excellent post... couldn't agree more 'cept about RvN... i saw the jerk for what he really was right from the time he joined MU, even though i wasn't an arsenal fan or even really into footie at the time... anyway, a 3-game ban is a star, i guess...
Thats a joke, seriously, you conned the ref at Fulham you dived against pompey, u had a cross bar as a friend not to mention other incidents that occured. You can stick yer 50 up yer ass.
Hoyte is also home grown. But yes, AW has done an excellent job at persuading young talent from other teams to join us. It is quite a young group that I listed, but most have had a pretty good amount of experience for their age. Would I want them all out there together. No, but filling in here and there I think they would do a good job. Really I would say there is more talent in the waiting for Arsenal while Utd has more experience to call upon.
Then you speak out of ignorance and disrespect for all those that took the time to post. Two penalty decisions - the first a bad one given, the second a good one not given. That's fair to all those with an understanding of fairness. Everyone who spoke about the game built this game up. It's certainly the game of the Premiership season so far and may be more important to both teams than the return. That's what comes of posting without listening to what others have to say. Utd began the season with nine first choice players out. Only slowly have those players come back. What we're now seeing, hopefully, is a return of the cohesion that can only come from consistent team selection. What this match told us is that this team can match Arsenal's best (possibly the best in Europe currently) even without that cohesion. You should worry about how this team will play when that cohesion builds. Yep! Not only have Utd turned the corner and Arsenal lost some confidence but will opposition teams return to fearing Utd more and Arsenal less. That makes a big difference. It will be an interesting time though I think too much weight can be put on the very next match - it will be difficult to motivate either squad of players after such an epic battle. You did that for yourself with your loutish behaviour last season. Finally Wenger got to know what his slack attitude towards discipline had allowed his team to become. This season you have learned that you're not invincible. You exaggerate, of course Unfortunately there's nothing quite like a seige mentality to motivate players. The "free world" knows nothing of the sort and the Arsenal players have merely caught Wenger's paranoia (the intellectual's red mist). It can build you up, it can knock you down. It's up to Wenger to see that it's the first and that's why he's ranting about bent refs, bent players, cheating ............ It's pathetic really but that's what he has to do. Sour grapes and wishful thinking. It might just as easily be the turning point of the season with Utd finally realising the potential their squad has and Arsenal losing confidence. Neither of us knows! You hope for the former, we for the latter. Merely goes to show that Arsenal fans do not have the quality perception and judgement of some of their players. And yet he's NEVER served a ban of any sort since coming to Utd. Any Arsenal player with any sort of Premiership experience say that? Must be those bent refs again. You guys need to grow up. Your all conquering team was matched by a Utd team just returning from a savage injury situation and when players are still getting to know each other. What frightens you guys, and pleases us, is that it indicates that there may well be much more than this to come. Any objective look at the first squad reveals an individual quality that goes beyond anything in any other Premiership squad. The attacking combination of RvN, Rooney, Ronaldo, Giggs and Scholes with Saha and Smith on the bench and a defence marshalled by the superb Rio Ferdinand (who in a matter of a couple of matches has proven himself the best defender in the game) is a mouth-watering combination. Currently they are merely the sum of their talents. What Arsenal fans fear is what happens when cohesion clicks in, confidence is restored and this squad plays to their full potential.
I was so happy when I looked at the end result, One thing I didn't like was that Smith came on so late, and he managed to assist Rooney for the second goal, and today he scored a brilliant goal in their 3-0 Carling Cup fixture. Now that Ruud is out, I hope Smith will start with Rooney upfront.
LOL. As I said, the Pompey game and successive games will tell us if there is any 'kick start' to your season. Can't blame it on Rio out this time. Pressure on us as well. How we do v. Soton will say a lot. It will be extremely hard to win the title this season for you guys. 3 things has to happen. 1) You'll have to go on a phenominal run. 2) Arsenal will have to go into a big slip. 3) Chelsea will have to go into a slip. In the past either club just had to wait for the other to slip up but 2 clubs? Not likely. We may very well slip up, but Chelsea as well? And you guys go on a run? Too many things has to happen. I'd love to see the odds on that at a bookie and make some easy money against it happening.
See seasons: 2002/03 1995/96 We've been behind early before storming back in the past. When teams see us creeping up in the rear view mirror, panic starts to set in, and its only a matter of getting in a good run of games like we've done many times in the past. The talent is there, and this team is just starting to finally come together.
What you fail to realize is that there are 28 games left. That is in our favor... we were able to take the form team in England and shut them down offensively and win a game when that team's defense played well for most of the game. The lead stands at 8 points right now... its 6 behind Chelsea all that takes is 4 draws for you and 4 wins for us to tie you. I understand that its not 100% that simple, but there are quality teams out there. You have to play Newcastle twice, Boro again... Chelse twice, us again Spurs twice, Liverpool twice and Man City again... I really don't think its completely out of the question for your team to drop 12 points or so from those 10 fixtures... If you win 5 and draw 4 and lose just one you still drop 11 points. I am not saying that you will drop 11 points or so from those fixtures but some people seem to act like its impossible for Arsenal to drop points let alone lose a match. At the same time those people seem to think its improbable for us to go on a long streak of our own and out perform Arsenal and Chelsea when we have done these things in the past. The one thing that really is in our favor I think is the injury/rest situation. You guys have good cover on the wings but when Henry is tied down or rested you are not a world class team and Arsenal is very dependent on him. Ronaldo has not really struck form for us so far. Giggs has been consistent, Rooney has shown flashes Scholes has been poor up until the match against you guys, Ruud injured, Saha injured and Smith has been stellar but with the return from injury of Ruud and Rooney he is on the bench. We clearly don't depend on just one player and have done very well considering the amount of injuries we have had. Other than Rio I dont see us being liable to a collapse due to injury. I agree that you have a versatile team but Henry makes things tick and Bergkamp is a class player as well but he needs someone to pass to. If Henry gets injured even for just a month it would prove very difficult for Arsenal to perform at a world class level. When you consider how well things have gone for you guys so far in terms of injuries or lack thereof one can begin to see a chink in the armour of Arsenal especially when things get hot in 3 competitions. Even if you only lose a Pires/Reyes... one of them has to take up the slack and play more games and that affects the striker situation because with Bergkamp not flying and Reyes playing in his spot at support striker who then do you play at LW? I admit we have similar problems on the wing in terms of chosing someone to stick in there, but its not like we have been highly dependent on any one of our attacking players other than Smith who is our 3rd choice striker. This wont sit well with many gooners and alot of it is supposition but with 28 games left in the season nothing is certain well nothing apart from Arsenal not going 2 seasons undefeated in a row.
Is this ALL you guys can talk about? The game's over. Get over it. Time to move on. (and all the other cliches you guys are tossing about over on the Arsenal board)
In 02/03, in mid November, a month later than now, ManU were 9 points behind Arse. ManU had a crappy start to the season, tieing Sunderland and losing to the like oof Bolton, Leeds, and Citeh. Who finished on top of the league by 5 points in the end? ya. not Arse. It was ManU. Seems to me Arse has failed to seal the deal when they've lead come Boxing Day just as much if not more often than they've actually managed to win the title. Save the talk about who's going to slip up until spring time.
Arsenal will drop 9 points between now and June. So will Chelsea. I...well, I'll actually guarantee it. So, then, the only real question is whether United can have a run sufficient to win it. My guess, actually, is not. Yet the Arsenal supporters claiming it's all that unlikely are foolish. It's below 50/50...but not remote.
As big of a United fan as I am, I'd like to take haven up on his guarantee that Arse and Chelsea will drop 9 points...
Plus, I would argue that the emergence of Chelsea makes it more likely for Arse to drop points. And more likely for Chelsea to drop points. 6 games instead of 4 games. And it's not like Liverpool's let their foot off the gas, either.
Can you come back? Yes, its possible. The teams and depth are totally different. If you're goin to compare Newcastle to this years clubs then...what can I say...you can have your opinions. '03, we had massive injuries in the 2nd half of the season. It will sound like sour grapes to some. I accept that but its true. We lost Vieira to injury, our back line which was the shakiest part of our club lost every one to injury or suspension (Sol, Keown, Lauren at times) and we had to rely on Cygan and Luzhny. I'll tell you what. I won't use the Cygan and Luzhny excuse if you don't use the Rio was out excuse for last seasons' collapse. Deal?
As I said in my post, we'll see how you do against Pompey and the upcoming couple weeks. We could slip, I conceded that. Chelsea could as well, you guys can go on a run. You haven't figured out how to beat the 'new' Chelsea as well, so I'd worry about points dropped to them. Here is the problem. The top clubs will take points off each other. That's a given. The trick is who will drop the least to the rest of the league and so far you have not shown good form against the rest of the league (bottom 14 or 15 clubs outside the CL qualifying clubs). You may do it...or may not. We'll see. You didn't last year, you may this year. You're struggling early, far more than last year. Its pretty much more of the same from the 2nd half of the season last year. I hear the injury excuse coming up in some posts to your form. If you're going to use it, then its only fair to say you won in '03 because of massive Arsenal injuries to their club, especially the backline. Unless you concede that then don't use the injury excuse for the early season bad form.
Massive being Sol? what the hell are you on about... we missed 9 first team players already this season... you don't think that messes with chemistry? My god you are insane. That new chelsea beat a manu side with 5 starters in it 1-0... big deal. I concede that we don't have form yet, but the team is coming together and getting a string of games with similar personel is helping/going to help us find the form we need. What gets me the most about you is that you believe a club has to slip to drop say 12 points or so in 28 matches... this streak has made some people over confident and prideful... oh well, you know what they say - pride cometh before the fall... last year amongst treble chatter you got knocked out of 2 competitions in 4 days so feel free to be overconfident.
Ok, whatcha wanna wager? Each of those teams will drop at least 9 points (in any form, draws or losses).
It is indeed the question but it's nothing like the massive task you seem to think. The difference is 6 points and 8 not 16 and 18. It is within Utd's power to repeat the Arsenal defeat here at OT over Chelsea and then that particular difference is down to just 3 points - one match! They also play Arsenal again and that gives them to opportunity to reduce that difference to 5 points - just one win and one draw. Hell, both teams could be overcome in just three matches. No, of course that isn't going to happen, but the idea that these differences can only be picked up over 28 matches by either Utd going on a spectacular run or both Arsenal and Chelsea suffering a collapse is idiotic. Arsenal lost 24 points in an excellent season last year. If they match that this season then they still have 19 points to lose. Not only will I take on a bet that both Arsenal and Chelsea will lose 9 points each over the remainder of this seaon I'll give you 5 to one odds on it