You might be right - I mainly remember a midfield trio of cecs+flam+hleb but now you mention it, hleb nominally played from the right. Rosicky was pure class - i forgot about him. he is an example of the quality of player we don't have anymore. I mean that is the perfect tldr; version of my post Wenger excelled in the era when you sent out players who could win the game with their vision. But already by 2005 you can see the limitation of the approach (and especially in europe). The defense simply puts huge pressure on the playmaker and ultimately the turnover creates a dangerous counter. The last truly elite wenger side (07/08)had such quality in midfield it could cope with that - but most of the time Wenger lost big games the same way over and over. This is exactly the same thing that happened in rugby because for a while it was easier to defend than attack. ( I use rugby only because I know how it works) The critical step was to create known patterns that the attacking team can reply on, and in any phase of play, they might be set to use 2 or 3 different patterns. Which one they use will only be decided at the last moment by the receiver. When that phase executes, the player on the ball decides whether to launch another phase. The obvious example is to work the ball to create a mismatch or overload. But because you cannot predict the exact moment or nature of the opportunity, all players need the technical skill set to exploit the opportunity when it appears.
That’s why wide forwards became a thing and withdrawn strikers teams are more tactically aware these days. Back when henry was roasting fat bastards at cb that just kicked people
Off the top of my head... Atletico. Havent paid much attention to them this season but Simeone has almost exclusively run a 4-4-2 his entire career.
I don't think that's fair. Take Henry for example. He came as a somewhat obscure winger and Wenger reinvented him as a striker, of elite proportions. So much so that he was one of the first 2 players chosen to be elected to the new PL Hall of Fame.
Henry and trezaguet were two massive talents at Monaco and really well known he flopped at juve and Wenger gave him a second chance vieira was a great find from Milan but I assume Wenger knew him well from France
Yes. That is why talk of the 10 being dead is total nonsense. Greasy played successfully there, and in part as a throwback support striker, but also as someone who can slot into midfield. In some ways Greizmann was more like the support striker (the so called 10) of 20 years ago.
Yes - Henry was well known but hadn't worked out at Juve @mebeSajid is correct about Viera - he was a top young talent but had no club career to speak of, so Wenger should get the credit for that one
he was already a wide forward or striker years before arsenal juve was wrong because Italian football is slow
The story I've generally heard is that Henry was not really a dedicated striker until he joined Arsenal, and certainly not an elite striker. That's what Wenger is generally credited in doing, specifically by moving him from wing to central. I don't have much time to look this up, but from TH14's Wikipedia page: "Henry signed professional forms with Monaco, and made his professional debut on 31 August 1994, in a 2–0 loss against Nice.[11] Although Wenger suspected that Henry should be deployed as a striker, he put Henry on the left wing because he believed that his pace, natural ball control and skill would be more effective against full backs than centre-backs. ... "Henry left Monaco in January 1999, one year before his intimate and closest teammate David Trezeguet, and moved to Italian club Juventus for £10.5 million.[2] He played on the wing,[14] as well as at wing back and wide midfield, but he was ineffective as a goal scorer, ... "Henry transferred from Juventus on 3 August 1999 to Arsenal for an estimated fee of £11 million, reuniting with his former manager Arsène Wenger.[17][18] It was at Arsenal that Henry made his name as a world-class footballer, ... Henry was immediately moulded into a striker by Wenger, a move that would pay rich dividends in years to come. ... " This is all in support of the idea that Wenger developed him, which someone (honestly can't recall if it was you or Jitty or ??) was challenging.
So, let me get this straight: Wenger can’t be credited with developing Henry because Wenger already developed Henry?
Wenger wasn’t at Monaco the time henry was he was in Japan then I believe? At least when Henry was in the first team Wenger helped produce George Weah Henry was also helped in clairefontaine
It does seem Wenger developed Henry at Monaco All I remembered was he went to Juve at a bit ticket because he was already a hot talent. I remember seeing him for France at World Cup '98
Wenger was there when Monaco identified him and put him in Clairefontaine. Wenger was there when he signed. And it was Wenger who first played him in the senior team (I think Henry had just turned 18 by this point). It wasn’t long after Henry’s debut that Wenger was fired, but there’s no question he was seminal in the development of the player. Henry himself considers Wenger to be his greatest and most influential mentor.
Henry was always considered to be a massive talent, but he was not living up to his potential. Wenger got him at Arsenal and the potential blossomed into one of the five best players in the world.
Jitters, here you go: Arsenal are on the exact same points as last season for the corresponding fixtures but with a chance to improve that with the last 2 matches. They 3 goals better this season and 15.4 expected goals better.— Scott Willis (@scottjwillis) May 17, 2021
Obscure? Are you crazy? Henry just scored four goals in the ‘98 World Cup and we signed him from the best team in the world playing in the best league in the world, for £12 million. Good grief, man.
12 million was a ton of money in 1999. Can't say Henry was obscure, but have to give Wenger a lot of credit for his development.
Yeah But it goes back to what I said earlier. Wenger is a 300 or 400 level college professor, who many, including himself, thought was teaching 9th graders or running a high school. Wenger’s strength was getting supremely talented players over the final hurdle to be ready for Barcelona or Madrid or the Milan clubs. Wenger thought he could take raw talents and turn them into world beaters, which was never his strength. The perfect Wenger development model was van Persie.
https://apple.news/AzvnLgIcxTaaYSVhqnyJFxQ The Evening Standard is quoting Arteta admitting he’s made a lot of mistakes and after the season ends wants to reflect on how to improve. It would be interesting to know what he considers to be his biggest mistakes.