Nats/Tri post game: Sportsmanship

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by Brushes Sand, Feb 7, 2008.

  1. Brushes Sand

    Brushes Sand Member

    Oct 12, 2000
    polychronicqatsitime
    If the mods feel this doesn't belong here, so be it.

    I saw something tonight I've never ever seen before, in 22 years
    of watching this fixture.

    Sportsmanship.

    On the part of Mexico.

    Actually helping our guys up off the ground. TWICE that I saw.

    I mean, dear gawd, shoot me now: Rafa Marquez shaking hands with,
    while *smiling*, and exchanging a moment with Altidore. The
    Event Horizon is in view.

    The aliens have landed. Timewave Zero has sined and cosined
    4 years early. The Aztec calendar must actually be on Ethiopian time.

    Beelezebub has a devil put aside for me.

    Cazart.

    -bs
     
  2. MLSNHTOWN

    MLSNHTOWN Member+

    Oct 27, 1999
    Houston, TX

    For the most part it was a well played game by both sides. One note though is Howard got a tackle in on him on a simple ball that the forward (De Nigris I believe) had no right to even attempt to tackle away from him. Other than that it was a well played game.
     
  3. Mexcellence

    Mexcellence Member+

    Oct 12, 2007
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    De Nigris

    [​IMG]
     
  4. DonJuego

    DonJuego Member+

    Aug 19, 2005
    Austin, TX
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Post-game the teams shook hands, which was new and improved. Overall, the sportsmanship is improving. There was the Tim Howard incident in the second half -- I bet TV missed it but there it looked like Howard and a Mex ST nearly fought.

    However, in the totally bs bush-league material was Mexico's horrible sportsmanship stunt in the first half. Howard collected the ball and collided with Bocanegra. Bocanegra was shook up and Howard threw the ball out-of-bounds.

    Rather than return the ball to Howard like good sportsmen Mexico decided to take advantage of the situation and give the US a throw-in deep in the defensive half -- pinning the US in the corner. That is the sort of non-emotion driven poor sportsmanship that I detest.
     
  5. radmonkey

    radmonkey Member

    Oct 27, 2007
    *Devils advocate* You know I bet some mexican fans would point, they could have kept the ball and not given it back at all. Now that...would have been bush league. Besides, you should know that most of the world engage and value gamemanship more than sportsmanship.
    Sportmanship is really a relic of the upper-class amateur roots of soccer (and athletics, arguably) in England. It never really took hold as the game spread into working-class slums and became the power it is today.
    Although it is a big part of of the American mindset, specially with soccer. I mainly blame AYSO though. You see more gamemanship in other American sports, especially baseball. Taking the 2nd basemen out to break up a double play, throwing a high heater to back a batter off the plate, stealing signs, hidden ball trick, spit balls and etc. Basically, if you don't get caught, it's not cheating.
    While in some cultures, American style pregame trash talk is considered a bigger offense than bending the rules on the field (It sorta explains why Zidane vs Materazzi).
    I mean, it's really a cultural misunderstanding more than anything. It's on par with you eating McD's in Mumbai. It doesn't make you an evil person or a bad person, but people around you won't get it.
    Honestly, it's not like either team is scoring "hand of god goals". I saw it as DeNigris trying to prove he's one of the guys and possibly make a name of himself.
    I was pretty shocked myself, I thought I was the only one crazy enough to do that and that's only when I play Winning Eleven on a XBox. Pretty ballsy move since he could have easily gotten a yellow or even a red, depending on the Ref. Howard should have pulled a Dida and fished for a card, instead of fighting back.
     
  6. FirstStar

    FirstStar Hustlin' for the USA

    Fulham Football Club
    Feb 1, 2005
    Time's Arrow
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not being humiliated 2-0 really improved their sportsmanship. Pretty simple explination.
     
  7. ChrisSSBB

    ChrisSSBB Member+

    Jun 22, 2005
    DE
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    radmonkey said, "Devils advocate* You know I bet some mexican fans would point, they could have kept the ball and not given it back at all. Now that...would have been bush league. Besides, you should know that most of the world engage and value gamemanship more than sportsmanship.
    Sportmanship is really a relic of the upper-class amateur roots of soccer (and athletics, arguably) in England. It never really took hold as the game spread into working-class slums and became the power it is today."

    Soccer in England has not been known to be an upper class sport although it's roots were borne from the public schools, universities, etc. The saying is that in England, soccer is a gentleman's game played by hooligans while rugby is known as a hooligan's game played by gentleman.

    They gave the ball back, so, fair play to them.
     
  8. alocksley

    alocksley Member

    Jan 30, 2004
    Burbank, CA
    [​IMG]
     
  9. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    I don't know. I thought the whole game was played at a very high level with good sportsmanship to boot. Yes there was the Howard-De Negris incident, but overall I was happy with the way the two teams went about their business. It's never going to be a smooch-fest.

    There really was a new generation of players out there for this one. Gio, Villaluz, Vela, Adu, Altidore, Bradley, Feilhaber, etc. Perhaps the days of stupidity are over. Let the young ones lead us!!!
     
  10. FakeFlopper

    FakeFlopper Member

    Jul 21, 2005
    Austin, Tx
    Yup, soccer and the american culture of sports doesn't mix well. All the diving that people generally do and the fake "I'm shot" pain clinching acting would never do here. Not that we are above all that, but I think the US would have a harder time accepting a "hand of God" type win than some other people. But hell, Donovan's right though, it's just a game to us, but much more to world.
     
  11. shorty88

    shorty88 New Member

    Jun 20, 2007
    philly/hartford
    If they had lost it probably would've been the same as always
     
  12. LetsGoYanks

    LetsGoYanks Member

    Jul 23, 2005
    Dirty South
    As long as we don't kick their ass they're great sports. :rolleyes:
     
  13. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    While I agree with you, I'm not sure it would have made a difference. All Howard would have done was punt the ball as far as he could anyway. Might as well throw it in and have a defender kick the ball as far as he can.
     
  14. wooglin12

    wooglin12 Member

    Mar 26, 2005
    Birmingham, AL
    Club:
    Reading FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It probably helped that Jozy owned Rafa on the header... and has two inches and 10 years on him. Maybe a combo of respect and fear.
     
  15. JediMindTricks

    Jun 20, 2006
    Houston
    there definitely seemed to be more sportsmanship than before.

    i was sitting (or standing, rather) at the other side of the field from the howard incident so i missed what initiated it. but after that, there was a minor scuffle on the other side of the field.

    and for those that were at the game, did anyone catch the fight outside the stadium? jeez. looked like 4-5 mexico fans beating up one USA fan. then you walk over and see a huddle of people standing over one guy that was knocked out on the ground.
     
  16. Scotty

    Scotty Member+

    Dec 15, 1999
    Toscana
    A bit on the Altidore-Marquez exchange at the end of the game:

    http://sports.yahoo.com/sow/news?slug=ro-altidore020608&prov=yhoo&type=lgns
     
  17. Father Ted

    Father Ted BigSoccer Supporter

    Manchester United, Galway United, New York Red Bulls
    Nov 2, 2001
    Connecticut
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    I doubt the Mexicans would have been so nice after the game if Donovan had knicked a winner in the last minute....
     
  18. Maximum Optimal

    Maximum Optimal Member+

    Jul 10, 2001
    So has the Altidore to Barca speculation started on Yanks Abroad?
     
  19. futgod

    futgod Member+

    Nov 28, 2006
    NorCal
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    Jozy was unmarked so he didnt own Rafa. Rafa throughout the game shut Jozy out, which is understandable he is world class.

    Do you really think Rafa who plays against the best in the world is going to fear Jozy just cuz he scored one goal. I do think he respects him though and i was also surprised on how friendly mexico was during and after the game.

    What I dont like is Magallon exchanging jerseys with Donovan. This is a rivalry and and jerseys should never be exchanged between rivals. This is law in Mexico, you wont see Chivas exchanging jerseys with America or Atlas. If you guys want to see this watch Chivas/Atlas this weekend and youll see this isnt unsportsman like but respect for the fans who love and hate their rivals.
     
  20. Geneva

    Geneva LA for Life

    Feb 5, 2003
    Southern Cal
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I agree, until we beat them & we see a decent reaction from Mexico, we can't conclude it's a changing tide. But perhaps Hugo's team is settling in & will improve their attitude. I thought they played a lot better this year than they did last - which is ominous for us.
     
  21. kjksccr

    kjksccr Member

    Feb 25, 1999
    San Carlos, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Most forwards can make quite a living scoring "just one goal" against players like Marquez. I wish we had a shot of Marquez on his knees earlier in the game desperately pushing Altidore on a free header when he was badly beaten. Should have been a penalty.

    In my view, in the last few games things have been a bit more professional from both teams. They are nowhere near as bad as 2001 and before. I do think the Mexican players respect the US much more than they used to (as they should based on results).
     
  22. Geneva

    Geneva LA for Life

    Feb 5, 2003
    Southern Cal
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is why Mexican players act the way they do, their fans expect it.
     
  23. dfwtinman

    dfwtinman New Member

    Apr 17, 2006

    Are you quite certain Magalllon doesn't have in mind using Donovan's jersey as an effigy?


    :p
     
  24. Dantezo

    Dantezo Member

    Sep 15, 2000
    Jeonju, S. Korea
    Exactly - just watch what happens when they receive their next Dos a Cero... they will behave the same as usual.
     
  25. Carcacha

    Carcacha Member+

    Apr 12, 2007
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    thats professional soccer for you bud. Rafa plays against class forwards game in and game out. The goal Jozy scored was good, he was unmarked and scored as was expected, he didnt necessarily school Rafa. Aside from the goal, Jozy never had the ball to even create chances
     

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