Olympic Roster Predictions - Tokyo 2020

Discussion in 'USA Women: News and Analysis' started by MiLLeNNiuM, Jul 8, 2019.

  1. WoSoFan

    WoSoFan Member

    Dec 23, 2017
    For clarification on Macario's playing time for her first four games:

    Game 1 This was the first game she played,, a league game, she didn't start but was subbed in the first half and played 54 minutes.

    Game 2: She started in a Championship League game against Brondby, and played for 60 minutes.

    Game 3: In another Championship League game, against Brondby, she didn't start but played all of the 2nd half.

    Game 4: First Championship League game against PSG, she only played 15 minutes near the end of the game.

    For reference on her Last Four Games:

    Game 5: League game. Started and played 90 minutes. Scored 1 goal
    Game 6: Championship League Game they lost to PSG. Started and played 74 minutes. 1 goal.
    Game 7: League game. Started and played 90 minutes. 1 goal and 1 assist.
    Game 8: League game. Started and played 90 minutes. 1 goal.
     
    outside63 and BrooklynSoccer repped this.
  2. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I'm sorry. This is just Megan Rapinoe 2016 (and Alex Morgan last year) all over again. You can't not play real games for six months, then suddenly get match fit in a couple of months.

    I'm a huge Heath fan, having covered her career since she got to Chapel Hill. She's one of the fiercest talents I've ever seen, but there is no way we don't have better alternatives than someone who isn't going to be sharp and ready.
     
    outside63, sitruc, kolabear and 3 others repped this.
  3. NCChiFan

    NCChiFan Member

    NC Courage
    United States
    Feb 19, 2021
    Yea, we will see what June brings.
     
  4. WoSoFan

    WoSoFan Member

    Dec 23, 2017
    Who missed out because Ellis had to have Rapinoe rather then someone more deserving on the roster?
     
  5. hotjam2

    hotjam2 Member+

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    lineups from the US/Sweden quarter finals in 2016
    United States vs. Sweden - 12 August 2016 - Women Soccerway

    don't remember who cut on the short lost. Can't blame it all on Rapinoe, Jill Ellis thought 18 year old Mallory Pugh was going to be the next big deal, lol
     
    kolabear repped this.
  6. kolabear

    kolabear Member+

    Nov 10, 2006
    los angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Kealia Ohai (now Kealia Watt), Lynn Williams, Jessica McDonald

    A lot of people probably still rated Erika Tymrak very highly but in retrospect they may have slightly overrated her.

    :We can re-start the Jaelene Hinkle debate, too, most likely :)

    If Hinkle's on the team, Dunn isn't needed on the backline and she can play further forward, including Megan Rapinoe's place on the outside of a 4-4-2

    Oh my God, I forgot that Rapinoe came in as a sub and then had to be substituted for. No wonder Andy Mead's having a cow at the thought of the US making a similar mistake now.
     
    AndyMead repped this.
  7. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I've been "having that cow" since we took 3 injured players to WWC03, then had Chastain break her foot in the first game. By the time we got to Portland, we were some very tired and overworked legends with two unprepared young players without the international experience needed to prepare them for the game.

    Germany ran us off the field. It was never in doubt.

    We've been regularly making the same mistake over and over again. Sometimes the huge gap in our talent still carries over the line (Canada, anyone), and sometimes it doesn't.

    Subbing Rapinoe in and back out is just the poster child. Any other top national team and Jill Ellis would've been booking private travel home from Brazil.
     
    sitruc, blissett and kolabear repped this.
  8. lil_one

    lil_one Member+

    Nov 26, 2013
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #308 lil_one, May 4, 2021 at 3:29 AM
    Last edited: May 4, 2021 at 3:38 AM
    Despite what others have said, you just have to look at the alternates: O'Reilly was the one cut to put Rapinoe on the roster, and I would have taken a healthy HAO over Rapinoe in 2016. She was also the only one I can remember who actually got minutes in 2016 as a winger who didn't make the 18. Also remember that Dunn was actually playing up top in 2016 so she was the other forward.

    I will never forget this. She played 33 minutes in the last group stage game, and was subbed off in the 1st half. She made it 27 minutes in the quarterfinal, and had to be subbed off when the game went to overtime. Not only that, but she looked terrible in those 27 minutes. Everyone could tell she wasn't ready.

    EDIT to add: I guess there's an argument too that Ellis could have chosen to take another midfielder instead of winger, so it was Sam Mewis that was cut for Rapinoe.
     
    kolabear repped this.
  9. hotjam2

    hotjam2 Member+

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    what ever happened with Ada Hegerberg at Lyon? I mean she had an ACL last year in January, which usually takes about 9 months to recover from, yet it be now 1 year 4 month(and you got to figure she would take back Macario's starting central/striker spot upon return)

    looking at some Lyon stats so far this season;
    Macario; 4 goals from 517 minutes playing time = 129 mins per goal
    previous starting C/S N. Parris; 13 goals from 1515 min.= 116 min per goal
    last year's A Hegerberg; 14 goals; from 1145 min = 82 min per goal

    Macario lagging a little behind but could have an better assist average & of course still learning Lyon's more 'deiiberate passing' tactics instead of the 'shoot em up' style of perhaps Stanford & USWNT
     
  10. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    And let's be honest. It gets back to the root of the issue. We don't develop international players. We play endless friendlies, but don't work on alternatives until we have no choice or an extremely special player forces the issue. Hell, even then (cough-Crystal Dunn in 2015-cough) they don't always get through.

    Asking "who else they would've taken" is a terrible question. Because the answer is often nobody knows. Because we didn't really prepare anyone. Sure, HAO would've been better in Rio, but the list should have 10-15 possible names on it. Not another 30+ player.

    That was the problem 2003. April Heinrichs didn't really have any other players ready to select. Lorrie Fair was basically the odd player out. The reigning WUSA defender and goalkeepers of the year never got called up for a tryout. Heinrichs was poo-pooing Wambach into 2002. The two inexperienced players on the 2003 roster were Boxx and Bivens. They were basically emergency options. Boxx found her sea legs, but Bivens was scape-goated into oblivion after the Germany debacle because any thought that the "Founders" were getting old and breaking down or that Heinrichs was doing a terrible job were to be deflected.

    There's a reason Mark Krikorian and Tom Stone were never given the Reigns of the national team and they hired Greg Ryan. We all saw what happened to Tom Sermanni.

    Jill Ellis is one of the greatest managers in history. Not only did she have to balance the politics of squad selection, she had to win within those confines. She took a terrible roster to Canada and had the wherewithal to change course and bench some "stars" then win. Rapinoe in Rio was her low point, and she should've been fired for it. Frankly, winning a second WWC with the unwritten restrictions on player development and squad selection that go with keeping her job is absolutely mind blowing.

    I think Vlatko is an incredible on the field coach, and a keen talent evaluator. I think he's still a little overwhelmed by the restrictions on the player selection side. We'll find out he manages at soon enough if the Olympics happen.
     
    kolabear repped this.
  11. Klingo3034

    Klingo3034 Member+

    Dallas FC
    United States
    Oct 11, 2019
    Ada got injured again.
     
  12. NCChiFan

    NCChiFan Member

    NC Courage
    United States
    Feb 19, 2021
    I disagree with some of what you're saying. Where is it stated anywhere we have to train US players to play internationally? As it is, we have the greatest pool of trained players, thanks to title 9, in the world. It is evidenced by the amount of major tournament victories by the USWNT since the 80's. No other country in the world comes close. Sure from time to time someone manages a great team... Say Germany for a decade or so, but they've fallen off. When the Mia Hamm's of the world where joining the USWNT in H.S. they were better than anyone else on the team or at least as good. That isn't the case currently, forgetting it isn't probably allowed, not at the High School level anyway. Currently, the USWNT draws from a pool of College and professional soccer players. And if a younger Professional Level Player can't beat out an older Professional Level Player that's on them. Be better. Get better. Rapinoe is still scoring goals at a pace. You want to argue Lloyd, I get it, but she isn't useless, the majority of her 124 international goals have come after the age of 30. And what a publicity magnet for the USWNT who have more than just us dedicated fans to cater too. The Lloyd story is a generational type story worthy of her spot as a back up. I would have thought the Olympics as her last hurrah, but since they were pushed back into the upcoming World Cup, we will see.

    As it is, it isn't like our Professional players are floundering, just look at K. Mewis. After a looong hiatus from the National Team, she's back stronger than ever. Doesn't sound like her skills diminished.
     
  13. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    It is absolutely the technical staff of a senior national team to prepare for the future. If we didn't have a fetish about cap numbers with the WNT, and like the rest of the world 100 caps was rare and amazing and a 150 put you in rarified air, imagine how many players could've been given a chance, and of all those given a chance, how many could've been seasoned with 20-25 developmental games. Our player pool should be a solid 40-50 players, not 25.

    It is absolutely the national team coaches job to identify and make sure there is healthy competition for roles and spots. Where broken legs, injuries, and red cards don't suddenly put the team in a bad spot for upcoming games.
     
  14. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    If Carli Lloyd had 150 caps instead of 300, imagine how many players could've been given a shot over the last 15 years. There is nothing Carli has done in the Olympics and World Cups that she could not have done with half the caps. We trot our "stars" out for so many meaningless friendlies and made up tournaments that it is truly frustrating.
     
  15. Klingo3034

    Klingo3034 Member+

    Dallas FC
    United States
    Oct 11, 2019
    Should put the younger players in starting lineups for friendlies more.
     
  16. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    And here's where I backpedal a bit. Women's soccer is a tough sell. There's a reason why the CBA is sooooo focused on the entrenched players. It takes a lot of work to make a soccer player, much less a women's soccer player, noticed by the American public. Selling tickets is hard. Selling tickets to soccer and to women's sports in general is really hard. Getting sponsors on board is hard. It's not cheap running a national team apparatus.

    Promoters who sign on to put on USWNT friendlies have certain expectations for their own marketing purposes. They can't dictate who Vlatko starts or plays, but there has to be a certain expectation that a minimum number of stars will be in uniform and some will play. Otherwise a bunch of young fans whose parents paid a lot of money for them to see Mia Hamm or Alex Morgan or Hope Solo or Crystal Dunn are going to be really upset.

    I understand how we got to where we are. The question is, how do we change it. How do we begin to move past the last 30 years.

    Women's soccer is becoming a viable self-sustaining spectator sport. The NWSL is becoming self-sufficient. It's creating its own stars and narratives. McCall Zerboni and Kristen Hamilton don't get caps without the NWSL. But that should become the norm, not outliers. Neither of players were/will ever become National Team regulars, but they were both played in front of North Carolina audiences because they helped sell - and had some ability to contribute.

    But there are better players, and potential regulars, just waiting for their real chance to grab a spot and hold on - and force an entrenched player into early WNT retirement. Such is the natural order of sports. Time always wins.
     
    kolabear repped this.
  17. kolabear

    kolabear Member+

    Nov 10, 2006
    los angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As long as you mention Kristen Hamilton, she's the striker who should be getting more of a chance with the national team. I know, I know, she doesn't even start for North Carolina in they're 4-4-2 when Williams and McDonald are both around but she's been a key player in making North Carolina so crazy dangerous to play against.

    (Why not McDonald then? Well, McDonald should be considered, too. I just think Hamilton adds something different to the US team that would work well with the team's ability to suddenly get the ball into dangerous spots inside the box)
     
  18. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    #318 AndyMead, May 4, 2021 at 2:41 PM
    Last edited: May 4, 2021 at 3:50 PM
    JMac has become a personal friend over the years, but she's 33 years-old.

    We need 18-23 year-olds. We need to be trying the Ashley Hatches out. The Addisyn Merricks. Not the players we know, but are pushing 30.

    Internationally, forwards typically peak from 24-28, defenders 26-30, and goalkeepers in their early 30s. Those ages has skewed later over the decades as training, nutrition and fitness science has advanced, but time always wins in the end.

    I love McDonald. Throwing her back into the national team is not moving forward. It would be an emergency stopgap if someone breaks a leg this summer.

    EDIT: And let's be honest. Player identification and development is for 2023 and beyond at this point. We know who the player pool for Tokyo is. There's not a lot of wiggle room this close to the tournament. There are really, at most, 24 or 25 players in play, and probably not that many. What'll be interesting is if there are any non-"Federation Players" on the extended replacement player list.
     
    kolabear repped this.
  19. WoSoFan

    WoSoFan Member

    Dec 23, 2017
    Ada Hegerberg started all 13 games she played in that season. Take into account that Macario's first 4 games, even though she did start one game, was more of a learning and adjustment process for her as well as for the other players and the coaches. Now take it from the last four games she started and got a significant number of minutes, and we get an interesting number: Macario 4 goals from 344 minutes playing time = 86 minutes per goal.

    If Hegerberg is available to play at the start of next season, I would expect them to move Macario into Marozsan's spot since she will be playing with OL Reign until the end of their season. Macario was the CAM in the PSG game. She played it in a 4-2-3-1 formation. Marozsan moved to an outside mid spot in that game. It will be interesting as to the dynamic we might see between Hegerberg and Macario in the line-up at the same time.
     
    hotjam2 repped this.
  20. Disapproving Hippo

    Disapproving Hippo New Member

    Manchester United
    United States
    Jan 17, 2021
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't follow the French league but looks like Lavelle will end up in Lyon. How and where do you think they will fit her in?
     
    kolabear repped this.
  21. Klingo3034

    Klingo3034 Member+

    Dallas FC
    United States
    Oct 11, 2019
    Where you heard about Lavelle going to Lyon?
     
  22. Disapproving Hippo

    Disapproving Hippo New Member

    Manchester United
    United States
    Jan 17, 2021
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, it's just a rumor as of this hour but it came from the same source that broke the news of Sam Mewis transfer to NC Courage from ManCity so.
     
  23. WoSoFan

    WoSoFan Member

    Dec 23, 2017
    #323 WoSoFan, May 4, 2021 at 4:49 PM
    Last edited: May 4, 2021 at 5:02 PM
    I don't see it happening. When the statement was made that Le Sommer would be heading to the Reign and an American would be going to Lyon, everyone assumed it would be Lavelle. It could very easily be one of the three Reign players they sent over to train with Lyon. Saw something they liked in one of them. Maybe a short term deal since Marozsan and possibly Le Sommer would be gone a few months. Maybe they are sending a young player just to train and play with their Academy team.

    First of all, I doubt they would sign her unless she came to them for a try-out. Macario had to do that before they signed her. Second, if they were interested, they like their players to sign long term deals. Not sure Lavelle would even do that with the risk of ending up in a subbing role.
     
  24. NCChiFan

    NCChiFan Member

    NC Courage
    United States
    Feb 19, 2021
    Yea, it will be interesting to see the team that makes the next world cup roster. My guess, you will see a lot of familiar faces, especially if the USWNT win's the gold.
     
  25. Klingo3034

    Klingo3034 Member+

    Dallas FC
    United States
    Oct 11, 2019
    Chances are Bethany Balcer.
     

Share This Page