"MLS officials now say that the possibility for expansion for 2009 is pretty much nil."

Discussion in 'MLS: Expansion' started by City Dave, Feb 8, 2008.

  1. City Dave

    City Dave Member

    Jan 26, 2007
    Cleveland, OH
    Club:
    Cleveland C. S.
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, I guess this is the announcement about '09 that was supposed to take place before the end of January. Now, Philly, St. Louis, et al have another year to duke it out.

    Also, looks like they are planning to go to 18 at some point, no word on when that is actually:
    "Even if 2009 is out, both of the lead communities still have ample reason to reach the finish line first. About 10 million reasons, in fact. Garber has already stated that club No. 16 will pay a $30 million expansion fee. After that, Nos. 17 and 18 must pony up $40 million each."
     
  2. Z010 Union

    Z010 Union Member

    Mar 28, 2002
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I doubt Philly and St. Louis duke it out for another month.
     
  3. jasontoon

    jasontoon Member

    Jan 9, 2002
    Seattle, WA
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Agreed. Philly's got 16 locked up.

    Now St. Louis gets to duke it out with Miami, New York, Montreal, Atlanta...

    Somebody remind me again why I give half a damn about this league.
     
  4. City Dave

    City Dave Member

    Jan 26, 2007
    Cleveland, OH
    Club:
    Cleveland C. S.
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Hey Bryan, what's Ben saying there (in your avatar)?
     
  5. Z010 Union

    Z010 Union Member

    Mar 28, 2002
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    It's 4 laughs or blah blah blah blah, depending on the day
     
  6. RedRover

    RedRover BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 15, 2007
    Philadelphia - 16th
    St. Louis - 17th
    Montreal - 18th
     
  7. modenafc1912

    modenafc1912 New Member

    Jan 28, 2003
    Modena, Italy
    Club:
    Modena FC
    Why did the league decide to increase the fee after the 16th team? and not, just for talk, the 15th? Is there any technical reason?
    Plus, if the league really wants to stop for a while at 18 teams, it would have had sense to put a 40 millions fee in the incoming round of expansion.
    your thoughts about that?
     
  8. NYC_COSMOS

    NYC_COSMOS BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 13, 2007
    Queens, NY
    Club:
    CA Vélez Sársfield
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    FYP
     
  9. GOALSeattle

    GOALSeattle Member

    Oct 13, 2007
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    To give several investors / cities a '$10 million dollar' incentive to get their act together faster for spot 16.

    Of course Philly could afford the extra cash, but won't have to spend it. Now STL will need to come up with a higher fee, but doesn't have the assumed resources yet.
     
  10. modenafc1912

    modenafc1912 New Member

    Jan 28, 2003
    Modena, Italy
    Club:
    Modena FC
    I'd rather put this increase after 18th ... I mean, if MLS really wants to stop expansion for a while when getting 18 teams, it could have had sense to keep 30 millions for this expansion race and say hey hurry up, till 18 it's a great deal ... after, not only you'll have to wait, but you'll have to spend 10 millions more too.
     
  11. WhiteStar Warriors

    Mar 25, 2007
    St.Pete/Krakow
    Club:
    FC Tampa Bay Rowdies
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And by 2013 we should have a promotion/relegation system with the USL-1, it would make the league way more interesting
     
  12. jasontoon

    jasontoon Member

    Jan 9, 2002
    Seattle, WA
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    But far less interesting for the investor who ponies up a $40 million MLS expansion fee, gets a 20K-seat stadium built, and then gets relegated to USL-1 to play the likes of Rochester and Charleston.

    If we see pro/rel in MLS in my lifetime, I'll eat Dwayne DeRosario's jockstrap.
     
  13. Schwalker

    Schwalker New Member

    Apr 15, 2007
    Gelsenkirchen/Finja
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany

    Not to mention that the single entity format would play havoc with such ideas....
     
  14. City Dave

    City Dave Member

    Jan 26, 2007
    Cleveland, OH
    Club:
    Cleveland C. S.
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Why him specificially?

    I sense a bit of desire there. :eek:

    :D
     
  15. ness77

    ness77 Member

    Jan 11, 2007
    The 2-0-6
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    After the 18th I'm sure they'll just bump it to 50 million, and announce that ahead of time so Montreal/NYC2/Miami or whoever are 'forced' to fight for the 18th spot. Same scenario all over again, and more money for MLS.
     
  16. RedRover

    RedRover BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 15, 2007
    If you're going to use my quote, use it as it is written! Do NOT alter it to fit your motives! People get sued for crud like that!
     
  17. NYC_COSMOS

    NYC_COSMOS BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 13, 2007
    Queens, NY
    Club:
    CA Vélez Sársfield
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Chill n00b, put those internet muscles away!
     
  18. Sport Billy

    Sport Billy Member+

    May 25, 2006
    MOD NOTE: Please keep to the topic at hand.
     
  19. XeneizeAZ

    XeneizeAZ New Member

    Jul 21, 2007
    Arizona
    $30 or $40 million? What does MLS do with that money?

    Increase all MLS big guys salary? or what?


    I don't see why a team needs to pay so much money?


    do you guys know what's the money for?
     
  20. Brownswan

    Brownswan New Member

    Jun 30, 1999
    Port St. Lucie, FL
    I suppose that will make the Mississippi River the divide between the conferences, with KC going west, again. I'm losing track of the teams, actual and proposed. Will there be a natural split of 9 and 9, East-West, or will Chicago also be transferred west to keep things even?
     
  21. DaveBrett

    DaveBrett Member

    Nov 28, 1998
    Austin, Texas
    How about paying the interest on all the debt they have to
    finance?

    MLS has lost a ton of money since it started. Did you know
    that? And MLS has lost a lot more than $30 or $40 million
    over the years.
     
  22. NYC_COSMOS

    NYC_COSMOS BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 13, 2007
    Queens, NY
    Club:
    CA Vélez Sársfield
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina

    Can you please provide actual figures and the subsequent sources please.
     
  23. City Dave

    City Dave Member

    Jan 26, 2007
    Cleveland, OH
    Club:
    Cleveland C. S.
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As of November '04 they were down several hundred million: http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/04_47/b3909099.htm?campaign_id=search

    Given that only FC Dallas and the Galaxy were profitable in 2006, and that the rest are projected to be in 2010, the league has likely lost at least another 100 million since '04 and will still lose money over the next few years. After that, they'll be trying to get back in the black overall.
    http://web.archive.org/web/20060520...tontimes.com/sports/20060511-120809-9655r.htm
     
  24. NYC_COSMOS

    NYC_COSMOS BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 13, 2007
    Queens, NY
    Club:
    CA Vélez Sársfield
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina

    Great with the links but with all due respect, we would still be taking the word of the Business Week writer. What's his source? He doesn't mention any. At this point its still all speculation and nothing more. Are we talking about profit after initial investment? Return of the initial investment plus proft? How are we defining this profit that we are being told about? I'm not trying to send this at you, but in general. I don't think for a minute that if the league wasnt profitable from Day One that it would have lasted this long. I think that they are speaking about Profit in terms of return of initial investment and profit.
     
  25. City Dave

    City Dave Member

    Jan 26, 2007
    Cleveland, OH
    Club:
    Cleveland C. S.
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    "With an average attendance of 14,282 in 1999 -- the last year for which figures are available -- the league's financial statements listed $62,940,084 in revenues and $97,364,283 in costs and expenses for an operating loss of $34,424,199."
    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/soccer/mls/news/2001/07/30/stadium_future_sa/
    https://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=195648

    Is that good enough for you? Or do you just think they're making the numbers up? :rolleyes:
     

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