October Friendlies (Chile & Algeria)

Discussion in 'Colombian National Team' started by Froboy69, Sep 10, 2019.

  1. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    #401 HomietheClown, Oct 21, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2019
    I am not sure if Izzy/Muriel or Bacca would have been the ones left off but maybe.
    I just think it would have been JuanFer more likely because the lineup we used against Poland was our ideal lineup and Cardona would have probably been in there in the place of JuanFer.
     
  2. pepinointer

    pepinointer Member+

    Mar 12, 2007
    Santiago de Compostela
    Club:
    Millonarios Bogota
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Obviously quintero took his spot.......

    But izquierdo was useless.......as well as bacca, cardona would have been a better inclusion........that was the biggest mistake in the confection of that roster.
     
  3. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    Those are different types of players than Cardona though.
    And Izzy just played one match so I am not going to judge him much.
    Bacca I would have replaced with a hypothetically healthy Duvan but that is just me looking back on it. Bacca had the seniority.
     
  4. pepinointer

    pepinointer Member+

    Mar 12, 2007
    Santiago de Compostela
    Club:
    Millonarios Bogota
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    meh....dont care if they are different type of players........isnt like the coach have restrictions to build a list. "only 2 ofenssive midfielders"....for example CQ nobody prevented CQ of not calling offensive midfielders......and called 4 wings.

    If izquierdo only was used in one match...means how uselles was his called up.
     
  5. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    I agree It does not matter to you or me when building a roster. But when it came to Pekerman I think he was looking for certain characteristics and different attributes.

    Almost everyone played badly in that game and they were a man down early so I cannot really say much about Izzy and his individual effort.
     
  6. villus

    villus Member+

    Jun 5, 2008
    We were the best team in our group by all accounts in all of our games did we deserve to win a game hands down and go out and were a much better team? No aside from Poland. If Mina doesn't score those goals against Senegal and England all of a sudden it's the worst World Cup ever? So because of these headers it was a great World Cup? We didn't play well enough the whole cycle or in the World Cup consistently to deserve to go deep in the World Cup, lots of factors but at the end of the day we played down to our potential with experienced players. We had better performances in 1990 and worse results, call it nostalgia if you want but for me soccer is a balance between pragmatism and art, when you have the talent to create something and possibly hit top heights a waste when you simply play pragmatic and don't play brave and take risks. 1990 at least we took risks, 20018 cycle Pekerman unfortunately played way too pragmatic and the England game was the perfect example of how our mentality was wrong if we wanted to actually move up a notch into the top tier of countries.
     
  7. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    #407 HomietheClown, Oct 21, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2019
    We had some good tested veterans but...
    ...we had an inexperienced back line though other than Arias who did not have much responsibility in Brasil behind Zuniga.
    Davinson and Mina had started a handful of games together and certainly nothing near to the level of play they encountered in Russia. Mojica played like a guy who was not called up in 2 and a half years.

    JuanFer was phenomenal but you can tell his endurance was not there in important late stages. And we had a bit of a dark cloud with the Cardona omission.
    James was injured most of the tournament.
    Ospina played like crap late in Qualifiers but thankfully stepped it up during the tournament for the most part.

    I would not characterize it as playing down to our potential.

    I think we played about as well as we could considering those circumstances.
     
  8. villus

    villus Member+

    Jun 5, 2008
    Some of our best players at the World Cup weren't even starting at the beginning of the World Cup, Barrios, Davinson and Mina were huge for us at the World Cup and they weren't even necessarily starters going into it which was INSANE IMO. Our backline played great when the right players played, we ran out Falcao as a lone striker and then used Bacca as well. We had a lot more potential in the squad but Pekerman did a poor job and was too late to figuring out who the best players was because he forced in guys who did well for him in the past. That's playing down to our potential and much of it is on Pekerman, the quality of our play throughout 2018 cycle was bad, we rarely created a lot of chances or scored goals, we struggled against the weak teams even at home, we even won games that were really close that we weren't clearly the better team. We have better players and should win against Poland, Senegal and Japan. We didn't reach our potential partially because of Pekerman's poor decisions and stubbornness, if we're going to be defensive that's fine, but Pekerman ran out Falcao as a lone striker vs England in a defensive lineup which was brain dead.
     
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  9. pepinointer

    pepinointer Member+

    Mar 12, 2007
    Santiago de Compostela
    Club:
    Millonarios Bogota
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Poland was first in the bets and the favorite to win the group....so not just critiziced

    Mourinho and a lot of coaches, put us out in first round accoridng their predictions....not all rated us so high outside



    1. Headers are part of the game.......as well as the good execution of corners....there are teams that arent able to have corner kicks in favor......the defenisve behaviour of a team also have to be qualified.......and the fact that we only recived 2 goals is good..........in 1990 we received 6 goals and only scored 4.....

    2 Performance isnt the same, that Vilus have to like hoy the team plays...........and to be more risk doesnt talk about better performance.......


    With james or cardona instead lerma or sanchez..........maybe we would pass thorugh.....also to qualify and played better we need our better players.

    probably without kane, engalnd wouldnt pass........
     
  10. kromekote

    kromekote Member+

    May 22, 2012
    Club:
    America de Cali
    You do know that the point system was different back in 1990 right? And so theoretically that 'mediocre win and tie' of 1990 would give enough points to advance from the group stage for 2018. The former Yugoslavia block was always deeply talented and fast forward to today's break up of those Slavic nations, you realize just how strong Yugoslavia has traditionally been in futbol.

    The Germans were finalists in 86' and had a freaking amazing team to watch. UAE was the obvious punching bag but we weren't favored to take any point from this WC because we had no recent experience or recent precedent in the world stage. It was about learning for the 'next phase'. We did a fantastic job and no Wikipedia page or google search is going to change that experience for me.


    the biggest criticism of that WC Polish team coming into the WC was just how dependent they were of Lewandowski and if they had enough creativity that could offer something else (Milik). But everyone knew their game plan. Get the ball to Lew in the box and he would do the rest. He had half the team's goal tallys during their qualifying campaign, pretty incredible. They had some injuries prior to WC (Milik) who was doing his best to get back in form. When you start to look deeper into their WCQ campaign, they had a reasonably accessible group and purposely sat out friendlies vs tougher opposition in order to adjust their fifa ranking seeding.

    This conversation started with your statement about these 2 last world cups being the best performances ever for Colombia. I agreed on 2014 but I didnt like the collective 2018 WC performance. I haven't read ONE response of hate for what we did in WC 2018? Or anyone saying that what CQ is showing is a thing of beauty. I think plenty of folks here believe that we need more time and that not all is this horrific picture you've painted. Pekerman had lots of crappy outings. So have all the DTs in the world.

    You keep bringing Pinto into the mix as if these 2 are the same scenarios and that's simply not the case.

    Pinto had/has deep familiarity with Colombia for obvious reasons and had a leg up vs CQ who may need more time to adjust his pieces. Pinto has left almost every team through the back door. Pinto's antics were always (to this current day) been about his grandness/ego and not of his players. It wasn't solely his defensive structure that led to his demise but it was his antics during training, call-ups etc where he would basically berate players and insist on his structure.

    Pinto had a ridiculous Copa America (2007) which I vividly recall because by the time my plane landed in San Cristobal, we were already down 3-0. Argentina toyed with us in the next round and we finally played an already eliminated weak USA side. We all know what happened in qualifiers with that team relying on getting a foul somewhere near the 16 yeard box so that Bustos can try his hail-mary goals . These were strategies that you knew were not going to work long-term. When points and performance were on the line, Pinto was never able to have any success but he was given friendlies, Copa and qualifiers before it was obvious he wasn't the guy. If we have a horrendous CA 2020, that's a cause for being worried and/or firing. If we have a great CA 2020 and a horrible start to qualifiers, that's also a cause for the same. But we're not at that point.
     
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  11. Furnaccio

    Furnaccio Member+

    Feb 19, 2008
    New York, NY
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    We really like to torture ourselves here and replay what went wrong for the NT last cycle ;)
     
    villus repped this.

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