Monday 5 Aug 2019

Discussion in 'MLS: News & Analysis' started by Stuart95, Aug 5, 2019.

  1. BakedAlaskan

    BakedAlaskan Member+

    Feb 28, 2002
    Ancho-RAGE,Alaska
    Club:
    TSV 1860 München
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Even if it's a response to politician's moves?
    One of the first bills that McConnell put on Trump's desk made it easier for people with mental disabilities to buy guns.

    Feb. 28, 2017: H.J.Res. 40, "nullifies the Social Security Administration's rule implementing the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) Improvement Amendments Act of 2007." The measure blocks an Obama Administration rule providing Social Security information for gun buyer background checks.

    Social Security was no longer allowed to say that _____ _____ receives SS mental health benefit payments when people were making background checks. That's a Republican move . . . that makes all of this political wether you want it to be or not.

    When are people going to realize . . . the NRA and Republicans don't represent NRA members . . . they represent the gun manufacturers and that's it.
     
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  2. MPNumber9

    MPNumber9 Member+

    Oct 10, 2010
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    MLS cannot be a hypocrite because "MLS" doesn't have a value system besides making money for itself, which is what'll determine if they sanction Bedoya or not. MLS and its member corporations, like all employers, desires to control the speech of its employees (players, coaches, refs etc.) and customers (fans), not create "apolitical" or "neutral" spaces. Notably, MLS has abridged the speech of its employees in the past by coercing them to make de facto political statements like wearing Pride Night numbers or Parley jerseys (we saw how that worked out for Jaelene Hinkle) while at the same time restricting their own political speech as a condition of employment.

    Sure, because I can survive others having different opinions than me on TV. Know what I can't survive? A couple rounds to the chest. (Also -- I get that this is an example, but it's a bad false equivalence.)

    It used to be okay for athletes and other types of celebrities to be people with opinions about things like politics (could you imagine Messi, whose persona has been carefully whittled down to that of voiceless cypher, hanging out with someone like Fidel Castro, like Maradona did?). It suddenly became incredibly gauche after the 1970s for famous people* to hold opinions about politics and society. I wonder why.

    *The caveat being that celebrities holding political opinions that uphold the existing power structure(s) were not only not considered objectionable -- some were able to parlay their celebrity status to the highest political office we have.
     
  3. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Not according to Don Garber. Quoted last week in the Seattle Times:

    . . . “Our stadiums are not environments where our fans should be expressing political views because you then are automatically opening yourself up to allowing counterviews,” Garber told ESPN from the MLS All-Star Game in Orlando. “Then we’re getting into a situation which is unmanageable and really not why the vast, vast majority of fans go to games.” . . .

    https://www.seattletimes.com/sports...banning-iron-front-flag-but-tension-persists/
     
  4. RfrancisR

    RfrancisR Member+

    Aug 7, 2006
    New Orleans Diaspora
    The best possible result of diplomatic negotiation with a Nazi is to get to 50%of being a Nazi. Nazism and white supremacy are NOTHING short of the political manifestation of evil. The sooner our society recognizes that fact, the better.
     
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  5. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Yeah, because the concept of a survival has nothing to do with the abortion debate.
     
  6. bbsbt

    bbsbt Member+

    Feb 26, 2003
    Neither.
    If you think otherwise, than you believe MSM too much.
     
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  7. POdinCowtown

    POdinCowtown Member+

    Jan 15, 2002
    Columbus

    I don't quite understand why the NRA is such a fetish object of hate for liberals. It isn't politically powerful because of money, it's politically powerful because it has millions of members plus non-members who agree with it. If it makes you feel better, the NRA is currently fighting an internal war over whether or not Wayne LaPierre has been profiteering from his expense account.

    Regarding SS benefits, people shouldn't lose their civil rights because they receive SSI. Some states have red flag laws for people (mentally ill or not) who make threats. That's a better approach. I think limitations on magazine sizes are a reasonable approach. But banning AR-15s is unconstitutional as would be Congress trying to require universal background checks.
     
  8. sitruc

    sitruc Member+

    Jul 25, 2006
    Virginia
    That's an interesting statement.
    That's a broad statement. Poll after poll have shown people want "common sense gun laws." The NRA is powerful because they support state politicians and send them bill after bill to pass in state houses because most legislatures don't write laws or know what is in them.
     
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  9. POdinCowtown

    POdinCowtown Member+

    Jan 15, 2002
    Columbus
    Eh, I think it's fair to say that large numbers of liberal actually do hate the NRA and its political power. Same could be said of conservatives and Planned Parenthood.

    After the Parkland shooting, CNN had a townhall at which several participants blamed the NRA for the crime without much pushback by the moderators.

    At most of the recent mass shootings, the shooter acquired his weapons legally. So far most of the gun control proposals I've seen wouldn't have stopped any of the mass shootings.

    SCOTUS has said that states and cities can't ban guns in common use for lawful purposes. The AR15 and it's variants are the biggest selling rifles in the US and thus protected from bans. Congress can't require people to pass background checks before exercising their 2nd amendment rights anymore than it can require government permission to exercise first amendment rights. When you go to a gun store to buy a gun, they perform a background check but it's because as FFLs, they are covered by the interstate commerce clause. Individual citizens not engaged in interstate gun sales aren't. So Congress doesn't have jurisdiction over private garage sales, estate sales, sales in the gun show parking lot, etc.
     
  10. soccermilitant

    soccermilitant Member+

    Jan 14, 2009
    St.paul
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    banning guns will work just as well as banning drugs has.
     
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  11. MannieG

    MannieG Member+

    Nov 30, 2006
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Except no one's going around Walmarts sticking dozens of people with deadly amounts of heroine.
     
  12. MannieG

    MannieG Member+

    Nov 30, 2006
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Say that with a straight face to a WWII vet.
     
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  13. soccermilitant

    soccermilitant Member+

    Jan 14, 2009
    St.paul
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    They'll just guns off the black market
     
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  14. LampLighter

    LampLighter Member

    Bugeaters FC
    Apr 13, 2019
    Ok then, guess we're giving up. Why do we have seat belt laws, they can just take them off.
     
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  15. MannieG

    MannieG Member+

    Nov 30, 2006
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I wasn't advocating a full on ban on guns I was pointing out your poor comparison.
     
  16. TheJoeGreene

    TheJoeGreene Member+

    Aug 19, 2012
    The Lubbock Texas
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    If you're equating asshats who attack people on the Berkley campus with WWII vets then you're a waste of oxygen.
     
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  17. MPNumber9

    MPNumber9 Member+

    Oct 10, 2010
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't see how any of that applies to Bedoya. He's not an MLS fan and he didn't bear an Iron Front flag, which is what Garber was specifically commenting on.

    Who does and doesn't "survive" an abortion is, itself, a hotly contested matter. No one debates that mass shootings are illegal, out of control and actually cause human deaths. This is why it's a bad analogy.
     
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  18. NashSC

    NashSC Member+

    Nashville SC
    United States
    Jan 3, 2018
    Nobody uses planes or cars to kill thousands of people...oh wait
     
  19. NashSC

    NashSC Member+

    Nashville SC
    United States
    Jan 3, 2018
    very poor analogy.
    Me not wearing a seat belt is a conscious decision on my part. Me not legally being allowed to have a gun to protect myself against someone else who chooses to obtain one illegally is completely different. New flash the people doing these things are often obtaining the guns illegally already and they obviously aren't concerned with laws. They are breaking the law with how they are using the gun. You can make all the laws you want but it won't make access to guns go away.

    Have drug laws made drugs go away? Many argue it has made it a bigger industry and made them more prevalent. They argue getting rid of many drug laws will lower the selling and usage of them. Funny thing is most of these people are the ones wanting more gun laws and gun control.
     
  20. MPNumber9

    MPNumber9 Member+

    Oct 10, 2010
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sorry, but that hasn't been true for almost 15 years. The NRA is powerful because it is the legislative arm of a cartel of wealthy US gun manufacturers who have long stopped operating in the interest of American gun owners. That includes actual rank-and-file NRA members, a majority of whom support background checks. The NRA has not been the same since this happened:

    Since then, the NRA hasn't just protected 2nd amendment rights, it has been aggressively pro-gun, despite an actual drop in crime. The NRA has pushed bad legislation like "Stand your ground" or pushed for "fight gun with gun" policies including arming school teachers -- policies that endanger and result in deaths of more Americans -- to sell more guns. They've stoked fears about the government seizure of weapons or any gun control, fears of immigrants and minorities -- to sell more guns.

    The NRA has basically achieved comicbook levels of villainy and is no longer worthy of the trust of the majority of responsible gun-owning Americans. They don't care about the Constitution. They don't care about you. They care about selling guns. As many as they can, to anyone, everywhere all the time. Their implosion over financial impropriety just underscores that point, I think.
     
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  21. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    There will be a debate whether Congress will "do something." I guarantee it. The invocation of Congressional action is always -- and inherently -- political.

    More importantly, whether or not my analogy is apt, Bedoya engaged in political speech of the sort that would be a violation of the MLS fan code of conduct. That is undeniable.
     
  22. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Then explain why gun violence is lower and/or has dropped in countries with these laws.
     
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  23. RfrancisR

    RfrancisR Member+

    Aug 7, 2006
    New Orleans Diaspora
    If your political view is that we should commit genocide, that’s not a mere “difference of opinion” with the group targeted for genocide.That’s an existential crisis for the targeted group.

    Using violence to stop genocidal maniacs from eradicated entire ethnic, racial groups, etc... doesn’t make you like genocidal maniacs. It makes you someone trying to stop genocidal maniacs.

    And make no mistake about it: Nazis are genocidal maniacs.
     
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  24. Gamecock14

    Gamecock14 Member+

    May 27, 2010
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Am I the only one who is surprised Bedoya wasn’t suspended and fined.

    I know mls does not want the bad press, but setting a precedent might be better because someone might say something that is inappropriate and then have this used as precedent.

    I kind of expected a game suspension and a faux fine where the league fines the player but never collects it.
     
  25. MPNumber9

    MPNumber9 Member+

    Oct 10, 2010
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    But my point from the beginning is relevant: MLS does not desire to create a neutral space, but a sanitized one. For MLS younger, more-educated, more-international audience, at least. Even Garber's quote speaks to this. Bedoya's comment isn't going to invite the kind of controversy saying something about abortion would. They are both political statements, but that has never been the criteria.
     

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