourback

    gotyourback Member

    Jul 18, 2002
    Aurora/Arlington
    Even SN had an off night. Not subbing TnT at 70 and bringing in Leonard - were mistakes that many noticed. He has, and can, and will, do better.
     
  21. rkupp

    rkupp Member+

    Jan 3, 2001
    This is crap. Take the same survey of any MLS game and you'll come up with similiar numbers. It's a game of mistakes - a team works and works for 90 minutes, and if they're good AND lucky, they succeed 2 or 3 times.

    They outshot Colorado 19 to 6, and outshot them on goal 5 to 3. That's a huge margin and many of the shots were very close - there were a couple that whistled past the post with Garlick clearly beaten. Another off the crossbar and a couple of chips that skimmed the top of the crossbar.

    The one thing you are right about is that the backs hit too many long balls. Part is just bad habits, but a lot of it is their inability to handle the ball under pressure, so they boot it up.

    So who do you replace Twellman with - "Ronaldo" Brown? Fabbro? Twellman was dangerous right to the end. Hankinson would have been immensely grateful if the Revs had been stupid enough to take off the league's leading scorer.

    Bringing Leonard in for Llamosa was a great move in my opinion. He brought speed and energy into the game. He allowed the Revs to continue playing offense by using Joseph as a centerback/dmid. The alternative that they used for a while was to bring Noonan back to midfield, but that was stunting their offense. They took a gamble by reducing their defense, but they got away with that and were able to keep more players forward. What more (or who) did you want? Leonard's a young player, he makes mistakes, but he did a lot of good things too.
     
  22. ProfZodiac

    ProfZodiac Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jan 17, 2003
    Boston, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I would've picked TnT to take the PK. I would've been worried about Cancela pulling another stunt like he did on Hartman, and Garlick knows not to fall for it.

    If not, Noonan would've buried it.
     
  23. TTweLLMan

    TTweLLMan New Member

    Jun 3, 2002
    Middleboro MA
    Ugh. Taylor bud, what are you doing to yourself? :(


    TTweLLMan
     
  24. socdoc

    socdoc New Member

    Mar 30, 2002
    CapeCod MA
    NER MCFC: No one is suggesting Twellman shouldn't be in there.....for Christ's sake he's the best finisher in the league. The point is that the team would work better if they depended on him less and used more thought, patience, and movement in attack. Twellman would see less of the ball but receive it in better position to shoot and suffer much less needless punishment. The offensive production without Twellman shows they can do it. The same type of play with Twellman should be even more successful.

    rkupp: Thanks for your insight on turnovers in soccer. Do you really believe successful teams (even in the MLS) give the ball away 100 times a game? Are you a high school coach by chance? Remember, the defense has to win each of those giveaways back. That's asking alot......is it not?
     
  25. soccertim

    soccertim Member

    Mar 29, 2001
    Mass
    Obviously, since we had more quality chances than Colorado, it's likely that they turned the ball over at least 100 times. I heard that they were 9-1-1 in their last 11 games. That's got to be one of the hottest stretches in the history of the league. Try watching an EPL game sometime. I'm sure you'll find a similar amount of turnovers if not more, many of which come from long balls from the back or bad crosses.

    There were some interesting parts to the analysis, though. Joseph, for the last two games, really seems to have improved his quick (1 or 2 touch) passing in tight space. Noonan is a terrific passer. As I've been saying all year long, Rusty's distribution isn't any worse than the other defenders. Kamler, as long as he's been on the Revs, hasn't been a good crosser. Ralston, for some reason, seems to have tired legs or something. He looks a little frustrated with his mishits.

    The thing is, as nice as not turning the ball over is, you have to factor in risk/reward into your analysis. The defense can lose 10 long passes and survive. If, instead, they try shorter passes each instead, and connect on 9 of them, that one giveaway in our end could hurt much more than the 10 in their end. The same applies on the other end. Noonan is very good at beating people off of the dribble. If he tries to break down the defense by beating people off of the dribble 8 times and loses it 6 times, it doesn't kill us losing the ball down there and he could be creating goal scoring opportunities the other two times, which could greatly affect the outcome of the game. You could say similar things about Ralston, who could do a better job of maintaining posession if he never crossed balls into the box. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

    As for all of the Twellman bashing (or near-bashing), don't you think that his first game in almost a month is a little soon for all of these complaints? He had an off game, but was still dangerous. He's the best finisher in the league, and should absolutely be taking our pks. And, after all of his late game heriocs this year, I wouldn't have subbed him out either. I'll be very surprised to hear similar complaints after another game or so.

    Other random thoughts:

    Leonard looks like a keeper. He plays pretty solid, with few mistakes, and covers a lot of ground.

    Jay Heaps probably played his best game of the year. With Rusty next to him instead of Douda, though, his mistakes are less glaring.

    The defense is finally hitting it's stride. In our last 3 home games, against the 3 best teams in the league, we've gotten 5 points and outscored them 6-2. If we keep it up, we should be ok.

    If this team hits it's stride and makes the playoffs, a lot of credit needs to go to SN for remaining confident and keeping the team together during the winless streak, and for not giving up on what works when we have the right personnel (no injuries or call-ups). I thought that subbing in Cullen to the Metros game was a statement from him that, instead of pressing forward to up our lead and getting killed on counters, we were going to put some faith in our much maligned defense, and thoses guys are responding well.
     

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