Afterwards i realized I made a mistake. In the post above Kappa is wrong. It should have been Umbro instead. My bad. Until 1994, Brazil NT was sponsored not by Kappa but by Umbro. Umbro was a daughter company of Nike. After success of WC94, Umbro terminated his contract with Selecao and Nike signed a 100 million US Dollars contract with Brazil NT for 10 years. Sorry for the typo.
it's ok mate I made some mistakes and typo myself ...too Here is R9 first PSV shirt in 94 with ADIDAS
Bare in mind this picture was taken first half of the season 1995/96. It was taken in the Summer of 1995. When R9 recently arrived in my little country. I know this cause it is my Club and country and I followed every single step and match and reports of PSV and Ronaldo career in Holland. The day my father drove me to Eindhoven (winter of 1995) to watch the match PSV vs Roda JC, Ronaldo played in the Adidas jersey you have posted here. He scored his back kick goal which can be seen on youtube today. I was right there in that stadium. I was 17 years old and Ronaldo was my #1 idol at the time. But after the winter they already started playing in Nike jersey for the rest of the season in 1996. I know this, because I was there! (by the way, I am still supporter of PSV, my whole family is and we do go see matches from time to time in Eindhoven) like I said in earlier post, the contracts were already on the table since the year before 1995. The negotiations and decisions were already made one year before Adidas contract expired (shown in the video you refused to watch!) which was before R9 even had step foot in Holland. But of course they had to wait until Adidas (expired a year later) before Nike could sign the new contract and become official sponsor (which is obvious. Dhu?). Pay attention that this is not my own speculation or made up story like you often purported me doing, but it is the statement made by Nike "top boss" himself in the Pucks Dutch documentary. I am just the messenger. Again, not me but Nike own words. So do not come back and say, SPECULATION, cause It will make you into a laughing stock, for if you do then it will be your word against the word of Nike. Not you against me, but you against Nike (who signed Ronaldo and knows more about the contract dates then both of us). Have a nice day further.
No I said 1994-95 PSV were still tied up with Philips + ADIDAS from 1995-96 NIKE got their signature on - thanks to R9's
sounds like a joke... ronaldo was at least good and the best rm` player in 2004 in 2005 ucls... the only ucl fail by ronaldo was in 2006 vs arsenal when he was OUT of form due to INJURIES ruined that season and affected his wc performance where he still was the only one who tried to save a match vs france extended view on 2004 and 2005 ucls: 2004 vs bayern (only 1 match due to injury): the only rm` goal was scored with ronaldo`s part: obtained FK for carlos and then confused kahn with his move near the ball which "helped" kahn to make decisive mistake and brought to rm a vital AWAY goal vs monaco: main team force. rm scored 5 goals: very lucky own goal (or almost own), zidane`s OFFSIDE goal + 3 goals with ronaldo`s part (1g + 2a including figo`s goal). after the last raul`s away goal (ronaldo`s assist) real madrid HAD to finish that rivalry comfortably (3 goals advantage) but they failed in defence and totally conceded 5 goals vs monaco. is that ronaldo`s fault?.. stupidity. he made his work which had to be enough to proceed to the next round 2005 vs roma away, last group match: rm either HAD to win or they would have LEFT ucl. and ronaldo showed great performance in this decisive match. vs juve: strong performance, especially in 2nd leg. all these ronaldo`s performances are ou youtube, u may review them. the one thing is obvious: ronaldo was the main hope of the team back then and it totally was FAR from disaster. many know ronaldo as a BIG MATCH MAN and he just could not be week in such matches (excluding rare times).
since 96/97 ronaldo took part in derby barca-rm/milan-inter (LA LAGIA + SERIE A mathces) and he scored there EVERY SEASON if he played at least one match: 96 97, 97 98, 98 99, 99 00 (only 30 min), 02 03, 03 04, 04 05, 05 06, 06 07. and here we can compare ronaldo and messi (without age limiter) in BIG domestic league MATCHES (ronaldo - rm-barca/inter-milan, messi - barca/rm): big chances conversion rate in open play: messi - 10/28 (36%) ronaldo - 8/11 (73%) goal-scoring ratio (goals/90 mins): messi - 0,77 ronaldo - 0,82 all-team-goals/single-player-goals ratio (when this player was on pitch): messi - 35% (14/40) ronaldo - 56% (10/18) appearances with a goal(s) scored: messi - 8/19 (42%) ronaldo 10/14 (71%) ...ONE MORE CRUCIAL THING: ronaldo`s overall GPG ratio in LA LIGA and SERIE A: 0,79! ... it`s LESS then his GPG ratio in big derby! what does it tell?.. ronaldo often played without motivation or just for fun since real madrid` part of career and unfortunately people dont understand that. but in most important league matches ronaldo showed himself and was the most dangerous player of his team, even in milan-inter 2007 match where ronaldo scored a goal out of almost nothing. even at inter times ronaldo was not a goal hunter, excluding 01/02 season when he tried to prove scolari with his goals that he should be taken to wc 2002 (almost 1 gpg in 10 caps without PK goals)
here u may see the difference between ronaldo and, for example, maradona. ronaldo got WORLDWIDE recognition at the youngest age among great players and he did not want to prove something to anybody. maradona`s worldwide recognition came with wc 86 (25 age) while ronaldo at 25 (even despite horrible injuries) just did set a final confirmation of his greatness. for pure talent: ronaldo was more talented than both pele/maradona, its like a new processor by intel with advanced technologies. i think only either pele/maradona/messi`s etc worshipers or just persons without ability to see football gift inside a man can deny that. ...but i also was impressed with maradona, especially his ball control. ronaldo and maradona both had great mentality, especially ronaldo who could lead any team at any conditions (milan 2007 with pirlo, seedorf, PRIME kaka at 30 years old being post-injured and overweighted). btw, it seems maradona at the same age played the weekest time at napoli with only PK goals in SERIE A.
and of course pele is overrated. he is like a myth of antique greece. i mean of course he is among greatest players but is he GOD above all??? its just idolarity. ...or why do elder people in brazil say "garrincha was better"?.. maybe garrincha wasn`t but still... such opinions from experienced football fans also make sence. i wish pele played without injuries in wc 62 and 66 but sadly he didn`t. but brazil taking a world cup without his best player who was injuried DURING 62 tournament (not before), and still WINNING wc scoring 3-4 goals in play-offs - it makes sence.
"ronaldo was not consistent" or "ronaldinho gaucho played 2 seasons at high level" - examples of stupidity at its best... people need to know all player`s career to make such statements... ronaldinho was already very good in wc 2002 (david seaman confirms that) and in psg times u may say "he is not consistent" ONLY if this player is MOTIVATED to play (cr7 is great example of always motivated player). ...and ronaldo of course was consistent when he was motivated - big derby analisys is a confirmation of that. u also may see how motivated (desire to comeback in NT) 32 y.o. ronaldo (+1 more big injury) becomes the most important player for corinthians taking the responsibility and bringing them paulista and copa do brazil in 2009. pele wasn`t happy when ronaldo scored twice in 1st paulista 2009 final at SANTOS stadium and almost buried them)))
This is completely inaccurate, Maradona was already labeled a heir to Pele at age 19. And unlike Ronaldo, he would prove true to the challenge.
this is accurate because all is RELATIVELY. by the age of 21, ronaldo already proved himself in europe (holland, spain, italy) and was a dominant man in football. at 21 maradona only turned to europe. his great plays in argentina is not a great proof in terms of WORLDWIDE recognition. btw, even at 22-23 maradona did not do what ronaldo did at 20 when both played for barca )))))
didn`t see that at 1st time. yeah, messi`s club career is better but we all saw what a player messi is THROUGHOUT international tournaments "messi is the world`s best player only inside barca" - it is not just a words
Maradona was more dominant in football by age 21 than Ronaldo was at the same age. And he was already known worldwide, anytime a player is seriously compared to Pele he will be recognized across all continents. Also, Barcelona sent their scout to watch him when he was 18. True, Ronaldo's 96-97 season is better than either of Maradona's in Barcelona. But Maradona's 1979 season with Argentinos Juniors is one of the legendary seasons by a player ever, and better than any of Ronaldo's.
This is HUGELY debatable.firstly you would have to prove that the strength of Argentinan football in the late 1970s was on par with a top 5 major European league and specifically la liga in 1996/97
The year 1980 is a very different story but he does get often a very easy ride for the 1979 year. If you like I can try to expand on that in detail later. There are some similarities between both their career trajectory, certainly. If you talk about the age of 21 specifically (roughly speaking 1981-82 vs 1997-98), then I'd give that to Ronaldo.
La Liga in 96-97 is still behind Serie A, although having made strides in closing the gap, but their teams are still not dominant in European competition. The Argentine league of the late 70s features historical sides such as Independiente with Bochini, Bertoni, Pavoni, Trossero, Marangoni, Giusti, Larrosa, Boca Juniors with Gatti, Brindisi, Sa, Tarantini, Mouzo, Mastrangelo, Pernia, and River Plate with Passarella, Fillol, Perfumo, Gallego, Alonso, Lopez, Luque. At the top, I would put these three sides as better than the best three sides of La Liga in 96-97.
I see basically two dubious claims being made. I'll try to tackle both. Maradona in 1979 had a better year than Ronaldo in 1996-97. I absolutely don't agree with that and bucketloads of junta propaganda and corridor schmoozing (FIFA 1979 exhibition games) cannot conceal the naked data and match grades (against the big opponents) for what's ultimately a sprinter type of athlete and Kempes his direct replacement. Maradona at the age of 21 (late October 1981 to October 1982) was better than Ronaldo at the age of 21 (September 1997 to September 1998). Absolutely disagree with that too. I'll try to show that first. I'm aware that Maradona still ended 3rd in the 1982 SAPOTY, but there the true nature of the award got greatly exposed. I'll start with the first.
Instead of making one very long post I'll do it in snippets (note: I said explicitly that 1980 is a different piece of cake). One main aspect people often claim and use as a 'hedge' is that Ronaldo was a striker. While I do agree that goals and 'end product' was slightly more important for him, the difference is not as big as it is sometimes made out. Also for the type of forward (at AJ) as Maradona was, it was a very important component (there are also forwards who are more committed to the team side, selfless off-the-ball runs, pressing side etc. but it was not a big part of these two young and explosive players). This gives a good glimpse into my thoughts regarding player attributes: http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads...o-as-best-ever.2016490/page-531#post-33868700 http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads...o-as-best-ever.2016490/page-537#post-33878405 http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads...o-as-best-ever.2016490/page-536#post-33875328 http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads...o-as-best-ever.2016490/page-543#post-33892235 If you talk about the domestic club game 1979 vs 1996-97 then we first need to establish the competition they beat. I'm not in favor of name dropping but Ronaldo 1996-97 beat Alfonso, Suker, Raul and Rivaldo in the scoring charts. Rather than just taking the aura of the name for granted (hearsay), it's easy to see what their pedigree was on the international stage (as a verification of their level, as in 'how good was the league'). Alfonso is the 'smallest' name out there but even he scored 11 goals in 38 for Spain NT, and has 13 goals in 35 matches at the European level (scoring against Chelsea, Kaiserslautern etc.). Not a super record, and not a super player to beat, but we'll see how it stacks up against the 1979 names. Maradona (14 goals, 3PK) in 1979 Metropolitano finished equal or beat: Fortunato (14 goals), Larraquy (10 goals) and several with 9 goals (Outes and Mastrangelo are the two who stand out of that group). Fortunato (14 goals) jumped to Europe in 1980, and scored 2 in 12 games at Serie A and then 4 goals in 33 Primera Division matches. He has zero goals in Europe and zero goals at the Copa Libertadores (while he played in there). It looks better that he did score 7 goals in 15 games for the world champion though (1978-1980), when lined up or subbed in for the national team. Larraquy (10 goals) did not go to Europe. He has in 5 Copa Libertadores games 0 goals, in 4 national team games zero goals. Babington (9 goals) is out of these easily the player who had the most illustrious career (although in Europe he only played in the 2nd Bundesliga; 46 goals in 120). He scored 2 goals in 13 games for the national team, and 4 goals in 7 Copa Libertadores games. Mastrangelo (9 goals) scored 1 goal in 8 national team games. 8 goals in 34 Copa Libertadores matches. Nortberto Outes (9 goals) scored 0 goals in 3 national team games, 5 goals in 16 Copa Libertadores matches. Trama (9 goals) has 3 goals in 16 Copa Libertadores matches. Did not play for the national team. The same can be done with the 1979 Nacional (12 goals, 4PK). I don't spell that out fully because that will make it too long. His main rival (in terms of scoring) was then Humberto Bravo (10 goals), who had just come back from the French First Division where he scored 5 goals in 24 games (no NT or Copa Libertadores matches). Forget the aura of the names (i.e. the aura of a Rivaldo, or Suker) but Ronaldo in 1996-97 beat quite obviously names with a stronger international resume (= individual scoring abroad, continental club or NT). Names who demonstrated the quality of themselves and the league by scoring in UEFA competitions. Maradona in 1979 couldn't compete against 1978 heroes as Kempes, Bertoni, Villa, Ardiles, Tarantini either as they played abroad. All other players with a high league scoring ratio as Bianchi (0.64), Scotta (0.56), Morete (0.50) were active abroad too. Babington with 0.41 is the highest on the list (minimum of 100 league goals). This is only one aspect (but still a big aspect for both type of players), and this will be continued, but in terms of domestic goalscoring it's quite obviously a stretch to suggest that Maradona was better in 1979. Ronaldo also beat those names by a much bigger margin (9 goals clear). ... to be continued as said
.... continued. Support cast The support cast has to be taken into account of course and it's true that Barcelona spent a lot for 1996-97. Including Ronaldo they spent 40 million, and their net spending was almost certainly more than the previous 7 years combined. This is where Ronaldo has maybe an edge, although he also competed against players with stronger international records (imho) and was 9 goals clear. That doesn't mean however that Argentinos Juniors (1979-1980) of 1st Army Corps general Suarez-Mason was some obscure pub team without finances, access and possibilities (for ex. 400k extra subsidy by AFA). They acquired e.g. Pasculli (20 caps for Argentina, 5 goals; 29 goals in 119 Serie A matches; 6 goals in 14 Coppa Italia games) to help Maradona score more goals, and do better in the charts. International club performances Everyone knows about Ronaldo in 1996-97. He won the Cup Winners Cup, scored 5 goals (1PK) in 7 games and a couple of assists (1 or 2). You can argue about how amazing it was but he did something, at least. Maradona has a couple of goals against Colombian club teams in 1979, but that's it and hardly amazing (certainly back then). He started to perform against international clubs in 1980 and 1981. That includes some rematches (for ex. not scoring against NY Cosmos in 1979, but scored in 1980). http://people.ufpr.br/~mmsabino/sstatistics/maradona.html This can be contrasted against Zico who in 1979 at least scored against Atletico Madrid, PSG, Barcelona in international games (in 1979). http://people.ufpr.br/~mmsabino/sstatistics/zico.html http://web.archive.org/web/20100420...nrpub/variedade/cadgols/lista_jogos.php?OP=11 So this is another argument for why it's a stretch to say Maradona in 1979 was better than Ronaldo in 1996-97 (who performed internationally, and by miles). For Maradona in 1979 it is basically blank, when he played in tours and matches. (final part in next post)
National team performances I'm sure many would again say goals (and assists) are a lot more important for Ronaldo, but it's closer than many nowadays think. As Maradona writes in his autobiography, he directly replaced the unavailable Kempes. Who had scored 16 goals in the previous 20 caps (3 years) for the national team and world champions. In 1979 Maradona scored 2 goals and 1 assist in 7 games (11 goals scored by team), against Scotland and Bolivia. Plus a goal in an organized match against an official FIFA XI to 'celebrate' the 1st anniversary of the world cup win (those three FIFA events/promotion certainly helped for spreading the word). Ronaldo in 1996-97 (until Copa America) had 10 goals (2PK) and 5 assists in 11 games for the world champions (team scored 27 goals). Then there's the Copa America itself as bonus obviously (no need to elaborate). For an electric attacker it helps a lot to play in a strong team of course, because you're not wasting too much energy then (among other benefits). Now, despite that you can still believe that Maradona in 1979 played markedly better (was more decisive/important/influential) but let me remind then the 'El Grafico' grades in those matches. Grades by their 'own' partisan magazine (certainly at that time). 10 vs Bulgaria 10 vs Scotland (1 goal, 1 assist) 10 vs Ireland 8 vs Brazil 8 vs Bolivia (1 goal) 8 vs Netherlands 7 vs Italy 6 vs World XI (1 goal) It's not like that it (level of play, importance) was insensitive to the level of opponents the world champion played. I don't have such thing of Placar for Ronaldo however. Finally (to not make it too long), it's also true that Ronaldo was immediately a success at his first major tournament (1997CA). Maradona for the world champions wasn't a resounding success at the 1980 Mundialito (two 4/6 grades by France Football) and then not at the 1982 World Cup. So in short and in sum I tend to agree with @carlito86 that it is a huge call to say he was better in 1979 than Ronaldo in 1996-97. The same is btw also true for "at the age of 21" (when Maradona had moved to Boca Juniors, on paper a better team).