(NSR) F_kk Correa

Discussion in 'Ecuador' started by Guayaquileño, Dec 16, 2007.

  1. Guayaquileño

    Guayaquileño Member

    Dec 3, 2006
    New York City
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    with all respect .. you don't know what you are talking about and you have no clue. have you ever lived in Guayaquil????? Have you seen first hand what he has done for the city and the province???? Are you informed of all the progress that has undergone in the region because of this man??? Do you know about the different social programs he has implemented for those that are not well off??? What he has done for the bettering of quality of life in GYE??? Have you???? Have you?

    Santiago de Guayaquil has never gotten into problems with gov't and to be frank... has kept to its own agenda and issues. Now this chiflado wants to come in and tell the city what to do??? He already carved up our province.. traitor- what now??? ese man es un resentido.. no es sorpresa que Guayas fue una de las provincias que no lo apoyo en las elecciones.

    Correa es un torpe, mamao, resentido, loco por el poder.... se cree el "sabe todo" ... ese tipo se cree que nadio lo puede tocar... que se valla al diablo.
     
  2. cristian1mv

    cristian1mv Member

    Jul 6, 2005
    no offense but you seem to care more about only Guayaquil than the whole country. if people keep on having this mentality of only helping certain people and not helping others the world will keep on suppressing people and nothing will ever change. like martin Luther king said change start from the bottom and up not from the top to the bottom. if people keep on waiting for some one to solve there problems or not care that other are suffering, thing will never change.
     
  3. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    My parents live in Guayaquil and they have been there since we moved there in 1980 from Germany. Other than my mother being from Quito my dad has no ties with Ecuador, ni sierra or Costa.

    He has always been very well informed as far as politics and current events go - world wide. If anyone is neutral in this matter without any kind of agenda - personal, business nor political, it is my father!

    Everytime we talk, I go through his 10 minute rap how much of a disaster Correa is not only for Guayaquil but Ecuador as well...

    That being said, Correa is not helping the country by tapping into Guayaquil's recources. i am all for Ecuador to be great as one and I think country comes before province before city.

    But in the end, Correa is not wanting to control Guayaquil for the best interest of Ecuador - no way, but to complete his circle of political power. Without Guayaquil standing up to his power hungry socialistic views he would be another Chavez!

    In the end, Guayaquil has become what it has become all on it's own and no one can take that away. It is not the mayor's job to fix Ecuador, just like it is not the President's job to dictate over it!
     
  4. LDU4ever

    LDU4ever Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 21, 2004
    Gainesville, FL
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    There is such a thing called national supremacy...the federal government supercedes a province or a city or a municipality, the consolidation of power is necessary for anybody, its just that in Ecuador there's no concern or respect for the rule of law...this isn't a battle of good versus evil and socialism was never intended to be a menace, unless you're living in a cold war mentality where anything socialist or communist was viewed as subversive. Here in the United States the consolidation of power comes as the president takes his oath of office, granted there are two legislative bodies and a judicial branch but New York City or Los Angeles won't throw themselves in front of a presiding president. As head of the party he is in charge of agenda setting, people follow suit or speak out peacefully but business must go on. Guayaquil can't even survive on its own, it lacks both the resources and the industry to be totally self sufificent, it'll just wind up being like the Vatican City or Monaco where its still dependent on a bigger country for much of its revenue seeing as how there's a 50/50 split on interior and foreign business. We need Guayas as much as Guayas needs us.
    The reason why Ecuador doesn't progress at a speed that is reasonable is because of things like this, internal sabotage and stifling which rips at the seams of an already fragile political system. Let Correa's term limit expire and try to elect someone who is more in tune with the policy agenda which suits Guayaquil's "interests", if he was elected by a majority, the social contract says that all are bound to it, even those who oppose him, there must be a respect of the law, the executive and the idea of national supremacy. Who can judge the progress that Ecuador has been making...he's only been in power for a year...unless we want band-aid short run fixes that have to be readdressed in six months time and become more and more expensive, lets let him do his job. All of these implementations are set to be for the long run, the only real way to make any sorts of progress, baby steps are the real progress movement. If anything I'd say Correa's tactics are like a game of chess and the man is an expert at macroeconomic and microeconomic affairs, after all he is an economist.
    At the end of the day we are all brothers and sisters who are ECUADORIAN and not Guayaquileños, Cuencanos, Ambateños, Quiteños, etc. As Ecuadorians we have the right to civilly oppose our leader but still respect the rule of law and the laws of the LAND which are superior to all others...For the sake of our credibility as a nation abroad I sincerely hope that Correa survives his term limit and can establish some sort of precedence...look at the French, Germans, Belgians, Canadians, Singaporeans, Japanese, S. Koreans...there is socialism in every one of those states...United we rise, United we fall
     
  5. Guayaquileño

    Guayaquileño Member

    Dec 3, 2006
    New York City
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    THANK YOU... that's exactly what I'm trying to say , but ppl in here think that I'm only for the interest of Guayaquil. That's not true.. never have I said anything about any other part of the country. I have only talked about Guayaquil because it is the biggest region being affected. I love my country and my city equally.
     
  6. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    As I stated before, I whole heartly agree on the impotance of the country to come before any region or city. Let me remind you what I wrote;
    I am all for Ecuador to be great as one and I think country comes before province before city.

    This has nothing to do with good v evil. Who said that? This has to do with an egomaniac, rightfully elected, invlolving government in the private sector stoping growth while in order to aquire the benefits and control of a country, one step at a time...and in doing so, he is reputably taking Ecuador back to the 1970's. This won't be a social reform, but the birth of a quasi-dictatorship.

    Are you joking, I hope you didn't spend too much time on this since it holds no bearing on Correa's actions in Ecuador. But thank you for the lesson in politics...

    However, if you want, you can start another thread were I can give you numerous of examples of states and cities in the US that have stood up before the President of the US due to differences in opinion.

    Another pointless ramble on your part since we all know this. No one here is saying otherwise so I'm not sure why you guys keep bringing this up.

    This does not have to do with Guayaquil having a leader in Quito to suit their interest at all. It is about not disrupting the progress that, as a city, it has been making. In fact, it should be used as a role model for other cities to adopt in order to be self supportive and to strive as a community instead of sitting on their asses waiting for everything to be handed by the national government. The provonces and cities of Ecuador need to step up to the plate.


    So let's see how much Guayaquil has needed a President that suits their needs...since 1998;
    Alarcón
    Mahuad
    Noboa
    Gutiérrez
    Palacio

    I think it is safe to say that the greatest improvements in Guayaquil as far as comercial, city clean up and beautification, high moral and strong business sense has all happened during the las 10 years so you argument doesn't hold...

    Oh boy, you truly are a sucker for this guy. You don't fix things by breaking other things....and that is what he is doing. He is destroying the private sector and private business and it is the obligation of the citizens to prevent him from continuing to take the country into this reckless course. All social contracs go to hell once he starts screwing up what has taken Ecuador years and years to accomplish.

    If his grand master plan is to ruin a perfectly run city while turning away any foreign investor that holds an interest in Ecuador, then he is doing it. Check mate!

    You say he is an economist? I majored in Political Science, so what? Does that now make my political analysis on him more valid to you? Abdala was an "Abogado" yet he violated every law in Ecuador. I could care less what he has as a title. I see his economics are simple; All for me, and none for you...other than what I allow you to have.

    Correa's idea of control is to overpower the private sector to benefit his control as head of state. I don't care who voted for him, (the majority of Ecuador do not have the proper education to have forseen this or even understand it) he should be either put under stricter control or stopped.

    The duty of a President is to lead a country forward rather than back several decades.

    As citizens, Ecuadorians have every right to fight against Correa. "National Supremacy" you say? Well, I believe his national supremacy is personal.

    The law of the land reigns supreme. Well Correa is not the law of the land. The law of the land are the laws written by the lawmakers and approved by a delegation of elected representaives. THAT is the only law of the land.

    Correa wants to be the law, but he is just a man. A President, true. But still just an Ecuadorian citizen. And if that man, as a leader no longer leads his people, all his people to success or to improvement, then he has no business leading!

    The socialism you see in Canada or Europe concerns the well being of the people in forms of medical and educational aid giving the less fortunate an opportunity to enjoy the benefits from taxes and the country as whole. We all know this is not happening in Ecuador. You do not see countries with a socialist mentality stop the progress of the private sector or foreign investment either...their governments support them, promote them and nurish them...not try to control or manipulate them; Correa's objective.

    Trust me, with Correa, we will all fall!
     
  7. cristian1mv

    cristian1mv Member

    Jul 6, 2005
    before i get in the subject can some on inform me exactly what correa has done to piss people off(in English if possible)(with out opinoin just what he is trying to do or what he is proposing)? i know thing like he is rewriting the constitution and basically abolished the congress which to me is a good thing since congress were the most corrupt part of our government and real good change would never be achieved. as far as the constitution it also needs to be rewritten, the old one didnt work and is out dated. i have also heard that he wants to change currency again which i think is an execlent idea becuse killing of the sucres was one of the worst decision in Ecuadorian history. also i have one more comment not every city has the resources that Guayaquil has so it is crazy to think that every city can self-provide or in better word grow economically by themselves. it works if your city has historic value(quito) or has a big port to produce income(Guayaquil) but what about the other cities? how are they going to make money? thats why in developing countries in my opinion it is necessary to share the wealth to try to spark economic growth in the other cities that are not so well known. also i have a comment on correa he seems like an intelligent man and also has his brush with the media but who can blame him alot of media outlets are controlled by big companies wich dont always have the best interst of the people. also you should be specially weary of the media in ecuador since a lot of the money is held by a few indevidual wich would do anythign to keep there weath (even if it mean lying)
     
  8. LDU4ever

    LDU4ever Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 21, 2004
    Gainesville, FL
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    There will be no dictatorship in Ecuador as long as he does not abolish the electorate, so whenever his term expires it is up to the Ecuadorian people to analyze his record and vote whether they want to keep him or not...as long as he keeps getting above 50% then he will continue to be elected if the term limits change...no dictatorship or quasi-dictatorship

    Taking Ecuador back to the 1970's aside from the impossibility of time travel would be good for the economy because it would mean a virtually minuscule foreign debt and more ownership coming from the inside out rather than the outisde having control of our resources as has been the norm with the corrupt congresses of the past 30 years

    in similar fashion to other countries with similar political party structures, the head of the party is usually the president or prime minister and he usually has full power in agenda setting...the history lesson was meant as an example to say that even if there's disagreement that people still go to work and do their jobs, at a state and federal level...the example holds, its airtight

    For lack of better words, Guayaquil is all alone when it comes to comparing it to other places in Ecuador...Chimborazo or the other provinces can't simply get off their asses and start working when they have virtually have no industry, incoming revenue, or strong techological sector...How do you intend them to step up to the "plate" whenTHE WHOLE COUNTRY IS AN AGRARIAN BASED ECONOMY WITH LITTLE INDUSTRY ANYWHERE ELSE EXCEPT FOR PETROL IN THE RAIN FORESTS AND ECO TOURISM. Strong fiscal policy measures are needed at a national level to help these provinces who might be eternally poor otherwise else...These things take time, we might never get to live to see thee things change.

    Okay so lets just say the Ecuadorians rise up and overthrow Correa as you say the social contract has failed. They do it in an effort to save the country while they shoot themselves in the foot the whole time they're doing it. When Gutierrez was overthrown in Quito, Ecuador's risk rate soared over 150 percent in a matter of days and it's virtually set us back 10 years already because investors are still wary of Ecuador's WEAK POLITICAL SYSTEM. How has he destroying the private sector? Is he nationalizing every industry imaginable? Is he stripping Noboa of contracts and taking his land and factories? Are the Wrights, Eljuris, Bucarams, Noboas being expelled from the country? Is Supermaxi and Creditos Economicos being overtaken by government? Is Porta and Movistar being run out? The answer is a resounding no to every single one. In Correa's tenure there has been no nationalization of any business or industry whatsoever, the only thing that has been consolidated has been PetroEcuador's power to repudiate bad and dubious contracts for oil, if anything I'd call that a small victory against companies that were literally thieving over 80% of our oil revenue and giving us only tiny percentages, pennies on the dollar.

    He's no grand master of chess but he is not turning away any foreign investors, not even Chavez is stupid enough to do that. These investors turn away because after doing exhaustive research into the economy and political structure, risk rates and other things are calculated by economists and financial analysts...Ecuador is actually getting better believe it or not and a big root for new business is going to be Manta, a real estate explosion is on the horizon for Ecuador and Americans will be the backbone of the growth in the next 5-8 years. That same uneducated majority that might have voted for him might also be a big uneducated majority that was blindly screaming at the rally in Guayaquil...don't go and forget outside of a few nice streets in Guayaquil lies one of the biggest urban sprawls and shanty towns on the pacific rim...over 200,000 people live in miserable poverty just miles out of the city and this has been proven by many non profit organizations such as the Red Cross, Children International, Unicef, among others.

    Ecuador's new constitution will change many things, including the social programs and how they will be dolled out to our needy citizens modeling a European system of social welfare. Its obviously not happening in Ecuador because we were working off a broken constitution!!!!!!!!!!!!! Correa has been in power for how long? 1 YEAR!!!!!!! what change do you want in 1 year?!??! Again, realize things will take years to fix, sometimes generations and we might not get to live long enough to see some of these dreams come into fruition because we are a third world country so progress is slower. If here in the US they raise or lower the interest rate, by the time it affects the economy its already 11-15 months in the future, by the time the research is done to see the effect, it's another 6-8 months...almost 2 years! Correa is no fool, he understands the need for development and its a mixed economy with free market initiatives and socialist policies. They are done in every country in the world! Everybody from Andorra to Zimbabwe, yes the US too. The only thing in the world that is purely free market is the English Premier League...Every country that says they're not trying to manipulate is lying...lets run down a few:

    USA: Lusitania incident WWI, Gulf of Tonkin, Iraq War, Patriot Act
    France: Algiers incident, Race riots leading to increased citizen watch from Government
    Russia: Vladimir Putin, enough said
    Zimbabwe:using colonialism fears to consolidate power
    Colombia: FARC has been used to consolidate power

    manipulation is not foreign to anybody, sometimes its necessary sometimes its done for personal gains but what I will say is that what does Correa have to gain out of it? He is president for 1 term, if the constitution changes it will change to 2 at MOST...he literally will do it for such a short time, its ludicrous to think that power consolidation will come for him alone, its an initiatve done to keep the national government stronger than the cities, this isn't ancient greece where each city state is autonomous, we are a republic where the subordinates are the provinces and city, don't get that confuse

    nobody is trying to stop Guayaquil's progress, even less a Guayaquileño president, go ahead and keep beautifying the city, it looks great, but ask Nebot why he hasn't done enough to address the increasing crime rates outside the city, why the shanty towns still don't have utilities like the city, why hasn't enough been done to allow citizens the right to organize into unions against strong handed corporations and for allowing child labor to continue on his streets...yes he's done good things for Guayaquil but he's just sweeping certain things under the carpet....
     
  9. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Great post. We tend to differ from a political point of view but your arguments and reasons are solid and I agree with you on many points that you have made.

    Simply put, we disagree on the current President's manner of leading the country and I will address your post when I have the time to provide a post as equaly well written as yours, because it deserves such.

    In the mean time - REPPED!!!
     
  10. LDU4ever

    LDU4ever Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 21, 2004
    Gainesville, FL
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    this is healthy dialogue and I appreciate good debate especially when we can have dialogue like this without insults, at the end of the day, we are Ecuadorians and are all united by our common passion in futbol...
     
  11. yoryi

    yoryi Member

    Oct 11, 2005
    Boogie Down BRONX!
    Very well said loco,,great post.
    I was having a few cold ones with old school Ecuas this weekend(grandpas)and this was pretty much what they were talking about.I'm not all that great in politics,especially ecuas politics,cause I'm really not instrested.But I'm all in it for my city,,, Manta,,who's a sleeping giant,but can't quite wake up due to the greediness of certain political parties in Ecuador who want everything for that just one region.Like I said before it is f!cked up that foreigners are helping certain regions progress,instead of their own government.
     
  12. loraz

    loraz New Member

    May 12, 2005
    Very well said indeed.

    Remember, Correa is just one man. Change will not happen overnight. He is up against economic parasites who have a lot of say. Like many intelligent visionaries, he or she will be ridiculed and judged.

    Susan B Anthony
    Martin Luther king
    Galileo
    Socrates
    Immanuel Velikovksy
    Nicola Tesla
    John Lennon.

    Why some strongly dislike Corea is beyond me. Anyone who think he is a "Dictator", please, just look at the pros and cons and not propaganda or hearsay.
     
  13. loraz

    loraz New Member

    May 12, 2005
    Very Well said.
     
  14. Guayaquileño

    Guayaquileño Member

    Dec 3, 2006
    New York City
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Correa is just one man and yes change does not happen over night... but there are ways of implementing change in the correct fashion... yes he is one man.. so was Fidel, Stalin, Hitler, Benito, Francisco Franco, Bucaram, Chavez... all seemed ok in the beginning and then what.. they reached what they wanted.. total control. Now I am not comparing Correa's current term as a dictatorship, but simply showing how one man in politics can really amass power and sway people.

    As for the very respected and honorable people you mentioned.. sure they were judged and ridiculed... and they succeeded in changing society for the better... may they rest in peace... but none of them were politicians.

    you should inform yourself and really get to know what Correa is doing to free trade and economy and the threat to the private sector and investment that has helped the economy grow.. not only that... he wants to be a "micro manager" and centralize institutions that are well off and successful. This is not the way to growth and expansion in the global market. If he wants his "socialism" to really be successful he should follow countrie's like Canada, Norway, Sweden, Spain, France, Germany.. etc.. they have a healthy balance for social programs and at the same time allow free trade and private investment to flourish.
     
  15. loraz

    loraz New Member

    May 12, 2005
    I don't think you are seeing the bigger picture. You are talking about Ecuador which has a totally different structure following a whole different, unorthodox chain of command.

    Ecuador has been not doing well period. Land is owned by foreigners. Business are owned by foreigners. Here comes a man with a new vision and you are not going give it time for his plans to work. So I repeat, it's just one man and change will not happen overnight.
    This man is higly educated and IMO sincerely believe that not only does he have Ecuador's best interest, but he has vision for change that will benefit Ecuador in the long run.

    not going into detail for I am at work but let me get back to bring you a full page of pros and cons.

    Again, be very very careful of propaganda. It's cutthroat in Ecuador. The rich want to remain rich and keep the poor...poor. Never ever deny this.
     
  16. LDU4ever

    LDU4ever Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 21, 2004
    Gainesville, FL
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    Correa doesn't come close to being a Mussolini, Hitler, Stalin or Franco...for one he's not a facist or communist, secondly he has not purged his own country and killed off its citizens by the millions. He is not Bucaram, who was notoriously corrupt in money handling and an embarrassment to our country abroad. He is not even Chavez. Anybody can sway a group of people, as a statesman, its his job to do so, otherwise he'd be a construction worker where all he does is grunt work.

    These examples you bring up are too radical, he will never have total control like Stalin did because there is no cadre of young and aspiring politicians who are being groomed to be his successor after decades of strong man leadership, plus Ecuador has a constitution (a new one coming soon) which he is bound by law to abide. While he won't have total control, he will exert a good deal of influence in policy making and initiative passing simply because his party also controls the legislative body of the government through free and fair elections, there is no corruption there.

    Nationalization of industry is not bad for an economy, there are many examples of very profitable government owned corporations in the world today which are and have previously added to a country's economy including: British Steel, Statoil, TVA, BBC, CBA, Pemex, among many many others...and not all sectors of the economy will be state owned, estimates have a very low percentage actually being run by the state. Furthermore, Correa is an economist which is something to understand when talking about the economy...whether he's a Keynesian economist or a Monetarist or a Neoclassical believer, they are all different ways to address the same problem, none of which are wrong.

    Ecuador is a third world country, before we emulate Canada, Norway, Germany or Sweden we should first think about putting food in the mouths of the hungry kids on a daily basis without having them work on the streets for pennies, and providing essential social welfare programs.

    We need to become stable before we can ever try to copy what they're doing, the essence of this whole argument is part of the reason why Ecuador cannot progress at a pace acceptable to everyone, and that is simply because of a resistance to any form of change, and with internal sabotage within the own government previously, it was pure self interest....why the hell is an Ecuadorian congressman getting paid over $100,000 a year? Why were billions robbed by those same people and why wasn't anything done to extradite them back? These are some of Correa's biggest opponents, the robber barons of Ecuador and the wealthy .5% of the country which hold well over 60% of the wealth of our country. Ecuador must do its best with what little it has, I know for a fact that Correa knows what he's doing and that his intentions are throughly good. Ecuador will not turn its back on the free market because globalization is the inevitable course of the new world order, but we must not forget that the same free market which helps us hurts us daily whenever shrimp, banana, rose prices fall and OUR producers are the ones affected!!! Therefore protection is needed otherwise we'll be third world forever, this is why we talk in LONG RUN progress.......I'd really like to know of any form of feasible private investment other than tourism or real estate projects similar to what Dubai is doing, our agricultural sector is tapped to capacity and well established and I'm positively certain that we will never have a robust technological sector because its never happened and we don't have infrastructure for it...that'd be like putting an Intel processor factory in Somalia, ludicrous. Correa has spoken about developing Manta's port and turning the Manta airport (After he kicks out the Americans who rent it for FREE) into a pacific hub for Asian flights, the only thing I know is that Manta can very well overtake Guayaquil in importance and financial robustness if the Manaus-Manta, the real estate boom and Airport plans are ever seen through, plus the large projected influx of Americans who are slated to come to Manta in the next 8 years.....

    We must stay positive and sit back to watch what these initiatives will bring, its an exciting time for our small country. Honestly its kind of a bad argument to get in to because only time will tell the legacy that Correa will leave, we'll let history have his way with him the way it has everyone else...
     
  17. yoryi

    yoryi Member

    Oct 11, 2005
    Boogie Down BRONX!
    You say that the Americans "rent" El aeropuerto Eloy Alfaro de Manta,but in reality it was the Americans who were putting up the money to upgrade the airport and make la pista one of the best if not the best in suramerica.Apart from this the US military contributes very much in the growth of the city.Soldiers are relocating to Manta,setting up business,which creates jobs for my peoples.(Not only Americans,,,you have a big Colombian pop,setting up
    business in Manta City)The Americans also give tactics to the police in fighting crime,if the US military were not there Manta,would be another Cali,or Medellen.Apart from this, Tourism is another big way Manta is developing quickly,you have cruise ships arriving at the port weekly and the Airport needs to be internationally not only for cargo,but for passengers as well.
    Some people want the American military to go ASAP,but they don't realize the good that Base is doing not only to Manta and la provincia de Manabi,but to the country in general.
     
  18. Guayaquileño

    Guayaquileño Member

    Dec 3, 2006
    New York City
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I believe that the US military should have stayed there...this is for the greater security of the region.. not just Ecuador, but for Colombia, Peru, Venezuela that are affected with Narcotrafico. Correa wants them out out of sheer spite and because el es un resentido acomplejado... he wants to show that he is this big tough guy persona who won't let the americans invade or exert influence... that's the way he thinks. I think this is one of his many stupidities... The US is there for the fight against drugs.. You said Manta has a big Colombian population I bet just like GYE... I hope no "rotten apples" enter the country when the US is not helping erradicate drugs in the region. Correa also is killing species of sharks that inhabit the rich ocean habitats of our coasts... he let the fishers continue to kill this sharks illegally just to satisfy some chinese or taiwanese fat dude sitting in his table across the globe. Why he did this??? because it was an american who raised concern for our OWN native species of shark... so what did Correa think about that??? of course he didn't like it because a gringo should not tell us what to do... so he proceeded to try and deport the poor guy... the only reason he didn't was because he had an ecuadorian wife who pleaded to him not to deport him.
    A president who acts like like that on a whim... and has this kind overly defensive mentality scares me... He clearly gets blinded by his over zealous, over nationalistic way of thinking... He should open up his mind more.
    Correa is not a bad man... I just severely dislike his attitude and way he wants to control so much on so little time... IF something is not broken, don't try to fix it.
    I wish Manta the best, as an ecuadorian, and even more as a fellow costeño, I hope Manta does grow and becomes as important as Guayaquil. Ecuador needs growth and expansion.
     
  19. LDU4ever

    LDU4ever Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 21, 2004
    Gainesville, FL
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador

    Nobody is detracting from the contributions which America has made to the city of Manta, it'd be absurd to overlook those contributions but realize that although they financed a part of the project that they're using OUR LAND and not paying for it whatsoever in terms that can be seen for anybody in the country, there has been a lot of back and forth about the intrusion of the American government into not only Ecuador but the affairs of Peru, Colombia, Bolivia, etc...the Monroe Doctrine is an aged and archaic policy that America still wants to cling to, the imperialist policies of the 1800's and early 1900's are over and every country should have the right to want to keep foreign military operations and its staffers out of its country, its simply an issue of national sovereignty. I'm not saying its either good or bad that the Americans are there, its up to the government to decide whats best for the country but there are many scandals tied to the American presence in our country, including the rise of STD rates (Okinawa has been a fantastic example to that), the increasing speculation that American presence is tying us closer to Colombia's civil conflict (kind of hard to argue), and the fact that not all the soldiers are angels, many of them have fostered illegitimate kids who they refuse to take care of in the future (great article came out about this a few years back). Ecuador doesn't have a major drug problem, if anything, those billions which are spent on fuel for flyovers and exaggerated salaries for US officials should go instead to fighting drug addictions of the millions of users in the US that are hooked on the stuff being produced, to kill the drug business you have to rehabilitate the users so the demand stops, as whimsical of an idea that is, its the only way to stop the drug traffic because otherwise they'll just keep finding ways to smuggle drugs in making the initiative to be in Ecuador look like a failure, Plan Colombia is a joke. The economic boom I'm speaking of comes straight from venture capitalists who are already buying up parcels of land on the outskirts of Manta and will be selling them to thousands of American retirees who will be coming to Ecuador in the near future to hang up their coats, with that will come a slew of other businesses to bolster the local economy. Manta will survive off its growing port, development of tourism and the influx of Americans who will be moving into those areas in the future. The US does not need to be in Ecuador running military operations, and if it does it should at least be paying us in cold hard cash to do so, not dolling out "aid packages" which are unfunded and take years to get passed through our stingy Senate and Congress back in Washington. The plan for the airport was to have it be a HUB for Asian visitors, both the human and luggage that comes on the planes.
     
  20. loraz

    loraz New Member

    May 12, 2005
    OK my brothers and sisters (if any sisters are here).

    I strongly, I mean strongly advise all Ecuadorians to read a book called, "Confessions of an Economic Hit Mat"

    http://www.amazon.com/Confessions-Economic-Hit-John-Perkins/dp/0452287081

    Maybe then you will understand me when I say "take a step back and see the bigger picture"


    Has anyone read this book? It will catapult you to many many resources instead of this BS Propagand media who is basically owned by your truly.

    Guayquileño, I especially want you to read this. I guarantee that you are going to want to share this with many.
     
  21. LDU4ever

    LDU4ever Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 21, 2004
    Gainesville, FL
    Club:
    Liga de Quito
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador

    I can't believe I didn't remember to cite this book as a source, my dad got it for me last year...awesome book, highly recommended.
     
  22. Guayaquileño

    Guayaquileño Member

    Dec 3, 2006
    New York City
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    From what I read in the Amazon analysis of the book, it sounds very interesting.. I might read it.. but it does not mean that I will change my mind about our current president. I have never said the U.S. was a saint country, for I also have problems with this government.... but like I said, I might read this book.

    Remember corruption is everywhere... the worse kind in developed countries. But out of a need for change, can come a desperate and erred way of trying to achieve it.
     
  23. loraz

    loraz New Member

    May 12, 2005
    Yeah its a good read.

    He wrote a previous book dedicate to Jaime Roldos called "Conscious of a Economic Hitman", but I rather you read "Confessions..." because it includes other countries and sources, hence ,The bigger Picture"

    I hope this book sheds some light to what is really going on. That is, if it is true. I remind everyone here that it is a best seller and for that reason alone I get a bit skeptical pf its authenticity. The information is so strong and jawdropping, that even the author claims that "The Powers that be" tried to stop the publication of "Conscious.."

    Read "Confessions of an Economic Hitman"
    REad it and please tell me what you think...all of you. I can't stress how important it is to have different perspectives regarding this read. Most importantly, I suggest you approach this book with an open mind.
     
  24. Guayaquileño

    Guayaquileño Member

    Dec 3, 2006
    New York City
    Club:
    Barcelona Guayaquil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Loraz, bro. I'll most def read it..... trust me I've read books that have shaken me to my core... and really made me doubt my most intimate convictions and faith.. yes it has happened to me from just reading... and also some other books that are really disturbing and make you think.

    One of these books is called "Behold a Pale Horse" by William Cooper. Eventhough it has some elements of Conspiracy theory attributed to it by some, the author was a genuine and intelligent man, who worked for top gov't. This book is really a soul defying take up. I read it and have no comment on it's accuracy or truth.. but boy it makes you think.
     
  25. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Will definetly have to pick this up for my next business trip (Chicago - in 2 weeks; Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrr)!!!
     

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