Match 45: GHA : URU - SIEBERT (GER)

Discussion in 'World Cup 2022 - Refereeing' started by balu, Nov 30, 2022.

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What do you think of Siebert's performance?

Poll closed Dec 3, 2022.
  1. 1 (worst)

    15.0%
  2. 2

    5.0%
  3. 3

    35.0%
  4. 4

    15.0%
  5. 5

    20.0%
  6. 6

    10.0%
  7. 7

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. 8

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  9. 9

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. 10 (best)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Barc@4ever

    Barc@4ever Member

    Barcelona
    Jul 21, 2020
    Wasn't that a corner for Ghana ?
     
    Sport Billy repped this.
  2. AremRed

    AremRed Member+

    Sep 23, 2013
    Get absolutely ********ed Uruguay. Shameful.
     
    duality72 repped this.
  3. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Those post tournament yellow cards are really going to show Uruguay!

    I can't help but shake my head. So much of this was predictable.
     
    JasonMa, Jon Stakes, StarTime and 3 others repped this.
  4. RedStar91

    RedStar91 Member+

    Sep 7, 2011
    Club:
    FK Crvena Zvezda Beograd
    Disgraceful from Uruguay and disgraceful from the referees. Stand up for yourselves. Could riddance to Uruguay. Couldn't have happened to a more deserving team.
     
    Lloyd Heilbrunn, mfw13, JasonMa and 2 others repped this.
  5. USSF REF

    USSF REF Guest

    Ugly scenes here.

    Concacaf got nuthin on Uruguay.
     
    JasonMa, Jon Stakes and duality72 repped this.
  6. AremRed

    AremRed Member+

    Sep 23, 2013
    Needed to pull out the red and keep holding it up.
     
    JasonMa and Jon Stakes repped this.
  7. El Rayo Californiano

    Feb 3, 2014
    Cavani and Giménez. Any others?
     
    JasonMa and Jon Stakes repped this.
  8. Sport Billy

    Sport Billy Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 25, 2006
    The shove of the official on the way out will hopefully be punished post-match.
     
    mfw13, JasonMa, Jon Stakes and 1 other person repped this.
  9. MetroFever

    MetroFever Member+

    Jun 3, 2001
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    Is it safe to say that some online video will pop up soon, showing them doing something worse in the hallway?
     
    mfw13, JasonMa, Jon Stakes and 5 others repped this.
  10. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If that doesn't sum up everything right there I don't know what does. You have Seibert holding up the yellow cards for red card offenses after a team has been eliminated. Just show the red cards and let them have the suspensions for upcoming qualifiers.
     
    mfw13, JasonMa, TyffaneeSue and 8 others repped this.
  11. El Rayo Californiano

    Feb 3, 2014
    It certainly looked like Muslera continued to berate the AR as they entered the tunnel.
     
    JasonMa, Jon Stakes and MetroFever repped this.
  12. RedStar91

    RedStar91 Member+

    Sep 7, 2011
    Club:
    FK Crvena Zvezda Beograd
    The well eventually had to run dry for Germany. They went from Merk to Fandel to Stark to Brych over a span of what 25+ years of elite officiating (Fandel wasn't elite, but he somehow convinced UEFA to give him a CL Final and Euro 2008 invite and took advantage of the vacuum after Merk's retirement).

    This was bad, especially when compared to watching Brych.
     
    mfw13, JasonMa, gaolin and 2 others repped this.
  13. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just going to drop this post from Tuesday right here:

     
  14. soccerref69420

    soccerref69420 Member+

    President of the Antonio Miguel Mateu Lahoz fan cub
    Mar 14, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea DPR
    For those of us who missed this game, can anyone give a quick summary? It seems like a lot of chaos so I’ll probably end up watching the whole thing later but I’d like to know what to see
     
  15. pr0ner

    pr0ner Member+

    Jan 13, 2007
    Alexandria, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was waiting for him to pull out red there. He didn't, panicked, and ran away.

    I do wonder what Uruguay's players would have done if he had started handing out reds there, though.
     
  16. USSF REF

    USSF REF Guest

    They world give a shit. It would have probably inflamed it. Get out of there!
     
    duality72 repped this.
  17. StarTime

    StarTime Member+

    United States
    Oct 18, 2020
    I've been critical of the penalty decision, and I don't think Siebert has the management skills for this sort of game, but the Uruguay reaction has nothing to do with Siebert's skills. It's all about the penalty decision. You could be the best referee in the World on that field and, assuming he made the same call as Siebert, the players would've chased him down the tunnel as well. So with regards to whether or not this assignment was a bridge too far for Siebert, I don't think the scenes at the end are evidence of that.

    I don't think it was realistic to expect any ref to start going gung-ho with the cards there at a World Cup, as much as I'd love to see that in my wildest fantasies. Any referee at this level is just going to try to get out of there instead of showing a bunch of mostly consequence-free cards just to make a point (unfortunately).
     
    duality72 repped this.
  18. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    But, would you (or the best referee in the world, rather) have made the same call as Siebert?

    You gave a relatively soft penalty for Ghana using VAR after annulling a very close offside (that latter part isn't your fault, but it's part of the perceived reality). You then get invited to give a penalty to Uruguay on a pretty substantial physical foul and you look for an out on the technicality of the ball being nicked. And in the overall context, you know the world expects a penalty here. There hasn't been a single OFR rejected all tournament. Now, that's not to say a bad recommendation shouldn't be rejected. But was this it? Was this the hill to die on?

    Sorry, but Siebert made his bed here. You don't give the penalty because you're afraid of the consequences if you don't. But understanding the overall context, atmospherics and sense of justice here would steer you away from any inclination to deny this OFR. Siebert went looking for something that he didn't have to find and it resulted in the wrong decision and led to all the stuff at the end that he wasn't equipped to handle. I've got very little sympathy.
     
  19. soccerref69420

    soccerref69420 Member+

    President of the Antonio Miguel Mateu Lahoz fan cub
    Mar 14, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea DPR
     
  20. RedStar91

    RedStar91 Member+

    Sep 7, 2011
    Club:
    FK Crvena Zvezda Beograd
    It's about having some pride and self-respect and standing up for yourself and standing up for your profession/referee trade.

    It's about having courage and self-respect to not allow someone to walk all over you and run away.

    Just gutless in a tournament full of professional referees not willing to do the right thing sometimes.
     
    StarTime and AremRed repped this.
  21. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Every Grassroots ref in the world is let down by a referee getting shoved at the World Cup and only yellow cards being shown.
     
  22. Jon Stakes

    Jon Stakes Member+

    Egypt
    Nov 18, 2022
    Exactly. Should have red carded the lot.
     
  23. RefIADad

    RefIADad Member+

    United States
    Aug 18, 2017
    Des Moines, IA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If this is as bad as you’re describing it:

    1) What should Uruguay’s penalty be? I’d say at least a 3 point penalty to start the 2026 qualifiers.

    2) Is there a current referee who would have had a prayer of managing that?
     
  24. pr0ner

    pr0ner Member+

    Jan 13, 2007
    Alexandria, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Showing red to Uruguayan players there wouldn't be "consequence free".
     
  25. Jon Stakes

    Jon Stakes Member+

    Egypt
    Nov 18, 2022
    If they went any further ban them for half a year or a year from club football. And call the cops on them.
     
    StarTime repped this.

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