Mueller indictment thread

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by superdave, Oct 28, 2017.

  1. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    And still unexplained is the Republican party platform change in regards to Ukraine. Just a quick Google says it was in the Steele dossier:


    POLITICS
    Explosive memos suggest that a Trump-Russia quid pro quo was at the heart of the GOP's dramatic shift on Ukraine

    The dossier's claim about a Ukraine-WikiLeaks quid pro quo alleges that Trump would refrain from speaking forcefully, if at all, during the 2016 presidential campaign about Russia's 2014 incursion into eastern Ukraine. In return, Russia would provide WikiLeaks the documents it stole from the Democratic National Committee.

    Throughout the campaign, Trump broke from traditional GOP orthodoxy and established himself as the most sympathetic Republican candidate toward Russia, stressing a need to work with the country on various geopolitical issues.


    http://www.businessinsider.com/trump-gop-policy-ukraine-wikileaks-dnc-2017-1
     
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  2. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Any LE stirrings in Alexandria tonight?
     
  3. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    CNN/NYT reporting Manafart and an associate to surrender today
     
  4. American Brummie

    Jun 19, 2009
    There Be Dragons Here
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    The most likely outcome, the least interesting one.
     
  5. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Wonder what they'll be charged with. Assume financial crimes at 1st blush.

    Rick Gates is the other person. Worked on campaign too.
     
  6. American Brummie

    Jun 19, 2009
    There Be Dragons Here
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    Birmingham City FC
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    United States
    Mueller's plan isn't to send Manafort to prison forever, it's to get him to cough up bigger fish.

    Let's be serious. Manafort was the campaign manager to Donald Trump's campaign. And he's been indicted by the special prosecutor investigating collusion between Russia and the Trump campaign. If this were only financial crimes, Mueller would have likely turned that over to the FBI to handle.
     
  7. dark knight

    dark knight Super Moderator
    Staff Member

    Dec 15, 1999
    Club:
    Leicester City FC
    I think it's pretty interesting.
     
  8. American Brummie

    Jun 19, 2009
    There Be Dragons Here
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    Birmingham City FC
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    I should have been more clear. On a scale of 1-100, Manafort's indictment is an 80. Flynn would have been an 85. Kushner a 95. All really exciting, but we all kind knew Manafort was coming.
     
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  9. beerslinger23

    beerslinger23 Member+

    Jun 26, 2010
    In Trump's own 2011 book, Time to Get Tough, Trump said:
    "Putin has big plans for Russia. He wants to edge out its neighbors so that Russia can dominate oil supplies to all of Europe. Putin has also announced his grand vision: the creation of a 'Eurasian Union' made up of former Soviet nations that can dominate the region."




    Not just Manafort but Rick Gates the lobbyist for Russian interests who might turn out to be the link that really blows this up. He was working for Trump even after Manafort left. He was in the white house, probably still helping to ensure the Russian agenda is being carried out as last as March if I am reading this correctly. Some say summer but that's speculation.

    Today is the beginning of the end.
     
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  10. usscouse

    usscouse BigSoccer Supporter

    May 3, 2002
    Orygun coast
    I was hoping for Kushner first. Just imagine the Panic in the White House.
    Mueller likes to build it up though.
     
  11. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Still big shoe to drop. Who changed position on Ukraine in platform and why did Republican establishment allow it?
     
  12. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    June meeting attendees all have to be sweatin. Which Trump kid was there? Beavis or Butthead?
     
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  13. Boloni86

    Boloni86 Member+

    Jun 7, 2000
    Baltimore
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    DC United
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    Gibraltar
    Has that "conspiracy against the US" charge been confirmed? For me that would be the biggest news. Makes it harder for right wing propaganda (they still will try) to claim that these people are being rounded up for traffic tickets.

    The even bigger question now is at what point does Mueller make a public statement to congress. Is this a milestone, the final destinstion or yet to be determined pending more investigation?
     
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  14. American Brummie

    Jun 19, 2009
    There Be Dragons Here
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    United States
    Given how little attention Trump pays to details, it'd be very easy to see Manafort suggesting it, Kushner giving it the green light without asking why, and nobody big any the wiser. That's not the big question.

    The big question is what Paul Manafort promised the Russians for whom he was laundering money when he became campaign manager.
     
  15. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
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    Yeah, that jumped out at me too. What's the difference between that and treason?
     
  16. usscouse

    usscouse BigSoccer Supporter

    May 3, 2002
    Orygun coast
    The death penalty?
     
  17. American Brummie

    Jun 19, 2009
    There Be Dragons Here
    Club:
    Birmingham City FC
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    United States
    This is conspiracy to defraud the US Treasury. Not conspiracy to undermine the US or anything like that.

    But since we take tax evasion seriously, it has a long, hefty sentence. Moreover, any of Manafort's wealth will be confiscated, meaning his planned inheritance will be zero. He's gonna go for a plea deal to help out his kids, IMO.
     
  18. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Go soft on Russia, we'll give you $$ and Hillary dirt. June Trump Tower meeting. If you win you ease the sanctions
     
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  19. beerslinger23

    beerslinger23 Member+

    Jun 26, 2010
    The Ukrainian-Manafort-Trump syndicate

     
  20. Father Ted

    Father Ted BigSoccer Supporter

    Manchester United, Galway United, New York Red Bulls
    Nov 2, 2001
    Connecticut
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  21. Boloni86

    Boloni86 Member+

    Jun 7, 2000
    Baltimore
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Gibraltar
    I'm impressed at how resilient right wing propaganda is today. They take it in stride without blinking. They've already decided that the next shoe to drop is someone in Clinton camp.

    Just like when that email chain was exposed showing actual evidence, the following week the polls didn't move at all. I'll be shocked if Trump approval drops 1% by next week ... He's at 37% today which is tied for the low point in his presidency. There's been so little movement in his numbers in recent months that I assume this is his floor. That 37% will engage in altetnate reality propaganda permanently, completely detached from unfolding events.
     
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  22. dark knight

    dark knight Super Moderator
    Staff Member

    Dec 15, 1999
    Club:
    Leicester City FC
    It's days like these it's fun to read how crazy some of Trump's fans are #breitbartcomments

     
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  23. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    Yes, 37% is the bottom, unless the economy tanks. In which case the bottom will be considerably less, because faith in The Leader tends to be shaken when jobs aren't available.
     
  24. NGV

    NGV Member+

    Sep 14, 1999
    i think there's a strong possibility that it was Manafort's doing.

    The interesting thing about the switch to the Ukraine platform plank is that it was so substantively unimportant. Party platforms in the US are essentially meaningless in general - nobody pays much attention to them, and they don't have much impact on anything. That irrelevance is the answer to the question of "why did the Republican establishment allow it."

    So, if platforms are insignificant, why bother to intervene to change one?

    Maybe because the audience for that change was Russian, and was not necessarily aware that US political party platforms are insignificant. If you're trying to prove your usefulness to a Russian paymaster while not attracting undue attention, engineering a pro-Russia change in your political party's platform might be just the thing.
     
  25. dark knight

    dark knight Super Moderator
    Staff Member

    Dec 15, 1999
    Club:
    Leicester City FC
    Surely Sessions will be fired now. The crazies are going to be calling for his head big time.
     

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