Where are you guys this morning? I need to hear again how we're a good team and these results are a fluke, how it'll all turn around if only some more of our best players get injured (this is my favorite so far), how the goals will soon flow like honey, how it's not that we don't have talent it's that we haven't "jelled", how Ray Hudson is a good coach. C'mon, you can muster it for one more week. I just know it. I need you guys. But I don't just take, I give. In case you're having trouble of your own this morning, I've got a few new ideas for you: --We're not bad, the scoreboards just misunderstand us. --We're not bad, we're just playing to get Freddy Adu (oops, sorry, Thamlin already took this one). --Our season will turn around once LA's new stadium opens.
You know who else is missing? All those dips from Chicago who were telling us in December how much we were going to love Stoichkov and Kovalenko...
... bump ... Yes, where are they? I'd like to know whether or not we still need to wait for the tenth game to evaluate this team.
I'm here.... Just got in from Minnesota.... I still haven't gotten a chance to watch the match yet, but will have done so by this evening.... Look fellas, none of us Pollyanna types are expecting this to turn around overnight.. We all know this to be true.. What seperates us (heretofore known as PPA's - ProudPollyAnna's) PPA's from the rest of you lot is a little bit of patience... Well, make that a lot of patience, which is starting to run out from this PPA's view... Yes it sucks that we can't win any games.. Yes it sucks that Earnie Stewart goes yet another game without a goal.. Blah blah blah.... Then again, no one was doing cartwheels when some dude name Bruce Arena was 1-6 in 96' either... I'm not saying both of these examples (96' and 03') are in any way similar, it's just that the people in the know didn't panic then either.. With that being said, things just might get a little worse before they get any better with Stewart and Convey gone for the month of June.... Again, come back in September and I will gladly capitulate that Hudson and his regime are a failure.. Until then, there are still some matches to be played....
Cweed, do you really think Hudson is anywhere near as good a coach as Bruce Arena is? Seriously? Also, according to http://www.mlsnet.com/archive/results_1996.html your history is wrong. Arena lost the first seven games (two in the Shootout) before winning big against Columbus 5-2 at RFK on 5-15-1996. By that time, Arena was able to get rid of the dead weight. Hudson can't do that. He's stuck with the players that are on the team right now, and there will not be an overhaul before game 8.
The difference between 96 and 03 isn't just that Arena is a much better coach than Hudson. I looked it up a couple weeks ago and one major difference between now and then is the table. Things were much more even in the East back in 96 so we weren't nearly in the same sort of hole after the slow start. But it's that hole that makes it imperative for us not to be patient at all today. Patience is a luxury that we simply cannot afford. If things get "a little worse" before they get better then we truly are doomed. How many future games are you willing to mortgage for the sake of patience? We've already mortgaged half the games in June. If things continue as they have or get a little worse we may get to July having rendered the August and September games worthless too. That's the season. We've got to stop bleeding points now. And, anyway, I've been very patient. I've had four years of patience. It really hasn't gotten me much.
Actually, your history is wrong. Take a closer look at the 96 results, specifically May 1. DC started 96 on a 1-6 run. For most of that time, Bruce was in Atlanta coaching the Olympic team. As for stone cold locks for 2003, I gotta agree with El Jefe.
I'm pretty sure I made this point very clear when I stated "I'm not saying both of these examples are in any way similar" I agree with that notion.. My point being is that most of us, if not all of us were very pissed off at the time and did indeed question the hiring of Arena and it ended up working out all right IIRC.. I'm not saying in any way that Hudson is the man for the job.. As I have stated numerous times, it comes down to the players on the field and not too many people can argue that we don't have talented players at our disposal.. It's not like any of these players have played for losing teams for most of their careers, quite the opposite really.. They know how to play the game, there just not getting it done at the moment and I just don't feel that a coaching change will correct their problems.. It may work, it may not.. I don't think we'll really know for some time...
Major props to JoeW for stepping into the breach this morning. I call for help and Joe is THE MAN! Turns out our season will turn around because we lose Nelsen, Convey and Stewart to the Confed Cup, while other teams in the East lose more/better players. A "9" for creativity and a perfect "10" for hopefullness -- just what the Dr. ordered.
Call me Polyanna if you like, but perhaps the real Polyannas are the ones who think - we can fire Hudson and get a coach of the quality of Arena or Bradley in a heartbeat - that we can dump Marco and place the burden of running the team's play on the shoulders of guys who are too young to buy a beer - that Ali Curtis / Stokes / (insert your own untried player here) are the answer to our prayers Sorry to say it but there are no easy answers. Personally I think that the jury is not quite in on Hudson and Trask. On the one hand, we've had a number of new players coming in, injuries to some key players, and some other key players (ie Olsen, Stewart, Marco), haven't really stepped up in the way one would expect. On the other hand, the team looks disorganized going forward and has been pathetic on set pieces, which you can blame on the coaching. And there have been some questionable trades/acquisitions. To sum up, it seems that our problems are partly down to the players, partly down to circumstance, and partly down to circumstance. So excuse me if at this stage in the season I am not willing simply to dump our present coaching team, especially with no obvious alternative in sight. If I was Steven Zack I would wait until mid-season to make a decision about where the team is going. If there is no noticeable improvement by that time I inform Hudson that his job is on the line and start looking for a replacement. Since we don't have relegation to worry about it is not the end of the world if we don't make the playoffs, and it is certainly not worth risking putting the team into the hands of questionable unknown quantities because the team has started badly. Fact is that we are never going to get Arena or Bradley to coach at DC again, and we might as well face up to it.
No s......... I don't think it was as much the guys we gave up as the guys we got. Stewart-nothing, Esky-nothing, go back to last years' pickups nothing Stoitchkov and Kovalenko are pathetic. I could do better out there than Kovalenko. All Kovalenko can do is pass backwards or sideways.......he doesn't want the ball, he does nothing creative with it, he just plain sucks. Stoitchkov is playing like he should have retired a long time ago Look back on ALL the money we had, with the 1st pick in the draft, and who did we get-Kovalenko, Stoitchkov, Stewart, Eskandarian, Ivanov, Stokes (relegated to a half on the bench on an A-league team)..............in a sense we got NOTHING Our season's over. We don't have anybody who makes the defense fear us besides Convey. Say goodbye to Stoitchkov's career, Hudson, and whoever else.
Sorry but Bruce was present for all of the DC games when the team was going 1-6. Bruce was pulling double duty with both the Olympic Team and United. I clearly recall a very distraught Bruce Arena during the 1-6 start by DCU. The Atlanta Olympics games by the way took place in July of 1996.
I've said that the first 1/3 of the season was going to be rough. I didn't really know what I meant when I said it, but I really haven't seen any consistant play from any of our players, save Nelsen, to make me think that we've accomplished anything these first 7 games. So, it looks like the first 1/2 of the season will be tough and the last half we might start showing promise, but it'll be too late considering the competitive nature of the East. Sure, Bobby played well in the second half of the Dallas game, but where was he in the first half. I don't care where our most threatening player on the field plays, he should have been just as dominant in the first half. It's these inconsistancies that are killing us. Everyone is still playing their own game. They're not coming together like a team. If we want to have a good season, we have to start playing the whole game like a team. DC should take a few notes from Dallas' attack last Saturday. They sent three guys up the side of the field at a running pace. We aren't attacking like that. We give the defence time to set up and defend us. The problem is that we don't have the guys with good enough ball skills to penetrate into a crowded defence to either draw defenders to him, or to take shots. So, this method should be scrapped for more of a counter attack with numbers. Stop passing backwards!!! Ball control is great when you are protecting a lead, but if you can't score goals, what's the point of it. Through all of this, the players are the ones on the field, but it's the coach's responsibility to make them play as a team. And that isn't happening. If the players aren't doing what they are suppose to for the system to work, the you have to bench them. There has to be consequences for bad play. If that means that you put someone inexperience in and that person get's burned, at least the starters realize that they are held accountable for their actions. I just don't think that Ray is the coach for this team. We've got talented players. Our starting line up is a decent setup. I don't agree with Chino, but apparently we don't have anyone to replace him right now. I'm at the point now that we've already scrapped all shot of making the playoffs. Now all we've got left is our pride. Ray's got to grow a set and stop being a players coach. If they are going to play that crappy, then they can ride the pine. That's not United soccer. At least it shouldn't be. The players have got to get that message. This is Ray's role. To make tough coaching decisions. But once again, Ray has proven that what he tells us isn't what we get. He won't change and that's fine. He can be a successful commentator next year.
Bingo. This I think is what's meant by "piano movers". We don't have anyone who will/can dribble or pass the ball that results in an almost immediate chance. For example, when Kovalenko has the ball in the middle streaking toward the goal and then he passes it to some guy out on the side for a cross or backwards, it's really time to take him out and tell him he's playing like a moron. Don't believe it happens? Check the tape. Look at Guevera. He's a classic case of a "piano mover".
Hey--just b/c I"m humor-challenged doesn't mean I don't occassionally discover a hint of "fun-dom". Besides, anyone who generates so much loathing from so many of the Metro posters has got to have something going for him! I stand prepared to step into the breach as needed (but being pollyanna-ish would be much easier if we'd just score a few more goals!)
I may or may not be Pollyanish, but I'm not ready to give up on the season. Yeah, we've already dug ourselves a hole and spotted an 8-point lead in the standings to all the teams in the East that look better than us. But there's still 23 games left in our season. All it takes is for us to become mediocre (a significant improvement) and one of those 4 teams ahead of us to start sucking. There's always hope. So I'm not ready to consider my season ticket purchase a complete waste of money. Well, at least I got a half-season instead of the full season It's ridiculous to think the team is losing intentionally (or as part of an MLS master plan) so we can have a legitimate claim to Freddy Adu. The team sucks but I don't think either Hudson or the players are that cynical, or even smart enough to carry through such a hare-brained conspiracy. If anything, the team has suffered some benign neglect from it's absentee ownership ever since AEG took custody of the team and DC United became just one of several teams Kevin Payne was overseeing. This benign neglect - and the money guarantees in Hudson's contract - makes it less likely, I think, that Ray Hudson will be held accountable for the team's poor performance. I do like Sandon's scenario in the other thread (re: Goff article) about hiring Ellinger after the U-17 World Cup - but I wonder whether Hudson would be let go if the team has "rallied" into 4th place in the East.
I disagree with the posters who say this team lacks consistency. This team has very consistently looked like the same one I saw in the preseason that couldn't attack against, couldn't take one-on-one, and couldn't outclass Richmond. We still look like the same disorganized bunch with very little skill or speed.
I think you mean a "piano player" as opposed to "piano mover" the piano player is the Maestro Zidane type player and the "piano mover" is the destroyer heavy lifter type player such as Dunga.
My understanding is that the first reference to "piano movers" vs. "Piano players" came from KC after they played us a second time. One of their players indicated that we had too many piano players and not enough piano players. I took that as a reference that our team is full of guys with technique, seeking to do the technical thing but not enough of hard running, hard working tacklers and markers and ball winners. Now part of that perspective is that its coming from someone from KC (and their team is all about hard work, hard running, marking, systems and playing your specific role--not ad lib jazz rifs). But it's also a different take from how many of the fans here see the issue. B/c it's arguing that the reason we're having problems is not b/c of poor attackers but we're not supporting the attackers enough with hard work, tackling, ball winning. Its the distinction between Zidane and Mikele and their roles. Not sure I agree with the initial claim (ie: our team has too many piano players and we need more piano movers) but it's an interesting perspective on our troubles.