President Bush and the Supreme Court

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by argentine soccer fan, Nov 10, 2004.

  1. riverplate

    riverplate Member+

    Jan 1, 2003
    Corona, Queens
    Club:
    CA River Plate
    Don't over-estimate the "power" of the Chief Justice. It's not as if he lords over the rest of them or can bully the Associate Justices.

    Whether he would be "damaging" is in the eye of the beholder.


    Let's cut the crap right now about the death of Olson's wife. If he gets the nomination, it's NOT because anyone's milking his tragedy.
     
  2. IntheNet

    IntheNet New Member

    Nov 5, 2002
    Northern Virginia
    Club:
    Blackburn Rovers FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Justice Antonin Scalia will be nominated for Chief Justice
    Solicitator General Ted Olsen will be nominated for Justice
     
  3. Crimen y Castigo

    May 18, 2004
    OakTown
    Club:
    Los Angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    This is outrageous historical revisionism at it's worst.

    Ashcroft, Lott and DeLay raised blocking judges to one of the highest black arts forms. DeLay was calling for judges to be impeached. The "Judicial Selection Monitoring Project" launched a million dollar PR campaign about "judicial tyranny."

    In 1996, the Senate confirmed 17 judges -- the lowest election confirmation rate in 40 years. And then they blamed Clinton for the vacancies.

    And was Clinton nominating idealogues like Pickering and Priscilla Owen? Clinton's appointees had uniformly high ABA ratings.

    But hey: That's just the one member of reality-based community's opinion.

    In other news, Iraq is complete success and given the chance, we would do everything exactly the same way. I also heard Democrats are engaged in voter suppression and intimidation. Shame.

    And, after much deliberation, Black has apparently decided to become White.
     
  4. btousley

    btousley New Member

    Jul 12, 1999
    While I would personally like that .... and it would be darn enjoyable to hear of Scalia's oration ... I don't think there is a prayer in hell's chance he will become CJ. Entertainment factor would be through the roof with Scalia though.
     
  5. btousley

    btousley New Member

    Jul 12, 1999
    in an alternative world - Bork was approved by the Dems and the Senate - and Crimen y Castigo moved overseas.
     
  6. nicephoras

    nicephoras A very stable genius

    Fucklechester Rangers
    Jul 22, 2001
    Eastern Seaboard of Yo! Semite
    No, not really. Entertainment factor is higher for dissents. Scalia would need to build consensus for the Court - he'd have to tone it down.

    IntheNet - perhaps you could tell me more about this "Solicitator" General.

    Barb - Kozinski would likely get confirmed, but I don't think he'd want to do it.
     
  7. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    I hope this is not a backhanded attack on Justice Clarence Thomas. :D
     
  8. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Though I am not a lawyer -- (though I did think about going to law school for about, oh, 15 seconds) -- and I guess would lead toward more being a strict constructionist (as opposed to a "loose interpreter?"), I will say this.

    I have zero problem with the Democrats in the Senate "blocking" or otherwise delaying judicial appointments they find troubling. The senate's job is not to rubber stamp.

    However, I will say this. I think Democrats have much more at stake in this, given the conservative direction of the electorate. As the Democratic party becomes increasingly a minority party, the only redress they may ultimately have is the courts, since they won't be able to win the votes they need for their representatives, and thus won't be able to control the legislative agenda, in ways they would like.

    That's why I take Bush at his word that (a) he doesn't have a litmus test and (b) he wants strict constructionists. Because that will mean, going forward particularly (I think abortion cat is out of the bag, and won't be put back in), the courts will not engage in legislative functions; Republican controlled legislatures will.

    For Dems, it's once again, lose, lose.
     
  9. nicephoras

    nicephoras A very stable genius

    Fucklechester Rangers
    Jul 22, 2001
    Eastern Seaboard of Yo! Semite
    No, it is on former KKK member Hugo Black. ;)
     
  10. nicephoras

    nicephoras A very stable genius

    Fucklechester Rangers
    Jul 22, 2001
    Eastern Seaboard of Yo! Semite
    For someone who's admittedly ignorant of the ideological rifts in legal theory, you sure aren't shy about subscribing to one.

    Oooh, now I get to try.
    I may not know much about this here black hole stuff, but I don't think I agree with Hawking (as opposed to a "anti-Hawking)?
     
  11. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    I thought I remembered some comments about it from when he was confirmed for his current position as Solicitor General, but I wasn't sure, so I went to look it up. Here is what I found, for what is worth:


    http://archives.cnn.com/2001/ALLPOLITICS/05/24/senate.olson/

    Many linked Olson to the so-called Arkansas Project to discredit President Clinton, and some observers predicted with the Democrats coming to power in the Senate, Olson's nomination would die a quick death.

    I am not sure what the 'Arkansas Project' was, but if their aim was to discredit President Clinton, it sounds like something some Democrats might not be happy about.

    NOTE: The reference to Democrats assuming power refers to the time when Senator Jeffords defected from the Republican party. Obviously before the 2002 elections.
     
  12. Crimen y Castigo

    May 18, 2004
    OakTown
    Club:
    Los Angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There's nothing "so-called" about the Arkansas Project (I know that's not your language, asf).

    Funded by Richard Mellon Scaife, it was basically a hit machine, digging up bimbos, Whitewater, etc. Scaife is your typical conservative millionaire dirty trickster.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/clinton/stories/scaifeside050299.htm

    And here's an article from Brooks Jackson, before he started FactCheck.org
    http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1998/04/27/scaife.profile/

    And here's a fun fact:
    Scaife has donated more than $13 million to Malibu's Pepperdine University.
    Who's the new dean of their Law School? Kenneth Starr.

    Starr originally accepted a position with Pepperdine in 97 or 98, but suddenly thought better of it when the Scaife connection became public. Everything's okay now, though. No worries.
     
  13. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Ok. Sounds like you know something about this Arkansas project. But how credible were Olson's alleged links to this group? Is there something there that might be enough to derail his candidacy to the Supreme Court?
     
  14. Crimen y Castigo

    May 18, 2004
    OakTown
    Club:
    Los Angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    My bad -- just the mere mention of the ArkProject got me all Hillary and Vast Right Wing Conspiracy-ish.

    Olson's connection to the ArkProject is usually described as "tenuous."

    What is known is that he's best buds with Starr. They were at the same law firm in LA, and they've both been part of The National Legal Center for the Public Interest and the Washington Legal Foundation --- two conservative think tanks funded by..............................................wait for it .....................................................Richard Mellon Scaife.

    And of course, like Starr, Olson is very, very conservative, constitutionally and jesus-ly speaking.
     
  15. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Unlike some, I have actually read Hawking's books. And I do think I understand a lot of what he says.

    Meanwhile, my point was simply this: since Democrats can't win elections (or rather, are winning fewer and fewer of them), the courts are becoming their only option. I have no problem with Democrats fighting judicial appointments as they see fit, but I think we should all understand that it's less about principle than it is the death-gurgles of a minority party that sees its political influence in eclipse.
     
  16. nicephoras

    nicephoras A very stable genius

    Fucklechester Rangers
    Jul 22, 2001
    Eastern Seaboard of Yo! Semite
    That's wonderful for you. Really. It is. Irrelevant as always, but wonderful.

    The courts do not contain democrats, nor are they electoral strategies. Justices are usually apolitical. And as such, appointing justices isn't a "strategy".

    LOL. Losing two presidential elections, both remarkably narrolwy is a death gurgle? OK. So I guess that's why the Republicans fought Fortas tooth and nail in the late 60s, or why the Republicans fought Clinton so hard in 94, right?
     
  17. Own Goal Hat-Trick

    Jul 28, 1999
    ColoRADo
    it would always be benificial to have more liberal SCJs...

    more liberal ones means more choice for the people.

    start getting more conservative, and the people are going to have choices made for them.

    its pretty scary that, in this day and age, there are people, our president included, who think that they should force "morals", and thier way of thinking, upon an entire country, as well as the world.
     
  18. Barbara

    Barbara BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 29, 2000
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Anything that gives Thomas even a smidge more power will be damaging.




    No one said that people would be milking it. But it might give his critics pause before they spoke out.
     
  19. Barbara

    Barbara BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 29, 2000
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    I meant Ken Starr.
     
  20. Wingtips1

    Wingtips1 Member+

    May 3, 2004
    02116
    Club:
    Liverpool FC

    Motion seconded!!
     
  21. Wingtips1

    Wingtips1 Member+

    May 3, 2004
    02116
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    But they didn't fillibuster the judges, they simply voted NO. The dems now won't even allow for a vote.
     
  22. riverplate

    riverplate Member+

    Jan 1, 2003
    Corona, Queens
    Club:
    CA River Plate
    Anything which gives Pat Leahy pause is fine with me.
     
  23. nicephoras

    nicephoras A very stable genius

    Fucklechester Rangers
    Jul 22, 2001
    Eastern Seaboard of Yo! Semite
    What's the difference?
     
  24. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 16, 1999
    Big City Blinking
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    ....and they also refused to allow some nominations to even get out of committee. Sound familiar?
     
  25. Nutmeg

    Nutmeg Member+

    Aug 24, 1999
    It does? Really? So liberals are all about staying out of people's lives and not trying to influence their choices? Since when?

    So more liberal means that I can invest more of my money in a retirement account that has a future instead of Social Security? Because you see, right now, that's a choice liberals don't want me to have...

    So more liberal means that I can have my taxes that go to public education and instead put that money towards a private education for my child? Because you see, right now, that's a choice liberals don't want me to have...

    So more liberal means that public universities will completely disband any regard for race or gender, and will select students solely on qualifications? Because you see, again, that's a choice liberals really don't want schools to have...

    So more liberal means that people can buy, own, and sell whatever firearms they want when they want to, no questions asked? Liberals want to give Americans that choice, don't they?

    They don't?

    Wait a second, you mean to tell me that when liberals claim they believe in giving people more choices, they are in fact full of sh!t?

    Oh, wait a second. I think I might know what you're talking about. You mean that somewhere between 1-2% of abortions that involve the woman being forced to have sex or the woman's life endangered, you want to give that woman the choice to carry that baby to full term or not?

    Nevermind that the other 98% of abortions are just men and women who have already made a stupid, irresponsible choice and are just trying to avoid the consequences (a human life they have to care for) of that choice...

    So that's the tiny, statistically irrelevant segment of the population that you want to give a choice to, and now liberals are claiming to be the aisle of choice?

    HA! Comedy.
     

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