That's exactly the problem. He reacts that way to every situation that doesn't go his way and it impacts his performance and the performance of the team as a whole. Seems to me he's pretty good at helping us lose, too. I would rather have missed the playoffs without Hristo than wash out of the playoffs the way we did with him.
This is misleading too. While Hristo had "great per-minute numbers", he drug down everyone else on the field's chance to get those numbers instead. He played too wide, leaving a forward stranded who couldn't get points-per-minute. -- He just stood there half the time when he gave the ball away over-and-over so some midfielder or two had to go play defense for him and couldn't get points-per-minute. Other than one or two hard shots, one or two good passes and 3 actual runs per game, the guy was a total liability on the field. I wish I had a dollar for every time I yelled at him from the front row to shut the *#*#*#*#*#*# up and play, or stop sucking and pass the ball better. And he should have been red-carded in half the games he was in before he ever got a point for actually grabbing referees. I hate refs, but you can't let players touch them! Let GrillMaster and Dave Brother attack them after the game, sure
No, I'm not saying he's wrong. At all. I'm saying he played a part in the incident by going up to him. I didn't see the incident-as Knave reported-but I heard a description. Convey should know what he's doing trying to stop a guy that's hot (remember Stoitch is playing the team that dumped him and Stoitch and Dema were arguing w/Razov). At that point the game was over and Stoitch was being a poor sport. Doesn't make a difference if he's a poor sport or not-we still lost-he felt he needed to release his frustration at getting beat so bad especially by his old team. Like I said, poor sport. I could be wrong-but if I am and you want to sue me, my lawyer is Johnny Cochran you won't win So, if Hristo comes back next year, I don't. My wallet is the only vote I get. It's not an election. And like the Rolling Stones song says "You can't always get what you want...but you get what you need" I say what you need to do is support DC United no matter what. Even if some front office decisions don't go your way. Don't babies cry to their mothers/fathers (Zack, Kaspar, etc) when they don't get what they want? Not to suggest it's at that primitive level, you are doing it w/some kind of conscience/"image" thing and not just your individual needs, just saying I think you oughta deal w/it and not run away-think about the whole team not just Stoitchkov, you'd be giving up on them, and the fans too, and MLS soccer in the US I don't give a rat's ass whether you approve or not I'm not expecting you to, and I'd rather you not give a rat's ass whether I approve or not. Just talking.
I personally would agree with that if it were an isolated incident, but it's the pattern of behavior displayed by Hristo and MAE in regard to the ref and opponents and teammates that I think runs counter to the interest of the team in that c'mon, does anybody believe that the kind of dissent and abuse heaped on refs doesn't affect how a game is called? Let alone suspensions for accumulated caution points takes the focus of United players off the field...maybe not the others, but playing with 10 or 9 people paying attention is not optimal adversely affects the team dynamic. Hey, it takes 11 guys playing together, and it seems obvious that several of their teammates (Convey, Stewart, Nelsen) ain't down for that crap And you know what, it's coming from the 2 guys whose talent is undeniably declining.
I'm an *#*#*#*#*#*#*# when I play and watch soccer. There's a little bit of hairy chested Bulgarian in me when I watch or play in a match...doing stupid sh!t time and time again. Here are a few examples: - during a rec league match back in 1997/98, our team was down two goals late in the second half. A ball went out of bounds for the other team's favor, and I was closest to it. Instead of picking it up and handing it to the guy who'd been hacking me most of the game with impunity, I toe-poked it down a hill into a ravine. Sure, it took the guy the better part of 3 minutes to climb the 100 yards down and back, we lost the game by a goal, and my time wasting probably cost us the match...but that felt good at the time. I think Hristo did something similar to this in the past game with his rather odd behavior. - I was asked to leave more than one rec team in my day for basically riding everybody's a$$ for most of the season for their lack of physical fitness, aggression, experience, etc. I think we have all seen Hristo doing something similar to this umpteen times this season. - I once got into a shoving and shouting match with Oscar for basically nothing him egging me on to cheer on the team. I could see Hristo doing this too. - Just a few weeks ago, I cussed out one of the most faithful United supporters there is for a disagreement over Marco Etcheverry. I believe that Hristo might have reacted like me in this case also. I'm basically a first class a$$ in most ways. But here is where I think that I differ from Mr. Stoichkov: I know when I am a cancer to the team/supporter's group and make myself scarce or apologize and make amends. In the case of Hristo that we are discussing, the question is not as Mr. Budwizer is suggesting "whether fans want to cheer for politically correct players," but rather, whether Hristo is a cancer to the team or not. The only evidence we as observers have is (1) the results of the team and (2) the incidents we see on the field or TV. I think it is painfully obvious that Mr. Stoichkov is not operating as a successful team player or coach. For the record, I personally think that Bobby needs a few swift kicks in the a$$ not shoves in the chest, as he has been one of the major reasons DC United underperformed at the end of the season. Regardless, there is no evidence to me that Stoichkov is contributing to good end results for DC United. As such, the entire coaching staff needs the boot, him included. If anyone could arrange a trade for Bobby, that would be appreciated too. Tim
If that's true-if he was dragging everyone else down-then how did he get 5 assists? And...were we THAT much worse when was on the field? I wish I had a dollar for every time I yelled at him from the front row to shut the *#*#*#*#*#*# up and play TOTALLY reminds me of that guy I talked about! We called him "The Mouth". Man oh man-he just wouldn't stop letting people hear it! I agree he's got to stop w/the referees, and give that job over to others (like you said GrillMaster and Brother). I agree totally. And the coach, or someone on the team, needs to get him under control when he's bitching w/the refs-that didn't happen-and yeah that's a problem that should be addressed.
The issue isn't the shove by itself. It's the history--culminating in the shove. Let's use an analogy. Dan Quayle (before cameras) tells a school kid he's mis-spelled "potato". Why did he get so much grief over it when other political candidates (like Bob Kerrey or Bob Dole or Bill Clinton) mis-spell words or mis-state words? It's b/c most of the others had more life experience, weren't perceived as callow or had some kind of a track record (Clinton's academic performance, Kerry's CMOH, Dole's war record, etc.) so you write it off as an abberation. Stoichkov has a history of "losing it." Even one of his more tolerant coaches (Cruyff) indicated that. And this it seems to have been a particular issue. Further more, a number of more than credible observers (Ed M., Ian P., Steve G.) have talked publicly about how this team spends a lot of time "losing it", whinning at the refs, not focusing on the match, getting distracted. Games-manshipwise, there are some times I must cynically admit that you yell at the ref (to buy time, intimidate the ref, set an example for teammates that you stand up for them, set up a future call). Sure, one can rationalize some of that. But this team doesn't do those things well (other than win PKs). As a team we stop playing and start arguing. Convey afterwards indicated he was trying to tell Stoichkov "let's focus on the match--get your head in the game!" and he got shoved down. Obviously Stoichkov's judgment was wrong in this situation. I have problems with his shove. But it's more than a shove of a teammate that earned a card in a playoff match (and if we had somehow advanced, do you think all the cards we'd earned in those two matches would be a factor? You bet they would--we'd be talked about "stupid players" who've endangered eligiblity for semis or finals). What this shove (for Stoichkov) is, is a season where he's been almost out of control. For an assistant coach, that's especially bad.
You're right. It isn't an election. Nor is it a religion or a charity. DC United is a for-profit business which provides entertainment in exchange for a fee. Well, I haven't been entertained lately. Not even a little bit. For the first time since 1997 I might not have DCU season tickets. That makes me sad to think about but last weekend made me even more sad. Unless they take steps to improve their product I'll find something else to do with my $500. See, this is America and that's how it works.
Silly me, I thought DC United was my religion! My main problem with Hristo is that he is an A$$istant coach as well as a player. An assistant coach should not be shoving players. Of course, when the assistant coach sees the coach shoving players, he probably thinks it is okay. Heck, we should get the General Manager to shove the coach and assistant coaches every once in a while. As long as shoves are flying we should get the President of DC United (or whatever his title is)shoving the General Manager too. We should turn DC United into a WWF franchise! NOT!
I don't care how you guys work this out, just don't give the rat's ass to me. I have no desire to receive a rat's ass.
Hristo's violent reactions have always been "the problem." These reactions are both physical and verbal -- and no I'm not referring to an incident in DC and no I can't disclose my source. I'll just say that Hristo has a history of physical and verbal violence not only toward refs, which is public knowledge, but also toward teammates. After 20 years of people trying to "get him under control," I think we can safely say that it just isn't going to happen.
Understood.....he did himself a great disservice w/the Convey shove to end the season. Major damage to his public reputation. Now Goff reports he might be gone, and where's he gonna go? I'ts like a Geico commerical. "Hristo, you've been fired. We don't have a place for you in MLS anymore. But I've got good news." Hristo-"What's that?" "BarbDett is going to renew her season ticket."
Of course, with all this talk about a "rat's ass" and watching Stoichkov's rear end, it adds new meaning to "Behind--the game". ; )