Next Camp/Friendlies (Likely Oct. 2020)

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by thedukeofsoccer, Jul 27, 2020.

  1. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Gregg said he was hoping to have friendlies in October and that coincides w/ the int'l window that the preliminary rd of WC qualifying (we aren't a part of) will also be taking place in.

    Discuss all the issues surrounding like roster, xi's, potential opponents, locations, adjustments for covid, etc.; here.
    Eleven Bravo repped this.
  2. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    - Will give us a chance to:

    - get Reyna comfortable and see where he fits in when games matter.
    - find out Weah's recovery. I had him penciled in the xi beforehand.
    - tryout Morris up top in this system w/ underwhelming alternatives.
    - see if Adams & McKennie work as a double-pivot, if Tyler can run the show
    - break Pomykal & Miles in more. They could be starting options for WCQ
    - give A-Rob another shot at LB, going in the doghouse after Jamaica
    - develop better gk options like Horvath & Turner

    Of course we could end up seeing many of the same old, tired faces like Lovitz, S. Johnson, Roldan, Bradley, etc.

    Covid may limit our options, if this is held in Europe or MLS. I'd prefer it would be in Europe coming off Jan. camp. But we shouldn't tie our own hands & make it an exclusive continental-based player camp if we don't have to.
  3. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    United States
    May 4, 2017
    This is a huge let off for Berhalter. He spent all of 2019 on some experiment, that failed, thinking he had this whole half year to pivot. But then the virus ended all international soccer and it looked like he was going to have to start WCQ'ing with a bunch of new players or a bunch of sub-par players he spent all of 2019 playing.

    Now, he has another 11 months to integrate Reyna, ARobinson, Adams, Pomykal, Weah and Holmes.

    I don't know if MLS plays again after MIB, but if the tournament showed anything it is that there are better Americans in MLS than the dreck Gregg played a ton in 2019. Roldan, Bradley, Lovitz, Trapp, Omar, Long have all been pretty terrible or incredibly average and better options are available, just in MLS.
  4. slider4CU

    slider4CU Member

    Borussia Dortmund
    United States
    Apr 12, 2019
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Europe makes sense.
  5. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    First, player pool + picks

    -Zack Steffen (injury - questionable)
    -Brad Guzan
    -Matt Turner
    -Sean Johnson
    -Bill Hamid
    -Ethan Horvath

    Picks: Brad Guzan, Matt Turner, Ethan Horvath

    Comments: I don’t know if Steffen will be healed or not. If he is good to go, then bring him over Brad Guzan. Aside from that, Horvath needs some reps. And it’s time to pick Turner (since there is no one else) and groom him for a move abroad.

    -Sergino Dest*** (for now, counting as a left back)
    -Reggie Cannon
    -DeAndre Yedlin** (declining call ups)
    -Timmy Chandler
    -Aaron Herrera
    -Julian Araujo
    -Shaq Moore
    -Kyle Duncan
    -Joe Scally
    -Keegan Rosenberry

    Picks: Timmy Chandler, Reggie Cannon

    Comments: With Yedlin choosing to refrain from selection, there is a discussion on who should be our de facto right back. For now, we might still need Sergino on the left, especially because I want both Chandler AND Cannon in camp to compete.

    -John Brooks
    -Aaron Long
    -Walker Zimmerman
    -Matt Miazga
    -Chris Richards
    -Erik Palmer-Brown
    -Cameron Carter-Vickers
    -Miles Robinson
    -Mark McKenzie
    -Justen Glad
    -Ventura Alvarado
    -Ike Opara

    Picks: John Brooks, Chris Richards, Ventura Alvarado, Erik Palmer-Brown, Cameron Carter-Vickers

    Comments: Okay, I’m asking to cheat a little on this one and pick 5 center backs. Miazga just missing out - due to his behavioral problems. But it comes down to giving an opportunity to the potential YAs Richards, Alvarado, EPB, and CCV to make their case and challenge the MLS mainstays Long and Zimmerman to play with John Brooks.

    -Sergino Dest** (moved over to the left out of necessity for now)
    -Antonee Robinson
    -Sam Vines
    -Chase Gasper
    -Tim Ream
    -Fabian Johnson
    -Nick Lima
    -Chris Gloster
    -George Bello
    -Nick Hamalainen
    -Kobe Hernandez-Foster
    -Travian Sousa
    -Marco Farfan

    Picks: Sergino Dest, Antonee Robinson

    Comments: All of our hopes, prayers, and good wishes are depending Antonee Robinson become good enough to be a lock down starter for us. At that point, we can move Dest back to the right. So, for the first camp it’s a bit of a mix bag of experimentation with the fullbacks.

    6 and 8 MIDFIELDERS:
    -Weston McKennie
    -Tyler Adams
    -Darlington Nagbe (declines call ups)
    -Alfredo Morales
    -Paxton Pomykal
    -Johnny Cardoso
    -Jackson Yuiell
    -James Sands
    -Chris Durkin
    -Christian Cappis
    -Kellyn Acosta
    -Frankie Amaya
    -Brandon Servania
    -Owen Otasowie
    -Marky Delgado
    -Taylor Booth
    -Cristian Roldan
    -Tanner Tessman

    Picks: Weston McKennie, Tyler Adams, Alfredo Morales, Johnny Cardoso

    Comments: Obviously, we need to get McKennie and Adams as many reps as possible together to build chemistry. The question is who do we bring in as back ups? For this projected October camp, I’d say let’s try out Alfredo Morales and Johnny Cardoso. The MLS guys can wait. And we need to know if we can count on Morales and Johnny.

    -Giovanni Reyna
    -Brenden Aaronson
    -Jesus Ferreira
    -Sebastian Lletget
    -Richard Ledezma
    -Julian Green
    -Gianluca Busio
    -Djordje Mihailovic
    -Malik Tillman (prefers Germany)
    -Matko Miljevic
    -Emo Hyndman
    -Cole Bassett

    Picks: Giovanni Reyna, Brenden Aaronson

    Comments: Obviously, we want to see Reyna. But who should back him up? As far as I’m concerned, the streaky Lletget has been playing himself off the line-up. And Aaronson has been playing himself in the roster in a big way. There’s some others to consider, but they can wait their turn.

    -Christian Pulisic
    -Jordan Morris
    -Duane Holmes
    -Uly Llanez
    -Konrad de la Fuente
    -Indiana Vassilev
    -Tyler Boyd
    -Paul Arriola (injured)
    -Chris Mueller
    -Emmanuel Sabbi
    -Jonathan Lewis
    -Niko Gioachinni
    -Sebastian Saucedo

    Picks: Christian Pulisic, Jordan Morris, Duane Holmes, Chris Mueller

    Comments: I’m taking a bit of a reverse strategy on this one. Although I want to see Uly, Konrad, Vassilev, etc. I’m okay with waiting to make sure they get time to break in with their club. And that gives an opportunity for Holmes and Mueller.

    -Josh Sargent
    -Tim Weah (Injured)
    -Jozy Altidore
    -Gyasi Zardes
    -Ayo Akinola
    -Jeremy Ebobisse
    -Jordan Siebatcheu (France? Good enough?)
    -Andrija Novakovich
    -Bobby Wood
    -Sebastian Soto
    -Ricardo Pepi
    -Folarin Bolagun (England?)
    -Robbie Robinson
    -Mason Toye
    -Malick Sanogo
    -Charlie Kelman

    Picks: Josh Sargent, Ayo Akinola, Jeremy Ebobisse

    Comments: Okay, I’m cheating again, but Josh Sargent is the main man, and then it comes down to the most in form striker. Right now, Ebobisse and Akinola seem to be a race for that position.

    GK Guzan (Steffen), Horvath, Turner
    RB Cannon, Chandler
    CB Brooks, 3x (EPB, CCV, Alvarado, Miazga, Richards - I’ll say EPB, Alvarado, Richards for now)
    LB Dest, Robinson
    MF McKennie, Adams, Johnny, Morales
    AM Reyna, Aaronson
    RW Morris, Mueller
    LW Pulisic, Holmes
    FW Sargent, Akinola/Ebobisse

    Captain: McKennie

    -Really, just getting the group of the future together and getting everyone on the same page. Mainly, get the key players - Pulisic, McKennie, Adams, Brooks, Dest, Sargent, and Reyna - and giving them reps.
    -Trying out Dest at LB and RB, and giving Antonee a shot.
    -Trying our some guys on the fringe, such as Johnny, Morales, etc.
    -Can we play smooth, attractive soccer? We have been devastated by injuries in 2019 and demoralization before that. For the first camp, I’d keep it simple. Let’s start to show the world that we came to play. Make fans believe we have heart again. That means more than any tactical approach. Can we compete for every ball? Can we go hard for 90+ minutes? Can our guys play as a team? That’s what we want to see in this first camp back.
    -Moving forward, let’s take what we learn from this camp and get ready for the games that count.
    sXeWesley, Boysinblue and 2in10 repped this.
  6. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    Hard to know what to expect with COVID. If we host games in the US, will players be required to quarantine upon their return to Europe? How will that affect their availability? If we play in Europe, will our domestic guys even be allowed to travel there? I'm not sure the ethical considerations of trying to get players from Europe where things seem much more under control to come to the US where infections are rampant. Considering most of the guys who we really need to integrate are already playing in Europe, to me the most sensible option in less than three months when COVID will most likely still be widespread and not likely under control in the US, would be a European camp. But, I fear if COVD does throw a wrench into travel plans, USSF may be more likely to just hold a domestic camp, which could be pretty disastrous for integrating our top players before qualifiers officially start. I'm looking forward to the days we get to see the team get together again, but this isn't likely to be straightforward.
  7. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    United States
    May 12, 2019
    Since we almost certainly will not be allowed to have fans in October in the US (or anywhere), the US should take the opportunity to do a European camp.

    There's no revenue option here. So no good reason to stay in the US. Aside from maybe if Europe won't let in the coaching staff.
    nobody repped this.
  8. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    United States
    May 4, 2017
    I'd expect the games to be in Europe. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if they aren't just Wales and the Netherlands.
  9. therendxela

    therendxela Member

    Queens Park Rangers
    United States
    Jul 25, 2020
    Berhalter just said on the ESPN broadcast of Portland and Cincinnati that he expects October to be a domestic window and that November will be in Europe. I am not really sure how a domestic window would work because coming to play in America in the current atmosphere with COVID will not be a particularly appealing prospect to most nations or likely even Americans playing in Europe
  10. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    United States
    May 4, 2017
    I was thinking the same. It is a few months away, but it would either be an all MLS squad against some team like Honduras. But, our only game this year was that. Just seems foolish to schedule something that would have to be cancelled. Hard to envision any European player coming to it. Which would make is a waste of time.
  11. mattjo

    mattjo Member+

    Feb 3, 2001
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    well actually Just having the camp is probably as if not more valuable than either of these matches would be. The players haven’t been able to get together which can prove problematic later for gelling. Additionally, we have a lot of young Talent that folks pencil in their starting XI but a lot of that is speculative. We have some proven top end young talent and a lot of talent that frankly is still pretty unknown on how their careers will pan out. But honestly, given the situation, I figure the camps are more valuable than the subsequent matches at this point.
  12. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    United States
    May 4, 2017
    Even if the camp was more important, what use is a camp without Pulisic, Adams, McKennie, Brooks, Ream, Robinson, Miazga, Holmes, Boyd, Sargent, Weah, Steffan, Horvath, etc.?

    If anything, having a camp in Europe would make sense.

    If MLS is not playing, although I know they are going to try, then you can have a camp anytime in the US. You don't need a FIFA window.
  13. mattjo

    mattjo Member+

    Feb 3, 2001
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    well they said they were looking at one in Europe and one in the US. There are tons of reasons to look at players in camp. Part is gelling. Part is Accommodating new players to the NATs. Some of it is player evaluation. It is not ideal but it is about adapting to the circumstances. Who knows if these camps could even take place now anyway. I wonder if the staff and players would qualify under Annex Two #11 of the exceptions to the current travel ban.
    gogorath repped this.
  14. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    To include everyone, they most likely need two camps with ongoing COVID travel restrictions. The first, domestic camp doesn't seem nearly as necessary to me since such a disproportionate number of chances have fallen to MLS guys anyway a this point. But, Berhalter's lineups point out that he may feel more chances for his MLS favorites are still necessary and there are some young MLS guys who still haven't been included. The camp in Europe for me is the important one as that's where our top player play and those are also includes the players we've missed through injuries. Without MLS players filling out most of the roster, that camp should allow for more places for lower league player who haven't gotten looked at yet. All the real work this team needs to focus on leans heavily toward getting the European players more involved.
    CZM4 and Patrick167 repped this.
  15. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    FC Dallas
    Yup. Exactly.
    Travel between continental Europe and the US is restricted right now. Hard to plan for any camp in which both European-based and US-based players are present. And who knows what the situation will be like in October?

    I mean, let's be clear. Gregg Berhalter would not be able to travel from the US to Germany in order to conduct a camp. As of July 29th. Maybe there's somebody over there (Steve Cherunolo?) that can conduct a camp?

    If this camp were to happen today it would be a logistical nightmare. I wonder if 75% of the team would opt out.
  16. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Having the camps on different continents means the groupings on both will get involved between them, regardless if there are travel restrictions.

    But we maybe could get an integrated domestic/abroad squad @ both places, given we choose the country/state & players will all be tested beforehand.

    W/ that in mind, this would be my roster(s) for the camps:

    fw: Morris, Pulisic, Weah, Altidore, Sargent, Zardes, Akinola, Mueller, Boyd

    cm's: Reyna, Lletget, Pomykal, Aaronson, Holmes, McKennie, Adams, Yueill

    fb's: Dest, Cannon, Yedlin, A. Robinson, Arriola

    cb's: Brooks, Long, M. Robinson, Miazga, Sands, EPB

    gk's: Steffen, Horvath, Guzan, Turner

    Those are my priorities. Everyone else is a bonus. List could expand/contract depending upon if everyone is on the table, or they're fully split groups.
  17. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    United States
    May 4, 2017
    I think Gregg could get there. You can enter the EU with a negative test result if you are traveling for business, I believe.

    We wasted a year waiting for Gregg. He wasted a year on his silly club soccer approach. Then we lost half a year to Covid. Now, we are going to wait another 5 months to have a camp with the most important players? Because we can't figure a way to do it?

    Evan Rotundo and Kobe Hernandez Foster somehow got into the EU. Pulisic came back and forth. Earnie himself has an EU passport and could go. This is not hard.
    Guinho, CZM4 and Eleven Bravo repped this.
  18. Konut

    Konut Member+

    May 31, 2010
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I like all of your points. I would like to see a line up like this rolled out for one of the friendlies:


    Essentially mixing the lock starters with the youngsters that we're all rooting for.

    The biggest X factor here is Weah. We have no idea if he'll be healthy, or what his form will be. I've watched some of his highlight videos recently, and it reminded me how much potential he has. If there are some complications with him, I'd like to see Holmes given a start on the RW.
    Three and Three and thedukeofsoccer repped this.
  19. mattjo

    mattjo Member+

    Feb 3, 2001
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is the specific business exception. You can’t just automatically go, even with a clean test. The test is required IF you are deemed essential. Now individual countries may determine soccer players essential workers for friendlies but it is not a guarantee. Individual countries Can interpret the exceptions as they wish.

    If any of our coaches and staff have duel coaches citizenship, they would also be able to travel to Europe. Another alternative is the UK, although I believe there will be a mandatory 14 day quarantine there. Of course this could all change if we get our own house in order.

    1. Workers: Highly qualified third-country workers if their employment is necessary from an economic perspective and the work cannot be postponed or performed abroad.
  20. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    Close. Sargent in for Morris, Morris shifted down for Weah (who hasn't shown the ability to stay healthy yet, much less earn a starting spot on the team).

    I also am starting to wonder if Long is our new Bradley. Hasn't been good in two years, apparently, was not good in the most recent tournament, but will continue being inked into the starting lineup because, well, I have no idea. CCV looks in form, Miazga is there, shoot I was very impressed with McKenzie last night. Not even considering Richards, who apparently has been promoted to Bayern's first team and will be with them in the Champions League. We have enough average options (which Long is as well), but at least some of these other guys have more upside.
    Three and Three, CZM4 and Patrick167 repped this.
  21. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    United States
    May 4, 2017
    Seeing the large amount of American and other nationality personnel playing and coaching soccer in Europe, it certainly seems like it has been deemed essential. Obviously, Gio Reyna cannot telecommute from NYC to Dortmund games. Can Gregg coach the team from Chicago via Zoom? I don't think so.
  22. Konut

    Konut Member+

    May 31, 2010
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ehh, I even put in the post that Weah is the X factor, but I guess we shouldn't be penciling him in anywhere without him having recent games under his belt. I'm fine going with what you said, but if Weah has gotten some minutes and is playing decently well I might want to see him start come October.

    I also agree that the 2nd CB spot is highly contested. I see M Robinson, CCV and Richards as the main 3 pushing for the position. Hopefully one of them develops some real form early next season.
    yurch10 repped this.
  23. mattjo

    mattjo Member+

    Feb 3, 2001
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Gio (and all other US players under contract to teams playing in the Schengen zone) is considered a resident of Germany because he works there. Greg does not. He works in the United States. The law is based on residency.

    It is possible that Greg may get an exception, but the comparison you just made is irrelevant under the EU legal requirements.

    again I am not trying to be contrarian but I am reading the actual legal requirements. (As somebody who has spent half my professional life Overseas doing exactly that).
  24. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    United States
    May 4, 2017
    Gregg would be there on business. He is not on vacation. He can get in.

    Evan Rotundo just moved to Germany. He was not a resident. Same with KHF and Kayo. Pro sports is a business and exempt. Including international pro sports.

    USSF can try and have camps here, but they are not forced to.
  25. Sebsasour

    Sebsasour Member+

    New Mexico United
    May 26, 2012
    Albuquerque NM
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    His plan is to have an October camp here and a November camp in Europe, but it would seem wise to reverse those. Everyone in Europe is booked in November except for San Marino and Liechtenstein. On top of that so are African and Asian teams if you wanted to play a neutral site European game against them.

    October gives you a bit more wiggle room (though travel restrictions may still be in place and limit options), and you can just play CONCACAF teams in November.

    We'll see though, I'm sure The USSF will find a way to get 4 opponents.
    HomietheClown repped this.

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