News: Revs, Revere "in final stages" of talks on Wonderland Stadium

Weren't they looking to put a hotel and parking garage in that space?

 

I'm definitely nitpicking here, but that stadium looks too big. A 20,000 seat stadium on that parcel would take up less room, no?

 

This is what I meant. The footprint of Red Bull Arena looks like this. Again, just nitpicking

 

Stop it! Stop it right now. I can't take it. Plus I know that that space is already slated for the convention center expansion.

 

The BCEC is slated for expansion, in particular, to accommodate new exhibition/multipurpose space. While the site currently serves as a parking lot and the MCCA owns the land, the build-out of the convention center was done with anticipation of using this space for expansion. To that end, components of expansion have recently been approved by Gov. Patrick, in particular, two new mid-priced hotels and parking garages along D Street. The thing is, the MCCA doesn't have the $$$$ resources to foot the build for total expansion, the primary component of which being the new space at the south end of the current BCEC. In short, the land is there, the infrastructure is there, but the financial resources aren't to add the new space... perhaps space like this:



Too bad nobody has upwards of $150 million available to finance something like this, not including additional millions for naming rights as well. Nope... can't be done... no precedent...

 

Oh look what you've done!!

How do I clean vomit from my keyboard?

 

If this were the case, then why hasn't it moved forward by now? And, if this does come true, the stadium would have to be a either a full dome or retractable roof. Lots of logistical considerations there in satisfying a grass field and weatherproof convention hall space criteria.

 

Because, sadly, that land has way more value for other buildout purposes than a stadium. And the convention center will be expanded, at some point, along with hotels and mixed use development.

 

There is zero chance of this happening. NO CHANCE.

The Krafts are dithering with the likes of Revere and Somerville because, as Thomas Grillo of The Boston Business Journal reports, "they're looking for a substantial amount of money from... whatever city they land in", but we're supposed to believe that Bob and Jonathan are going to foot-the-bill for a facility featuring a dome or retractable roof - a feature that will add significantly to the price of the project, as will tying it into the existing convention center facilities - in order to accommodate the convention center expansion that the MCCA has planned for that site?

Dream on.

 

Expansion of the BCEC is moving forward and since the process is phased components can be constructed independent of one another. As the rendering shows it would be a retractable roof and yes, the tradeoff would likely be the need for an artificial surface.

Like a multipurpose space that suits the needs of the BCEC and the New England Revolution? The convention center will be expanded and multiple buildout scenarios have already been presented to the governor. The BCEC needs more space for exhibitions and conventions... but whose to say how that space could be configured and or integrated?

"They're looking for a substantial amount of money from... whatever city they land in.." Thing is, this would be money for a.) the land and b.), infrastructure improvements. With respect to the BCEC site they (really the MCCA) own the land and the infrastructure improvements are both minimal and already budgeted into future BCEC expansion. As for Somerville and Revere? The idea is that these would be places where there would have available land that likely wouldn't be too expensive, on public transportation and with local political support. The space at the BCEC is paid for, is in Boston proper, with political support at both state and local levels; it also has the endorsement of a number of higher ranking/profile business figures. As for tying it to the existing convention center facilities...

Ding, ding, ding... somebody get Mike the prize.

Well, unless I'm mistaken the residents of South Boston probably already know about the BCEC expansion plans... in fact, they've been involved in their development. In addition, unlike the generation ago where Big Kraft planned to put a 70,000 seat monstrosity in their back yard... at a time prior to the construction (and relative success) of the BCEC... there is considerable political support from both the State and City of Boston.

In short: A public/private partnership where Kraft foots most of the bill for construction of the stadium/arena (one that would feature a retractable roof), one that is multipurpose so it fits the needs of the BCEC, and like the Gelredome in the Netherlands, can support a higher number of events that will provide a greater return on the investment, not to mention the added revenue it could provide to area businesses and establishments.

 

I recall you mentioning earlier a potential third site for a SSS and that you would be writing a piece about it for TDIF. Is this the site you were talking about?

Also, is this concept your own or is there some reasoning behind it? And where did those renderings come from?

 

Evan, are you merely hypothesizing or is this more informed speculation based on some scuttlebutt you've heard?

 

Renderings are courtesy of the MCCA that I have modified and yes, this is the third site I was referring to and will hopefully be the basis of an article for TDIF. That being said this is an original concept of mine, one that I first wrote about and suggested way back in 2005 and this is based on no scuttlebutt or information. If anything I'd like to get this information in front of the right people to see if it's something they might not have considered.

 

Exactly which "higher ranking/profile business figures" have endorsed building-out the planned convention center expansion as part of a retractable-roofed stadium development?

Except that Mike's comment doesn't address what I was driving at. Namely, that in either Somerville or Revere the Krafts are "looking for a substantial amount of money from" the municipalities in question, most likely in the form of land and/or infrastructure improvements, while the team picks-up the cost of stadium construction. At the BCEC site, while the MCCA already owns the land and infrastructure improvements are already budgeted for as part of future convention center expansion, the Krafts' costs for stadium construction are going to increase significantly given the fact that the facility will now have to be constructed with a dome or retractable roof, as well as built so as to link to the existing convention center facilities.

Yes... residents of the South Boston neighborhood are aware of the MCCA's desire to expand a convention center, a facility that largely operates during daytime hours Monday through Friday. By adding a retractable-roofed stadium into the expansion plan, said residents are suddenly going to be asked to wrap their heads around a facility that will impact the neighborhood - via the Revolution's home MLS schedule, additional soccer matches, and any number of other sports and entertainment events - on far more nights and weekends than has been the case to date, or would be the case if the planned expansion consisted solely of conventional exhibition space.

"[C]onsiderable political support from both the State and City of Boston" for what? A retractable-roofed soccer-specific stadium? How, when, and where has this "considerable political support" for such a stadium been manifesting itself? I haven't heard word one about it. In point of fact, the political support you cite is for expansion of a convention center, which does not necessarily translate into support for construction of a soccer-specific stadium.

Why should the Krafts be expected to foot only "MOST of the bill for construction of the stadium/arena"? If they're benefitting from the MCCA's already owning land in Boston proper and infrastructure improvements that have already been approved, why shouldn't the Krafts be required to pony-up the entirety of the stadium construction tab?

Let me guess: because if the Krafts weren't building in conjunction with convention-center expansion they wouldn't have to build a roofed facility? Look... if Bob and Jonathan want to save the money they'd have to spend on a roof at a stadium adjacent to the convention center, they can either opt to partner with Revere or Somerville, or build on land they already own in Foxboro. Frankly, as a taxpayer, I'm of the mind that if the Krafts want to take advantage of building a stadium for the Revolution on a prime piece of real estate within the City of Boston, with infrastructure improvements already paid for by the MCCA, than they need to be prepared to go all-in on the stadium construction costs. They can make their money back by hammering-out a deal that gives them the lion's share - if not full control - of all of the revenues generated in the building during Revolution matches, as well as other sports and entertainment events that they book into the facility. The MCCA can collect all of the revenues generated in the building during convention/tradeshow events. As for monies collected as part of a naming rights deal, that could be hammered out between the Krafts and the MCCA.

All of this said, I agree with Mike Marshall: the Krafts will build a soccer-specific home for the Revolution in South Boston when members of the Suidae family of even-toed ungulates take flight.

 

So, in other words, it is simply a case of a supporter "spit-balling" an idea. Ah... I understand now.

For what it is worth, I certainly love your vision of the Revolution's stadium future. That said, I'm not holding my breath that such an eventuality will come to pass.

 

Probability -- .00089% (along with most of this SSS measure measure 'talk')



Probability -- 99.0089%

 

If I simply wanted to "spit ball" an idea I might as well have suggested they build the stadium on Boston Common. This isn't some half-baked flight of fancy I'm suggesting and I wouldn't offer it up unless I felt there was a reasonable chance of it working. I mean, you can either believe that or believe that the Krafts really are in the "final stages" of talks on a stadium with Revere and Somerville (sorry Fall River), especially when the phone lines are only being burned up from one end.

 

Really creative idea. And drool-worthy rendering. It's kind of funny that this location, far closer to the city proper than Wonderland or Assembly, has arguably the least attractive public transportation options. That said I'd still like it better than the others.

 

It's only a 10 minute walk from Broadway station.

 

Spit-balling is precisely what you're engaging in. You're brainstorming... kicking around an idea that, by your own admission, you first hatched in 2005. Your hope is that you can "get this information in front of" someone in a position of authority who "might not have considered" it before now.

However, given the fact that the notion of the Revolution setting-up shop in a Greater Boston-based soccer-specific stadium has been bandied about since at least 2006 when Mayor Menino touted the idea in the wake of that year's FIFA World Cup, as well as the fact that expansion of the BCEC has been proposed since at least November of 2010, the odds are that someone in a position of authority within the Revolution organization, the MCCA, and/or state and local government has already - within the past couple of years - considered the idea of a public/private partnership akin to the very one you've outlined here.

So, why hasn't talk of such a proposal reared its head in the news the way the Brickbottom, Wonderland and Assembly Square proposals have? More than likely because any of the myriad reasons brought up in this thread by Minutemanii, Weber King, Mike Marshall, or myself succeeded in derailing such a proposal before it had a chance to reach fruition.

Again, while I love your vision, a soccer-specific stadium for the Revolution adjacent to the BCEC is a pipe-dream.

 

I had an idea once in 1995. I hoped and wished it was anyone but Bob Kraft that would invest in MLS/Revs...I told as many people as I could. Never worked out..! LOL

 

that doesn't look like baltimore