Did you see when he got in the Holland game? Subbing him in should have made the team better.............
No, but chances are I could describe most of them for you. Somebody else makes a brilliant play that either gets gifted to his feet by a pass or by a bad clearance or a good bounce, and he finishes it... Also, club soccer is not the national team... I don't care if he is tireless in Germany, if he isn't going to do it for the nationals I don't want him and Bruce won't want him. He still hasn't show he can (strangely similar to Razov). Landon and BMB work twice as hard as he and create chances not just for themselves but for other people. He also has no idea how to play defense... his defense is just fouling guys (again, oddly similar to Razov). There are reasons why Clint doesn't start. He probably never will start if Adu turns into what he is supposed to by the time McBride retires... which I don't think will be any time soon.... giving Adu just enough time to win that third striker spot... excpet maybe Adu will be our answer wide right.
don't thank me. thank bigfoot. he uploaded them. i merely provided the link. you should check out the yanks abroad forum from time to time. we follow our boys pretty religiously and there is plenty of more stuff like this over there... game results, in-depth analysis, video clips, and lots and lots of great banter (we're a different breed of bigsoccer poster).
Thats fine, but you just describe ante razov... until he starts showing up for the national team I don't think he deserves to be on the field...
did you actually look at those goals, or did you simply make a knee-jerk comment and ignore my post? note: RAZOV COULDN'T SCORE LIKE THAT IF HE HAD A $100 DOLLAR BILL STICKING OUT OF HIS PANTS.
I didn't look at the goals because it doesn't show me the other 75 minutes he spends half-heartedly wandering the pitch. I think Clint is second in finishing and goalscoring only to LD, but he doesn't do anything else that makes me want to compare the two.... the finished product doesn't tell me how it was made. and why is everybody shorting Keller? The guy shouldn't lose points because Howard stepped up. He still is one of the three best on the team....
you are doing yourself a serious diservice by not viewing those goals. i was not exaggerating when i said that they were some of the prettiest that i have ever seen an american score... and they were all within one month! mathis is going to be a force to reckon with during qualifying. i guarantee it. for future reference, do you like your crow well-done? p.s. seriously, watch the goals.
you're not understanding... i don't care about the goals (and i did watch them) playing forward on the us mens national team isn't just about scoring and saying he will be a force to be reckoned with means he is going to beat out mcbride and landon for a starting spot....... do you really think that will happen?
its not JUST about scoring... we have guys who finish relatively as well as Clint but do the OTHER THINGS TOO. And more seem to be coming through the system with twellman and adu... even josh wolff makes me more comfortable with his work ethic... we aren't at the level of some of the superpowers around the world (yet) to be able to have one not involve for a good portion of the game.... even if he is a great finisher. and especially if he were to play attacking mid... I've yet to see clint consistently create for anyone but himself... Arena wouldn't putting him there... that would be like putting Hejduk at center back.
landon donovan is the only american player you could even argue that is as good or better than clint at finishing. i understand completely what you are saying, as well. you are making the mcbride arguement for guys like wolff and twellman... not an amazing strike rate at the international level but makes his teammates look so much better and always works his ass off. anyone with a higher work rate than clint must be a better alternative... the problem is, wolff and twellman (as well as guys like razov, kirovski, cunningham, noonan, buddle, etc) are relatively one dimensional predictable players on the international level. they either have an abundance of skill and no nose for the goal or are physical specimens lacking technique. none of these guys fit mcbride's description (although one may develop). clint definately doesn't. why? because mcbride is a one of a kind. he is the only dominant target forward we have and he is an automatic in the usa lineup. and with a target forward you always need.... ... a ruthless finisher playing off of him to make it work. right now, that player is donovan, but clint is the next best thing followed by the score of previously mentioned forwards. but then again, i never said clint would be playing striker. i call shenanigans. clint has played a-mid numerous times for club (both metro and hannover96) and country. have you even seen him play in the last two years? the only time he even looked good for metro after his injury was when he was in the middle of the field. lastly, i think we all know how clint can play when he is healthy and motivated (something that hasn't happened since 2001). well guess what? he is healthy and motivated.
he has never played attacking mid for country.. every time they put him in they drop landon back. If BA wanted to play clint there he had his opportunity in holland, but he dropped landon back... so nice try... and playing attacking mid at a midlevel (barely) german club is almost like playing attacking mid for any team in scotland that isn't in glascow.... it doesn't impress me as much as you want it to. and the next forward to possible (and altogether probably) slide into that ruthless finisher's role will be adu... the kid has gotten more attention than donovan and hopefully will live up to his expectations... but i guess he won't be taking mathis' role. chances are (since I'm taking your vision of BA's lineup at face value) clint will always be third striker... healthy and motivated should serve him and I'm all for him playing well, but he has yet to play a full 90, or even a full half of quality soccer, without disappearing for strecthes of time, for our full nats... our team at this point needs more than just a finisher. the minute he does I'm getting behind him, but because he has had so many chances to prove himself I'm getting behind some of our youth that need that chance to make us a better national team.
I like Clint's game and think he's one of the top US players. However, his style does present some problems for the US because of how the team generally plays. Bruce likes to have a big target type forward up top, so McBride's an automatic choice until some youngster knocks him off the pedestal. Bruce likes him paired with a smaller, quicker striker and Donovan and even Wolf when healthy make more sense in that role, so it's hard for Clint to get a spot up front, and when he does, he's being asked to play a game that doesn't really play to his strengths. In midfield, he's problematic again as he is more of an attacker and high rick player and doesn't really hold the ball too well and doesn't seem to be really adept at dictating the speed of play, the job Reyna does. He's also clearly not a ball winner, which Bruce likes to have out there and uses Armas or someone else for. Using Mathis instead of Reyna does make us more offensive minded and quick attacks would be frequent. I'd expect us to score more goals. However, if you've got a center mid tandem of Armas and Mathis, expect a ton of turnovers. To use Mathis in midfield, we'd need a defensive midfield player with better passing and possession skills than Armas or Pablo. If Reyna or O'Brien could be motivated to be more hard-nosed ball-winners, either of them may make a nice pair with Clint. If I were going to go in this direction, I'd lean toward Claudio because I think his ball-winning skills are very underrated. Then, we run into the problem of loosing O'Brien in the center as well. However you look at it, Clint's just a tough fit for the US team, no matter how good he is. Hopefully, Bruce will figure out a way to get him on the field and get the best out of him, since he does seem to me to be one of the team's most creative and dangerous players. If he keeps playing well in Germany, it will be interesting to see where he fits in come 2006.
Go cue the Mexico qualifier in Colombus. Or Brazil 4 days later. So you think the Holland game tells us everything about what Bruce wants to do? Hope Mexico et.al. don't figure that out That's just stupid. Goals against Munich and Leverkusen don't either? Oh yeah, goals don't impress you. Is that why strikers make more money and garner the highest transfer fees of anyone? Again. Stupid. The kid is FOURTEEN. There is nothing "probable" about it. Healthy Clint and a smart Bruce Arena - neither are guaranteed from a historical perspective - and you're wrong. Fans with short memories are the worst kind there are. Leading scorer for the NT 2002 - or does that not matter? OK, 2003 with the NT wasn't so great, but it was for who exactly? 2004 - Hottest US player by far in Europe. It seems as though if it were up to you, we'd field a team full of hard workers, and we'd never put a ball in the net. Work rate is overrated when it comes to talent like Clint's, and his work rate is just fine. Don't believe me? Try and guess who said this: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/soccer/us/news/2003/02/05/us_quotes/
I totally agree with you, but that only in the mind of Bruce Arena is he a tough fit. It is the job of the coach to mold his team to his players, not the other way around. Can anyone see the key word in this part. Hint: It's the first one.
thank you flan for the dose of sanity. danjeb, you are being a bit of a revisionist. clint is the most unpredictable and creative player currently wearing a usnats jersey. i don't deny that he has had some serious fitness/motivation problems in the past, but to ignore his talent because of that is rediculous given his huge upside and current form.
So you are saying our regular starting eleven can't put balls in the net? Hell yes I'd field the hardest working skilled players we have (which Arena has done nicely), because GOOD GRIEF, Mathis ain't Ronaldo or Henry (he ain't even Donovan)... his finishing skill isn't worth the 80 minutes you have to wait for it to appear. And it isn't all work ethic... that was just one example. He can work as hard as he wants... until he starts doing the things the rest of our forwards do... his return isn't worth the risk. He should be learning in Germany, who knows if he will show it for our nats. And dude... I know Adu's birth certificate says 14 but I'm skeptical... african birth certificates are sketchy... and regardless, he's this young and going to playing for DC and is getting more media than donovan was and is a pretty damn good player (except he holds the ball too much) already and is only going to improve, so I stand by my statement that he will end up ahead of mathis on our depth chart by the time mcbride retires. European powerhouses wouldn't have wanted him if it wasn't "probable" NO... Reyna is the most creative... LD is probably the most unpredictable... and I'm just weighing it out... his talent AT FINISHING is great, but that isn't everything... I see it as kind of like Anelka... he is a hell of a finisher and should be paired with Henry in terms of skill, but the pros of playing another striker with a little bit less skill and a better attitude, workrate, etc... outweigh Anelka's cons... sure, he's probably better skillwise than his replacement, but not by enough. You guys are overestimating Clint's skills and are putting him way above everyone else... the gap between him and guys like Wolff and even Twellman aren't that big... and they bring other things to the table. I don't understand "revisionist" I don't know what I've revised.
i'm sorry, but reyna is not as creative as clint. one might argue that he has more skill or is even the best player we have, but he does not create as many chances and has never been comfortable attacking. that is the main arguement that people have against reyna-- he holds up the attack and stunts creative fastbreak type soccer. reyna is a holding/d-mid and is very good at it, but he is not a number 10... at best, he has played one on tv for sunderland. you are completely ignoring the fact that for a period of a little under two years clint mathis was doing a very good maradona impression. you remember the fact that he got seriously hurt, stunk up the joint for (another) two years, and moved on. now he is lighting up the bundesliga, arguably the 4th best league in the world, and has scored rediculous goals against teams like bayer leverkusen and hamburg. and you are ignoring this as well. that makes you a revisionist. you are picking and choosing what you want to remember in order to back up your opinion that clint is worthless.
just because reyna doesn't play fast doesn't mean he isn't creative... he puts the ball where it needs to be, many times when he is in the offensive third. and I'm basing my opinion of clint on his national team play. I could care less what he has done in germany... I don't think playing there is such a big deal anyway, mainly because if LD had stayed on lever, he probably would be their best player right now. and regardless of that, I don't care what McBride or Boca or Landon or anyone else does on their club team, as long as they perform at the international level. I watch him play for our nats and, yes... see a very talented finisher, but I don't see him being anywhere near as good as our starters and I see many of our subs being just as effective regardless of how skillful they are. He still hasn't played a game where his contribution doesn't "disappear" I like playing with a goalie and 10 guys that will do everything. Once he starts doing that for our nats I will be grateful.
obviously we will have to agree to disagree. i propose we simply let clint decide who's right with his play during qualifying. deal?
sounds like you've given up... but i'll happily wait and let his play do the talking... its too bad he isn't on the roster for the haiti game and it sucks ******** that its only on directtv payperview
Hey, In describing Clint's role with the nats, we must utilise him to the best of his particular strengths. To describe him as a true #10, is like trying to fit a square peg in to a round hole, in that he lacks the vision, and range of passing, yet possesses great finishing skill, a cannon of a shot, and a willingness to take on defenders. If anything, I would liken him to a David Platt type player, one that sits behind the fowards, running in to space from midfield to take on players, and provide preassure. With the aging of Claudio Reyna, and our traditional lack of a playmaker, I feel this is an ideal system for the future of our midfield, and goes along well with our individual personell.