Yea, I agree with that. I do not see any Referee from the UK - not just England! - being appointed to an Argentina game any time soon as it is still an issue for them. Not for the Brits. At the risk of stating the obvious, the UK has had more conflicts with Germany over the years (anyone remember two World Wars?) but no one in Britain has ever objected to having a German Referee.
Brych did have a very clean match yesterday, no yellow cards or other controversy. But even I am surprised at this appointment of three playoff matches in a row, when there are other well qualified people available. Now my cynicism is increased, unfortunately. If Cakir has been released and is no longer a factor, it looks like Ceferin has a lot more influence than is imagined. As I have said, with much pushback, assignments at this level are not solely dependent on performance. However I will say that take no pleasure in this at all, and agree that although a fact, it is saddening. BTW, I understand that Italy in general don't want Dutch referees on their games for some reason. If they win on Tuesday, we will see if that is true! PH
Good point! Elizondo also refereed Man Utd's game against Necaxa at the Club World Cup in 2000, where he sent off Beckham. On another note, Brych referees two consecutive games in the tournament (with no other tournament game in between). Quite likely that he is also the first in that regard.
Not sure about this... Kuipers did England - Italy at WC 2014, and Makkelie did Italy - Turkey in the opening match of this Euro.
The fact that Brych has back to back matches in such fashion, with so much travel… and the QF seems almost completely unnecessary, does suggest that there was some sort of change or contingency plan here. We will never know but it stretches imagination that this was a plan. Either someone else was rejected as a semi option or Brych was some sort of last second fill-in for another plan on the QF. And yes, Ceferin’s influence, which I always thought was important, has seemed decisive from what I’ve heard. The fact that you’re already reading about things in Turkish media suggests Cakir and his team are not happy and, well, don’t care anymore. I believe there are five trios in London. The assignments make themselves at this point, unfortunately. And they’ve pretty much already been reported (though there is some confusion amongst some on who the “fifth” trio is, but it doesn’t matter because that referee is only going to be a fourth). I genuinely can’t believe how assignments have shaken out. For a tournament where the officiating has been SO good, to rely on the one guy who had an objectively poor match in record fashion… it was so unnecessary. I could understand if Brych was trusted because everyone else had been poor. But that’s not what happened. He was trusted despite most everyone else being excellent.
Hey guys remember the Instagram post that had Brych going home to Germany after the round of 16? Yeah those are fun.
Run this one through Google translate. Apparently Cakir was invited to London and THEN was dismissed! https://www.cumhuriyet.com.tr/haber/cuneyt-cakirin-euro-2020-macerasi-sona-erdi-1849698
Slovenia v Austria qualifier, allegedly. http://law5-theref.blogspot.com/2019/12/ceferin-cakr-and-subjugation-of_6.html
Is it possible that he was appointed only as a 4th to one of the three matches and basically said, "forget this, I'm not interested in being a 4th, I'm outta here."
The Brits have their influence on the officiating through their quantitative weight in the IFAB - this is the frontdoor rather than the backdoor appointments and dealing. Unpopular take but it's the truth. Goal-line technology only became a real thing once they were on the wrong side a few times. They have always been a very hierarchical and militaristic country, and have taken an Orbanesque/Trumpesque and kleptocratic turn the last decade as well (professional sports not excluded). The notoriously strict libel laws and freely handing out of gagging orders help to protect the status quo and keep the beans inside. They do still veto (assistant-)referees - most other countries and the smaller countries are not in this position. As we read above, Argentina is, Italy is and England too. (Indeed, Italy once replaced the already publicly appointed John Blankenstein for the 1994CL final) Because England has actually a very strong record under German referees, above their overall record, in part because of similar interpretations to physical play and 'cheating' (cf. Italy, Uruguay). Unlike Netherlands for instance, which sees statistically their all-time worst record when officiated by them. So of course the England FA doesn't veto the appointments and clap in their hands when Kane wins a free kick for the 2-0. -------- Don't worry, this is the very last post I will make in this forum section.
It's a stretch too, and I doubt it as well. I don't think we'll ever know the full story, but how legit is that Cakir was invited/flown out too London and UEFA said "sorry our mistake, you gotta go home." That doesn't make much sense either. That's the one I have doubts about. Unless the referee committee signed off on Cakir and Cefrin never got around to approving the assignments and said "hold on why is Cakir in London? I never approved of this." The UEFA referee committee then said "sir it was sitting on your desk for a week." Brych getting a third knockout match isn't that shocking to me. Plan C behind Kuipers and Cakir for the Final was Brych for me. It's just giving him the semi-final that is. I'm actually more surprised by the Makkelie appointment. Two Dutch referees for the last three matches? That would never fly in a World Cup or any other confederation tournament. In hindsight, sending Mateu Lahoz home looks really stupid now. Lahoz could have done England vs. Ukraine. Brych on Spain vs. Italy, Makkelie on Denmark vs. England and Kuipers on the Final would be some what more palatable then this.
Honestly I haven't paid as much attention to the UEFA assignments throughout the past few seasons. I didn't realize the president of UEFA had such say in referee assignments.
He didn't in the past at least from paying attention to the assignments. When the President of UEFA was Swedish for 17 years, Anders Frisk never did a CL or UEFA Cup Final. Although, I think he was going to the CL Final in 2005 or 2006 if it wasn't for his abrupt retirement caused by Mourinho. Other than a Euro 2012 semifinal no French referee did any match of any significance during Platini reign. Now Platini did say in the Euro 2008 referee documentary that he "never gets involved in the referees (i.e the appointments/assignments of matches), he gets involved in the refereeing (how the games are officiated and points of emphasis, etc.) Basically, he trusts the referee committee to make the appropriate appointments. He will have a say in how he wants the games to be officiated. Now, take those comments for they are worth. He did have a camera on him when he was saying that. It seems like Cefrin does get involved in the assignments. So it must vary from president to president. From what I've heard, Sepp Blatter would want to see the assignments for the knockout matches of every world cup on his desk before they were released.
This sounds right. For the 1994 WC Final, Blatter apparently wanted to know who had issued the fewest cards and said that that person should referee the Final. It was Puhl of Hungary. Not sure if this overruled the committee selection as a very influential member was the legendary Hungarian Karoly Palotai, who had refereed at 3 World Cups, 2 Olympics, the EUROs 1980, and the trifecta of 2 European Cup Finals, a Cup-winners Cup Final, and a UEFA Cup Final. Not to mention having won a Gold Medal playing for Hungary in the 1964 Olympics! But he himself never got a WC Final. PH
Blatter was actually a huge cheerleader of the other candidate, Peter Mikkelsen (RIP), and was very disappointed to learn that the Dane had lost out in the final reckoning. That story is an urban myth. The committee (Casarin, Ponnet and Palotai) had actually agreed on Mikkelsen, but Havelange used his contacts in South America and Asia in order to force Puhl's name through - to spite his old Italian enemy, Matarrese. Puhl and Mikkelsen shared dinner on the Friday night that the appointment was announced, a nice small story (especially as neither are with us anymore ). You can read more about WC 1994 here!
Oh and while I'm at it about old WCs - EURO 2020's Felix Brych was the referee liaison officer for games in Munich at WC 2006. At the start of the video below you can see him ready to take a photo of Horacio Elizondo's trio before the opening game (look at that camera(!); a different age ). https://ok.ru/video/1606064736803
Thank you. I had heard the tale from people actually at the tournament so it seemed credible to me. However it still doesn't explain why it was Puhl who was selected, and why Mikkelsen was not acceptable. But nevertheless, it does show that the selection of the committee was interfered with and overturned by executives, which was the concept under discussion. As well as the ongoing (multi year, predating your own BigSoccer joining date) discussion regarding the behind the scenes decisions that influence referee selections in prestigious tournaments and the top matches. PH
I think, in fairness, we all know that selection of Referees either pre or during tournaments is susceptible to "outside interference". It's human nature that "pressure" can, and is, applied by individuals and groups to suit their own ends in all walks of life, and officiating at Football matches is no different. That has been true for as long as I have been involved in the game and will likely always be an issue - as long ago as 1974 Jack Taylor, the English WC Final Referee said in his autobiography that the appointment for the Final had been announced to the remaining Referees prior to them leaving their base in Frankfurt, only for him to be summoned on the train to Munich to be told that the RefCom had met on the train to address a complaint by the Dutch and a change had been made, and he was now to be the Referee. So, it's been an issue, is an issue and will always be an issue. We can only hope that it will be managed as effectively as it can be, and that, overall, performance matters more than political/personal influence. Unfortunately, despite a generally high level of performance by the officials at Euro2020, we have still had decisions made that aren't always supportable by performances, and that is disappointing.
England - Denmark: MAKKELIE (NED) [4O: Hategan (ROU), VAR: van Boekel (NED), AVARs: Blom (NED), Gittelmann (GER), Gil (POL)] Makkelie back at Wembley big time.