Not sure... I stopped engaging with most folks on here. Might want to ask @dspence2311 . It sounds like people might be arguing that to him. Not sure how some of the usual suspects have really responded recently, but clear they don't want to admit it. Such a weird group of people. I will add that in the past when I have posted these types of quotes, I was met with plenty of objection.
And you still can't notice that MLS players are not technically proficient, are allowed signifancly more time and space than many leagues around the world, and would struggle with more defensive pressure? That is a long time to not be able to observe something that s obvious to American kids now.
I'm just trying to argue that Premier League players are more skilled that 7 year- old schoolboys but bsky22 wants to disagree. All other things being equal, the more skilled a player is, the more time he'll have on the ball and the more space he'll be able to create. If de Bruyne came to MLS he'd have all the time and space on the world. If Roldan went to the Premier League he'd get shut down in an instant. But the fact that Premier League players are more skilled than MLS players doesn't mean they have less time and space over 90 minutes because...they're more skilled.
Here is one from a couple of years ago. Yes, FCD is the best in America, but their nvironment still doesn't prep them for what they will face in certain environments they are hoping to achieve.
I'm just laughing at a guy with piddling professional experience being an expert witness. I'd like to see what Carlos Gruezo thinks, a guy who actually has played many times in both leagues.
With a little luck we might get to see Roldán play Real Madrid next year. So far, MLS and Liga MX haven't exposed him. I guess we'll see when he's against the real deal.
Higher technical level Higher intensity Faster speed of play Stronger mentality/more focused Everyone is trying to be the best they can be (not true in MLS) All opponents are competitive (not true in the DA) Yep.
That is what you are arguing? So you have assimilated well to the MLS BS poster and are just trying to distract. Good for you. Of course, you are completely wrong that I disagreed with your comments. I think they are just stupid and have nothing to do with MLS players going abroad. For clarity and simplification, let's split time and space between what the defender takes away and what the attacker is able to create for himself. When doing that, what all these players are saying is the defenders abroad take more time and space away from them than MLS defenders. The carry on, is that they haven't been prepped well for this and can't create more for themselves. They are more like the 7 year olds than de bruyne.
Why does that make any sense? Especially since we are in USN&A. The guys with piddling experience are the ones you and others rave about how well they have been developed by MLS. That is exactly what we are talking about. It doesn't matter to them if Gruezp can handle it or Zlatan can go win Serie A.
I think he is saying that while there is less time & space on the ball all else equal, players develop ways to get away and anticipate the pressure so that they create time & space. I think that is essentially agreeing with my point about how players develop.
I don't think you've seen me rave about any teenager transferring. Busio is the only one since Adams to leave MLS with any real pro experience.
It is just a fact that doesn't have any impact on the discussion. The MLS players going abroad and some of their coach have stated that they didnt have the ability to create time and space for themselves and struggled. Is he making the point that there are other places that would be preparation for the top levels of soccer? The point here to me is having the technical ability and ability to process the game quickly are the most soccer specific things about player development and our domestic league isnt good at it. That is very troubling to me, but the MLS crowd wants to ignore it and its impact on the USMNT (given that the coach is going to do everything he can to get MLSers on the field).
Some are trying to distract from the issues concerning technical abilities and speed of action differences between top leagues and lesser leagues. Top league defenders have to be able to act faster and have better technical abilities than those in lesser leagues, because they face attackers with better technical abilities and faster actions than those in lesser leagues. If an attacker with sub par technical abilities and speed of action faces a top defender, it's to that defender as if that attacker acts in slow motion. Simple as that. In order to overcome that disadvantage that attacker has to put in alot of labour to close the gap, if he has the capabilities in him. You can't extract what's not there. So for instance for Cole Bassett it's a test how far he can rise to the occasion (and I hope it's gonna be high). He has seen the speed and complexity of the combinations coach Slot demands from his players and he has been given minutes to play. So coach Slot sees in him potential, but it is up to Cole to unlock it with alot of practice.
The problem people have with your argument is that your observations don't match your conclusion. If the observation is that players have to adjust to the speed of stronger leagues when they move abroad from MLS (which I don't think is that controversial); but that is not proof of your conclusion, that "MLS" isn't "good at" developing players with the skills to jump abroad. A better point of evidence would be, well, the actual number of players that have moved abroad and successfully adjusted to better leagues. There are multiple factors that determine if a player succeeds or fails when making the jump to a stronger league, but for almost all there is an adjustment period no matter which league they're coming from.
How else can I put it: EPL > MLS EPL players > MLS players A MLS player going to EPL would get less time and space on the ball than he would in MLS So far we're agreed. This is the part you don't seem to understand: - top players have more time on the ball and are better at creating space, and keeping possession, than average ones. Something you'll notice if that top teams are better at building an attack and keeping possession where lower level football tends to be more "end to end".
I think this is accurate and in part because they are typically surrounded by top player-teammates who can deliver an accurate pass with significant pace before the D knows it's coming. I've seen far too many lazy passes to wide open teammates because it's either safe or the passer doesn't sense the urgency of timing. Those passes are defended at a higher rate than the former.
I understand that smart, technical players can create time and space for themselves. I could have sworn I said that in my last post. We aren't talking about de bruyne or anyone else. We are talking about young players developed in MLS who apparently aren't smart and technical enough. Stop trying to overcomplcate this.
Where did I say MLS isn't good at developing players (recently, a few years ago I was pointing out that they hadn't successfully sent players abroad)? I think all I have implied is "MLS" to date isnt developing smart and technical 3nough players to need time to adjust... this isn't just the top 5 leagues, but also seeing players struggle in the Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal, etc. Am I the only one who questions if a player wants to be working on technical skills and adapting to much faster speed of play after turning 18? I personally would prefer they do that younger. I would much rather sub 18 yo players play in more technical and tactical environments than playing at the highest level determined by nonsense average league comparisons. I am pretty sure I argued in this thread that I preferred Ledezma's spot at Jong PSV than Pomykal at FCD. The jump from Jong PSV to PSV looks easier than from FCD.
Not at all. Nothing you have written has anything to do with MLS players being overwhelmed by the lack of time and space . You sound like an old man rambling about something tangential to the topic.
On what basis do you make that claim? Do most of the players in the Erestedivisie go on to be good Eredivisie players, or do many go on to be nobodies? Is Ledezma killing it at PSV? Jozy tore up the the Eredivisie then kinda flopped in the PL. There's a broad spectrum of ability across any league; I expect there are lots of guys in the lower divisions of Netherlands that are donkeys, like anywhere else. That's because leagues don't determine if someone is technical, let alone "smart".
I think 3 years at NYC has been better than 3 years at Benfica for Keaton Parks. NYC has a great coaching infrastructure as part of the CFG organization.
the tessmann argument is demonstrable horse hooey. dude did briefly work his way off the bench mid-season after barely seeing the field through halloween, but then as of 3/14 he got benched and played 2 games the rest of the season. started once yanked 56'. then came off the bench with 17' in the season finale as his team was relegated. does that sound like someone who worked his way into the coach's dreams by dint of hard work? anyone who looks at game logs can toss this argument. what you're doing is offering cherry pick quotes from fanboy articles adoring playing abroad regardless of their actual form or the fact the coach of the player in holland was actually fairly tepid. that read like a professor asked to give a letter of recommendation for someone he doesn't like or maybe even know. "he's on my roster, he doesn't start, he works hard, i wish he worked on skills." the other 2 you're offering fluff pieces where a player who plays abroad praises the quality of the team where they signed. neither plays a ton and neither catapulted from their new platform to the USMNT. not sure if you're aware how rare an actual diss would be in the business world when discussing one's employer with the press.
if you're watching the ES game surely you see that passive sideways passing doesn't do much in concacaf. ES is not going to stand in 3 neat lines and watch us pass sideways. they will chop anyone down they can reach. they will give us a gift basket for taking the ball to the flag and hitting aimless crosses and not just taking them on right up route 1. and at some point can we acknowledge that in everything but that one summer pair of tournaments GB has created tiebreaker warriors who barely advance? dude has successfully defanged a good player pool.