So, now that Spain has crashed out, let's try to figure out why.... My thoughts: #1) Age/failure to integrate new players into the team...for example, only two players from the 2009 U-20 team (Jordi Alba and Cesar Azpilicueta) even made the WC 2014 roster at age 24. The combo of Puyol/Pique/Ramos have held down the central defense places for so long that nobody else has been able to gain experience and develop. Same thing in midfield with Xavi/Iniesta/Xabi Alonso. #2) The dominance of Real Madrid and Barcelona in the domestic league has hindered player development, since they buy up the best young players, who then get stuck behind the established superstars. Loans have dealt with this problem somewhat, but not really. #3) The presence of Messi and Ronaldo masks the fact that the Spanish style of attacking play isn't really all that effective without a top-class striker to finish chances. Note that Spain only scored 8 goals in 7 matches at WC 2010, and won four consecutive 1-0 matches in the knockout rounds. #4) Complacency/arrogance. Maybe the players started to believe their own press clippings and forgot that they had a fair amount of luck go their way in winning their three major titles. Spain won knockout round matches on PK's at both Euro 2008 and Euro 2012, and benefited from Thomas Muller's suspension in the WC 2010 semifinal against Germany, among other things.
I said it in 2010. Spain only fielded one pure scorer in South Africa. I was thinking of the Moneyball concept. Soccer isn't baseball where statistics are very important, but having one pure scorer on the field won't translate into a lot of goals. David Villa scored most of the goals and at least two of them were individual goals. This year, Spain again fielded players with low scoring numbers. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moneyball
Spain does not have Messi and a huge part of Barcelona success was because of Messi. They liked to say that Messi was actually good cause he had those spanish player surrounding him, but it was actually the other way around.
I would had believed that if Messi had done better the past 2 seasons with Barca. Their system had been thoroughly studied and people had figured out how to beat it. It's not just about the individuals.
I think a lot of it is just down to players aging or being out of form. For tiki-taka to really work you need people who are not only precise in their passing but also fast in doing so and everyone running for everyone else. Being just half a second or second slower like you used to be is huge in todays fast paced game. Getting slower is certainly true for Xavi and Xabi even Iniesta (could be just form with him though), also Villa, Pujol being gone Pique not doing so well, Casillas being on his way out as well. This are just players that you can't replace quality wise from one moment to another. Can't really blame del Bosque from trying to stick with his guns that worked so well for him. He brought in Costa who in my opinion just isn't a very good fit for Spains style of play in the last years. This team just needs to be rebuilt, the old guard had one last try, didn't work out. That being said Spain has more than enough young talent to field a very strong team in the next Euros given the right changes are made during the next 2 years, even if you can't replace a Xavi in his prime completely.
Exactly. That is why Spain was getting spanked in friendlies. You need almost perfect everything for tiki taka to work. Players with good stamina and good thinking plus exceptional technique to match the stamina. The Holland game was full of individual mistakes so I can't see why people are saying the system has been found out. That is why tiki taka is so good vs most of the teams. Even if those teams gave it their best they still lost If Spain played their best and Holland still won I would be there up with people but no it was full on individual mistakes. Chile is a direct result of the Holland game. I can't imagine the same outcome if Chile's first game was a 5-1 loss vs Holland
maybe the retirement of carpos puyol....... barca at their prime and spain....had him from 2008 to2012........ramos and pique mainly supported him .....in both these teams ......now....barca and pep[coaching bayern} and spain are doing the same things......but not having a super safe stopper is hurting them....last world cup....spain had won 4 knockout matches 1-0....puyol was the main leader in defence
Spains defeat against Netherlands had nothing to do with the outcome between Spain and Chile, as we had a game plan against Spain prepared long time ago and we simply put it in practice. Our last friendly in Switzerland (September 2013), against Spain, 2 times through that match we scored taking the lead and it was Spain whom suffered to equalize the score, being the last of Spain's goals in the overtime. That match should've put Spain in alert, that their style of playing was not going to serve them any good against us and that they needed to change, but Spain's arrogance failed them, as in this WC Spain played almost exactly the same way, while we did adjustments to our play with almost all of the same players we used in that friendly match, in order to avoid Spain from scoring as they did back then, and the result of it all is right there for everyone to see. Last time Vargas scored both of our goals, and now he repeated himself once. As Sampaoli for Chile was smarter, VdB fckd-up for Spain in this one.
I think the two main reasons why Spain were knocked out are some that people ignore almost entirely: 1) Coincidences: Football is a game of narrow margins, luck and coincidences. Spain played well in the first half against the Netherlands, and Silva should have scored 2-0; had that happened, the rest of the game would likely be entirely different and everyone whould have said that Spain are on track. (They also blew a few big chances against Chile.) 2) Extremely good opposition: Netherlands and Chile are capable of beating anyone. Netherlands were great in the second half. Chile played maybe the most impressive defensive game in history of football; their intensity and aggression off the ball throughout the entire match is something we have never before seen. They had 2-4 players closing down the Spanish player on the ball every time, all game long. Chile's defending looked like Edgar Davids was playing in all positions... Of course, people are not wrong when they point at the poor implementation of younger players over the last years, or all the great Spanish players that didn't make the squad but perhaps should have, or that Spain made some tactical errors, or that they were not true to their tiki-taka style and attempted something halfhearted that didn't look very Spanish at all and certainly not even close to tiki-taka.
This, as almost always, is the biggest factor. Spain didn't play well in either of those games, but the biggest factor is ultimately luck or failure to take their chances. Easy to look for big reasons for their failure, but ultimately this is an extremely good group of players who simply lost two games. There aren't necessarily a series of causes to point to.
IMO, they can't replace Xavi and Iniesta. They are a key part of Tiki-taka. I think that what ever happens in the future this golden generation of Spain already secured a place in the game history. Tiki-taka came when the game was turning into defense above everything else and I do believe that we are seeing a goal fest in Brasil because Spain showed that you can win with an offence minded team. The 2008-2011 (not sure about the dates) Spain is a fantastic team on pair IMO with Brazil 1970.
1. agree. This also goes both ways. Imagine Paraguay's goal in 2010 not called back for dubious offside or Paraguay making that first PK. 2. agree. 2 good team right off the bat for Spain. Blazing speed for Hollands counters and a Chile that attacked like Chile, but also defended like Paraguay. I would add one more issue with Spain. Their style of play is not very effective if they have to come from behind. That first goal is vital if they are playing a quality team. Just off the top of my head the have lost 4-0 to Port, 4-1 to Arg, 3-0 to Bra, 2-0 to Chile when giving up the first goal. And once Holland got a lead, the same thing happened. All this within the last 4 years. They barely got out of Mexico and Costa Rica with ties after giving up the first goal. Also given the realistic need to win the game with Chile based on the earlier results, the were in essence already trying to come from behind right at kick-off.
It's pretty clear that what happened agaisnt Brazil in the Confed was a sign of things to come. Spain was nowhere near as athletic as Holland or Chile and they sorely missed Puyol's leadership at the back. To me the bigger issue was not assimilating younger talent earlier and failing to eliminate sentiment from the personnel decisions. How Fernando Torres made the squad is beyond me. Casillas was one of the worst goalies at the tournament and was nowher near the form of De Gea. Xavi's form fell off a cliff over the last two years. Xabi Alonso is heading off that same cliff. Frankly that should be the last hurrah for most of those Spanish players.
I think Del Bosque will regret not calling Negredo, Soldado, or Llorente instead of Torres and Diego Costa. Luckily they have a lot of interesting players that can replace veterans: Morata, Izco, Muniain, Thiago Alcantara, Callejon...
I find it interesting how people go at length to defend Tiki Taka. Teams that play that football style religiously have started to lose badly (Spain, Barca, Bayern). Sure a good team will always beat a bad team tiki-taka notwithstanding, but Bayern and Barca had the best players on the field when they lost. Seriously, one on one, that Spanish team is more talented than Holland and Chile.
You don't need athletism to play tiki-taka. Spain manhandled Germany in 2010, and even scored on a corner kick