Quick little anecdote tells you all you need to know about immigrants

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by superdave, Mar 10, 2003.

  1. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    Raleigh NC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We're all familiar with the Jesica Santillan story, right? Her family pays to have her smuggled into the US so she can get a life-saving transplant. First set of organs are wrong blood type, she gets a 2nd set, and dies soon thereafter.

    Last week, the News & Observer ran an article about the controversy of illegal immigrants getting transplants. There's a quote from a "woman on the street" who doesn't want her parts given to an illegal alien. And there's a quote from the leader of NC Listen, an anti-immigration group, saying, if he were on the waiting list, he'd question Jesica getting the heart and lungs.

    OK, so far, so good. About what you'd expect. Then about paragraph 12, the N&O writer does an immaculate stepover and leaves the anti-immigrant faction flailing at air.

    It so happens that in 2001, 2% of donors here were foreigners who died in the US. Only 1% of transplants went to foreigners.

    See, the foreigners ALREADY give more than they get. But for some people, that's just not enough.
     
  2. obie

    obie New Member

    Nov 18, 1998
    NY, NY
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    "I don't care how sick I is, I don't want no Mexican heart put into me!"
     
  3. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    Raleigh NC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Here's what I'm saying, Mike.
    2% is higher than 1%.
     
  4. Garcia

    Garcia Member

    Dec 14, 1999
    Castro Castro
    Ironic that the family did not donate her organs after she died.

    The system is a give and take, literally. Well, probably best to take then give...

    Now, on more medical reasons and not so much on racial issues, one guy was quoted as saying, 'She was given a chance at life. It is not a given, but a chance. This is why we need to strengthen our borders. The family should be happy.'

    This was on the news a while back. Like I said, his racist views are noted and dismissed as par for the course. His medical view is incorrect. While nothing is 100%, we all can assume that simple checks like blood type are not acceptable mistakes at this level of medical care. Duke is well known and must have a fabulous facility and record.

    Rule #1: Do no harm.

    The race bait is just that, bait. When it comes down to it, we take care of our own first. Nothing new here, especially in North Carolina. Am I correct in assuming this about the South? America? People in general?
     
  5. russ

    russ Member+

    Feb 26, 1999
    Canton,NY
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    The question then becomes, who is "our own"?

    In a sense,it's the main question ,isn't it?
     
  6. Smiley321

    Smiley321 Member

    Apr 21, 2002
    Concord, Ca
    Another example of how liberals intentionally misuse the language to dishonestly make a point.

    An immigrant is someone who has entered the country. There is nothing explicit about how they entered the country, but it is presumably a legal entry.

    An illegal alien is someone in the country illegally. They must be sent home as soon as they are discovered.
     
  7. Thomas A Fina

    Thomas A Fina Member

    Mar 29, 1999
    Hell
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No irony here. The organs were too damaged to use in any case
     
  8. Garcia

    Garcia Member

    Dec 14, 1999
    Castro Castro
    All of them?
     
  9. Danwoods

    Danwoods Member

    Mar 20, 2000
    Bertram, TX, US
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  10. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    Raleigh NC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Danwoods...then why did the Duke doctors ask for them? Do you know better than they?

    If the organs were ALL unusable, then why did the issue even come up???
     
  11. Ian McCracken

    Ian McCracken Member

    May 28, 1999
    USA
    Club:
    SS Lazio Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Stop trying to introduce reason into a superdave thread.
     
  12. BenReilly

    BenReilly New Member

    Apr 8, 2002
    It's perfectly understandable that her family wouldn't donate. After what they've been through, I'm amazed they didn't kill somebody.

    Nevertheless, I think organs should only be provided for those who agree to donate. At the very least, those that get a driver's license and refuse to donate should be barred. People die because of this selfishness. They'd think twice if it might cost their lives.
     
  13. DoyleG

    DoyleG Member+

    CanPL
    Canada
    Jan 11, 2002
    YEG-->YYJ-->YWG-->YYB
    Club:
    FC Edmonton
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    The reason they didn't donate the organs is that they wouldn't be in the condition to give to another person.

    People may not be willing to donate organs for certain reasons. They may want to only donate if their children need it. Religous convictions stop others from donating. Medical reasons also prevent donation.

    I have an organ donor card, but I belive you won't see mandatory organ donation at all in NA.

    Let's ask this question: Would you accept an organ donation from an illegal, even if saying no puts your life at risk?
     
  14. BenReilly

    BenReilly New Member

    Apr 8, 2002


    That makes no sense unless the entire story was a fabrication. It's the physician's call if the organs are useful. How could the parents possibly know?
    If the reasons are medical, that's a different story. But these religious folks don't seem reluctant to take an organ. If they're willing to die for their beliefs, fine. Up to this point, I can only say they're willing to kill for their beliefs. Not so good.
    I'd like to be able to restrict my organs to people willing to donate theirs. I consider it a trade. I'll give you my organs if I die only if you promise to give me yours. I have no desire to save someone's life that wasn't willing to do the same for me. Not when more worthy people are dying.
    I have no problems with setting up a mechanism for illegal immigrants to receive organs.
     
  15. chibchab

    chibchab Member

    Jul 8, 2002
    New Jersey
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    All you people getting worked up over the family not agreeing to donate Jessica's organs need to remember something.

    When the doctors asked the family if they'd be willing to donate the organs the family was still fighting to keep her alive. Never mind that doctors and media said, prior and post-mortem, that her organs were useless. They didn't want her disconnected from the machines until they had a second opinion about their daughters state.

    Do you blame them for distrusting Duke at that point? They had botched the transplant in the most basic way and then allegedly had witheld disclosing the error for many days.

    Duke refused to grant the family time to get the second opinion and without the families consent, which they legally did not need, disconnected her from life support.

    So remember that! If you were in the parent's shoes and you're not contemplating yet giving up hope for your child and a doctor comes in and says "Well, we're getting ready to disconnect her can we take her organs?" Would you still fight for hope that your daughter may live?

    Next, throw in the language barrier and you have a third party, be it an interpreter or representative also making decisions.

    People, you were not their in their shoes! You don't know exactly what transpired so fnck off!
     
  16. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    Raleigh NC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Please tell us what religion allows its practitioners to accept organ donations, but doesn't allow them to donate.

    I'd be interested to learn the ethical system of such a religion. :rolleyes:
     
  17. irishFS1921

    irishFS1921 New Member

    Aug 2, 2002
    WB05 Compound
    church of bill murray.
     
  18. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    Raleigh NC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    UNTRUE.
    I know that they were willing to take organs, but they weren't willing to give.

    Their response was NOT, "If you get a non-Duke doctor to confirm she's dead, then you can take her corneas." I could understand that. Not what they did. But then, I accept it as a truism that lots of nominal Christians abandon their religion when the going gets tough.

    Anyway, we're getting off topic. The main point is that there are people bitching about foreigners getting organ donations, when the US organ pool gets a net benefit from foreigners.
     
  19. chibchab

    chibchab Member

    Jul 8, 2002
    New Jersey
    Nat'l Team:
    United States


    True according to my sources. :*)
     
  20. quicksand

    quicksand Member

    May 7, 2000
    Brooklyn
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There actually is a group trying to make this happen. You can go to their website (which, unfortunately, I don't remember the address for) and learn more and make it known that you want your organs donated to someone who is a prospective organ donor first.
     
  21. Sneever Flion

    Sneever Flion New Member

    Oct 29, 2002
    Detroit, MI
    Interesting. I find the opposite to be true.
     

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