MLS Premier League, MLS League One...

Discussion in 'MLS: Commissioner - You be The Don' started by Paulo PT, Dec 10, 2015.

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  1. Paulo PT

    Paulo PT Member

    Nov 24, 2015
    Club:
    SL Benfica
    COULD THIS SYSTEM WORK?

    MLS Premier League
    (D1) - 16 Clubs. 30 games. (Balanced Schedule. Home and Away Games)


    MLS League One
    (D2) - 16 Clubs. 30 games. (Balanced Schedule. Home and Away Games)

    NSL (D3) - 32 Clubs. 4 Conferences. 14+24=38 games. Playoffs: 4 clubs.

    USL (D4) - 32 Clubs. 4 Conferences. 14+24=38 games. Playoffs: 4 clubs.

    NOTES:
    1. "B Teams" are in USL and couldn't be promoted to NSL.
    2. MLS absorves NASL. NASL teams goes to NSL, USL or relocation cities.
    3. MLS, NSL and USL complementary system. No competition between leagues, Only clubs competition.

    MLS LEAGUE CUP
    32 clubs (D1 & D2). Group Stage: 8 groups. Knockout tournament: 8 clubs. 11 games. (Home and Away games except Final Game held in a Host City).

    MLS SUPER CHAMPIONS CUP
    MLS Premier League Champion VS MLS League One Champion VS MLS League Cup Winner.
    4 games. Each club plays one time against each club (3 games). Final: 2 clubs (one game).
    All 4 games will be held at the same stadium in an Host City.
    (PRESEASON: February)

    US OPEN CUP
    96 Clubs (D1-D4 Clubs and USASA Clubs)
    - D1 clubs and CONCACAF participants plays only 6 games (Semi-finals: home and away games).
    Final: Host City.

    CONCACAF CHAMPIONS LEAGUE
    4 Clubs. 10 games.
    - Premier League: 2 births
    - MLS League Cup: 1 birth
    - US Open Cup: 1 birth

    DIVISION I Clubs could plays 57 games (30+11+6+10) during regular season.

    PRESEASON: February
    REGULAR SEASON: March-November
    VACATIONS: December and January.

    PROMOTION AND RELEGATION:
    - 2 Clubs between MLS Premier League and MLS League One.
    - 2 Clubs between NSL and USL.
    - No direct promotion or relegation between MLS and NSL.

    CLUB COEFFICIENT. Club ranking and seeding.
     
  2. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  3. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No.
     
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  4. Paulo PT

    Paulo PT Member

    Nov 24, 2015
    Club:
    SL Benfica
    Why?
    Premier League and League One will be more equiparable than D1 and D2 in others countries, starting with ownership.
    Then you could also had D2 clubs in CONCACAF Champions League.
    Also D1 and D2 will playing a lot of times against each other alwayswith home and away games, giving equals oportunities and exposure (MLS League Cup and US Open Cup).
    I believe this also increase soccer Dynamics, fairness and interest.

    D3 Clubs (with some hypothetical names): Tacoma, San Francisco City FC, Orange Empire Angels FC, Las Vegas FC, Rio Grande Bravos FC (El Paso), FC Edmonton, Tucson, Austin, Oklahoma City, NOLA FC, Memphis, Birmingham, Fort Worth, Jacksonville Armada FC, Tampa Bay Rowdies, Fort Lauderdale, Charlotte, Richmond, Baltimore, New York Cosmos, Hartford, Rochester, Ottawa, Hamilton, Milwaukee, St. Louis, Louisville, FC Cincinnati, Cleveland, Pittsburgh, Grand Rapids and Chicago.
     
  5. Paulo PT

    Paulo PT Member

    Nov 24, 2015
    Club:
    SL Benfica
    "MLS League One" could start with some previous NASL clubs (this league is absorved by MLS and USL) and some MLS Premier League contenders.

    The "MLS Premier League" and "MLS League One" merge, i.e., using promotion and relegation system after 4-6 years.

    Then the remaining teams will be relegated to the "new" NSL (D3), formed with some USL promoted teams.

    MLS League One starting season (2018): 24 teams
    (MLS Premier League - 24 teams with the addition of Atlanta, Twin Cities, Los Angeles FC and Miami City FC)
    - NASL "former" teams (10): FC Edmonton, Ottawa Fury, Indy Eleven, Rayo OKC, San Antonio Scorpions, Tampa Bay Rowdies, Jacksonville Armada FC, Fort Lauderdale Strikers, Raleigh and New York Cosmos.
    (Silverbacks and Miami FC relocation or relegation to USL)
    - USL "former" teams (5): Sacramento Republic FC, FC Cincinnati, Louisville FC, Saint Louis FC, Phoenix.
    - New teams: Detroit, Baltimore, San Diego, El Paso, Las Vegas, Austin, Nashville and New Orleans.
    Note: In "bold" locations/clubs that can earn a birth in MLS after 2022 or 2024. However only 8 will have that chance (16+16). Then this 8 selected teams would pay the admission fee for the NEW MLS League One.

    Note: Could 10 IF MLS D1 and D2 instead of 16 had 18 clubs, totalizing 36 clubs instead of 32 clubs. But this mean a maximum 61 or 62 games per season. Not impossible, but...

    MLS League Cup (D1 & D2) starting only in 2022 or 2024 after MLS merge.

    With this Conference and Playoff model will be obsolete in MLS after 2024!
     
  6. Placid Casual

    Placid Casual Member+

    Apr 2, 2004
    Bentley's Roof
    Why Premier League?

    Why not MLS Liga?
     
  7. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I like the Super League "Super 8's" idea in England.

    There are 12 teams in the Super League. After playing each other home and away (22 games), plus one "magic weekend" game, where all sides play in the same city over one weekend, the league splits in to 2.

    upload_2015-12-11_8-56-50.png

    The top 8 teams continue playing an additional 7 games competing for a play-off spot

    upload_2015-12-11_8-57-29.png

    The bottom 4 teams play home and away against the top 4 teams in the second tier (14 games), for a place in the following year's Super League.

    upload_2015-12-11_8-59-22.png

    The bottom 8 from the second tier play for the separate Championship Shield.

    This system gives teams something to play for all season long and gives second tier teams a glimpse of the big time and some TV money (the Super 8s were shown on US TV).

    Given the differences in revenue between the Super League teams and the ones in the lower divisions, it's unlikely that Super League teams would be relegated on an annual basis, unless they were in a really poor state on and off the pitch, like Wakefield were (did someone say Fire?). That gives the top flight


    If MLS ever any multi-tier system then clubs relegated from the top-flight would have to receive substantial parachute payments, otherwise no-one is going to sink a couple of hundred $million only to end up in NASL, not that there's a cat in Hell's chance of MLS ever adopting this.
     
  8. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #8 KCbus, Dec 11, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2015
    There's your first mistake. Playoffs will never be obsolete in America, because Americans love playoffs.

    Your second fault is that by your own math, a team could play 57 matches. Most wouldn't, but with that system, you'd have to find 57 available matchdays. Where the hell are you going to find 57 available matchdays in North American climate?

    Plus, as much of a diehard as I am, I wouldn't watch 57 matches. It's overkill.
     
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  9. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #9 Paul Berry, Dec 11, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 11, 2015
    Chelsea played 63 competitive games in 2007/08

    Premier League 38
    FA Cup 4 (no replays needed)
    League Cup 6
    Champions League 13
     
  10. newtex

    newtex Member+

    May 25, 2005
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Maybe you left a couple out but that adds up to 61.
     
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  11. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I got 61 the first time but then recounted and got 63. :oops:
     
  12. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Chelsea wouldn't have to play in Chicago or Toronto in December and January.
     
  13. Paulo PT

    Paulo PT Member

    Nov 24, 2015
    Club:
    SL Benfica
    #13 Paulo PT, Dec 11, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 11, 2015
    Playoffs in MLS League not in Soccer. In the "League Cup" or "US Open Cup" Knockouts are some kind of "playoffs".

    For me doesn't makes sense playoffs in top tier leagues, only in lower division leagues like NSL and USL.

    In top tier is important to give the same oportunities to all teams. That's why I insist in Home and Away games in League!

    57 games, only half were at home, the other half were away. So for the large majority of fans only could watch 26 games in home city.

    No one will play in December or January.

    1,5 games (40 weeks, 38 used weeks), per week is a normal average for soccer. I don't saw any Schedule problem with this number.
     
  14. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You might want to tell almost every top league in the Americas. Almost all of them (outside the Caribbean) use some sort of playoff to determine an ultimate champion.

    Other countries around the world use a playoff like Belgium and Australia.

    But again, this is really just a case of when somebody says "the rest of the world" they really mean Europe, if not just England.
     
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  15. Paulo PT

    Paulo PT Member

    Nov 24, 2015
    Club:
    SL Benfica
    @"Paul Berry"I think is very similar to D3 league in Portugal.
    Campeonato De Portugal (D3)
    FORMAT
    The league is divided in eight series of 10 clubs placed geographically, with the exception of teams from Madeira Islands (divided through the first series) and from the Azores Islands (divided through the last series).
    After a First Stage in a home-and-away system, the first two best placed teams of each league play in two groups of 8 teams in a Second Stage with each league winner earning a promotion to the Segunda Liga, plus a two-round play-off winner between the two second placed teams. The two group winners then play a Grand Final on neutral ground for the overall Campeonato Nacional title.
    The remaining 8 clubs from each league from the First Stage play in 8 different groups with the last two placed teams being relegated to the Districts Championships (D4: 20 leagues).
    For this season only, the 6th placed teams from those leagues then play a two-round play-off among themselves; the four losers are relegated. The four winners then play another two rounds to decide the remaining two clubs to be relegated. These changes are meant for the league to remain at 80 clubs from next season
     
  16. Paulo PT

    Paulo PT Member

    Nov 24, 2015
    Club:
    SL Benfica
    @JasonMa That's occurs in countries with many clubs in top division (with some exceptions). FIFA recomendation is a maximum of 18 teams. My reference is world's best leagues, not every league in the world.
     
  17. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    In other words "because Europe". *sigh*
     
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  18. Paulo PT

    Paulo PT Member

    Nov 24, 2015
    Club:
    SL Benfica
    LOL Yes, Europe and Brazil. (and Argentina).

    How many games mexican teams plays each year?
     
  19. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just because you sprinkle in another competition or two that has an element of knockouts to it doesn't mean that the MLS playoffs are going to disappear. No matter how you try to frame it, it's not going to happen. Period. Get used to that fact.

    And you're damn right no one is going to play in December or January. If you're actually realistic, you'd probably nix the first two weeks of February, also. Which means, you have 42 weeks MAXIMUM of calendar time to find 57 matchdays. That means midweek matches at least a third of the time. And we haven't even gotten into FIFA breaks yet.

    Chelsea played 61? Good for them. I don't really care. I'm not watching that many. And even if you could convince people to watch that many, it's a completely different story altogether to convince season ticket holders to pay for that many.

    And failing all of that: even if you COULD find a way to make it technically possible... I'm still not interested.
     
  20. flange

    flange Member

    Jul 15, 2014
    Portland, OR
    Club:
    Portland Timbers
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    playoffs >>> balanced schedules
     
  21. newtex

    newtex Member+

    May 25, 2005
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    LigaMX plays a split-season schedule. There are 18 teams so they play 17 games (every other team once) and then have playoffs with 3 rounds of home-and-away in the Fall and then they do it all again in the Spring. So in the league teams play at least 34 games and a maximum of 46.

    Four teams are in the CONCACAF Champions League each year which would be 4 to 10 games total.

    They also have national cup tournament, the Copa MX, that includes all of the teams that don't make the CONCACAF Champions League from the top division and all 2nd division teams. It has a group stage and then a 3 round knockout stage that is single games. A team could play up to 9 games in each tournament. They have that tournament twice a year also so a team could possibly play 18 games total.

    A team could possibly play 64 games but 40-50 is more typical.
     
  22. Paulo PT

    Paulo PT Member

    Nov 24, 2015
    Club:
    SL Benfica
    Thank you!

    Once again the maximum fall near 64 games with the average being 50 or so.

    57 games per season I think is something aceptable, with "home and away" games being the norm, with 4 Top Competitions, plus Supporter's Shield and Super Champions Cup (Preseason, like other Preseason Cups with others MLS Clubs).

    6 Titles per season could boosts soccer popularity between americans.

    If MLS D1 and D2 with 18 clubs each (total: 36) means 61 less than Mexican Clubs for example.
     
  23. Elninho

    Elninho Member+

    Sacramento Republic FC
    United States
    Oct 30, 2000
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If you can't get people to show up for the CONCACAF Champions League on a Wednesday night, who exactly is going to show up to watch the "MLS League Cup"?

    Right now, almost all US soccer teams lose money when they play on weeknights. In most places it costs more to open the stadium than the team earns in ticket revenue.
     
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  24. Paulo PT

    Paulo PT Member

    Nov 24, 2015
    Club:
    SL Benfica
    That's odd (or not because MLS is a self absorved competition), in Europe Champions League have the highest attendance numbers! Fans travels long distances to watch this games more than any other competition.

    However I think a "League Cup" will have more impact between americans than CONCACAF Champions League.

    I think with more Clubs (32 or 36 clubs) the soccer fan base will be much higher and attendance and TV Ratings will grown.
     
  25. EvanJ

    EvanJ Member+

    Manchester United
    United States
    Mar 30, 2004
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The top three leagues in UEFA are Spain, Germany, and England, and they combined to get 8 out of 13 clubs to advance to the Round of 16. That's a majority but it shows advancing past the Group Stage isn't automatic. Arsenal, Chelsea, and Wolfsburg advanced on the last matchday and Manchester United was eliminated on the last matchday. Mexican clubs win their Champions League groups more than 8/13ths of the time, and this time every MLS club advanced except for when a group had two MLS clubs. Outside of Mexican and Central American clubs having Hispanic fans in the USA, how many people in a CONCACAF country are fans of a club in another CONCACAF country? The top clubs in UEFA have fans in many countries. Mexican and American clubs cannot meet in the Group Stage, so the CONCACAF Champions League Group Stage can't have the equivalent of 2015-2016 UEFA Champions League Group Stage games between Real Madrid and Paris-Saint Germain, Manchester City and Juventus, and Arsenal and Bayern Munich.
     

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